Marzen/Octoberfest type beer advice

[giraffe]

So I got a request to make an octoberfest beer (im going to assume he means the orange marzen beer, and not a modern fest beer) , and strangely, even though Ive done a gazillion lagers, Ive never actually made one. So I thought Id ask on here:

1: To add 60Lish crystal of some type, or not. There seems to be disagreement.

2: I have the harvested modelo yeast (940) and the Ayinger yeast (833) on hand. 833 would seem an obvious choice, but the 940 attenuates drier and is closer to the 34/70 I keep see people using.

3. Do I bother with any finishing hops?

4. Water/mash PH, my basic plan is just to add enough calcium chloride to hit a 5.3 mash ph and call it done. (my tap water is exceptionally soft and near RO)

5. Does this look sane/any other advice:

14P/1.057

30% Weyermann Flr Mlt Bo Pilsner
30% Weyermann Flr Mlt Bo Dark (9L munich)
40% Weyermann Vienna (or maybe MFB Special Aromatic which is like a 5L Vienna)

Mash 131-152 5.3 Mash ph.

28 IBU total

Warrior for a 60 min bittering charge
Maybe a 1/2 oz to ounce of liberty at 20 min from end of boil.

Ferment with 940 at 50 degrees F.

 

[MrE_the_Great]

Looks good to me. You have the three Munich, Pilsner, Vienna. Very similar percentages to the last Marzen I brewed.

I didn't use finishing hops in my last Marzen batch and I was happy with the result. I used 838 because LHBS had it half off.

 

[MrVix]

The BJCP judges dingered me for late hop additions stating that hop aroma should not be present in this style beer. They praised the malt character and the dry finish. So I would stick to German malts and refrain from adding carmel/crystal malt as this would add a sweetness unwanted in this style. I mash around 149-150 to keep it dry and crisp. I use a Hallertua/Tettnanger mix at 60 minutes and 20 minutes. Although my favorite versions I used Polaris . The IBU's shouldn't exceed 28. I think a diacetyl rest is very important. You do not want any fruitiness. I have used many yeasts over the years but Wyeast Octoberfest Lager yeast and White Labs WLP820 are both very good.

 

[adamg8504]

I just made my first oktoberfest yesterday. Actually getting ready to go pitch the yeast this morning, since I could only cool to around 65f with my coil. My recipe went like this.

5.5 Gal batch

4lb munich
3.5 vienna
3.5 pilsner
.25 melanodian
.25 caramunich I

1.25 Hallertau at 60min
.75 Hallertau at 20min

And I'm fermenting with a big pitch of 2124 harvested from a local brewery's oktoberfest (Thirsty Dog in Akron, Oh)

I only did a single infusion mash at 151 since I don't have the capability to do a stepped mash. Hit about 1.054 og.

 

[wobdee]

Looks good. My Ofest is usually 50/50 Pils/dark Munich and just a touch of caramunich to get that nice amber orange color. I also like a small flavor hop addition around 15 min to balance out the malt.

 

[TastyAdventure]

I figure I'd piggy back off this thread. I was looking for feedback on my "poor man's Octoberfest " recipe.
I'm using 2 row bc it's cheap, pils for some crispness, caramunich for malty sweetness Munich flavor, caravienne for malty toasty Vienna flavor, aromatic for more maltyness to make up for the fact that there's hardly any Munich base malt, same for the Biscuit malt and the lack of Vienna base malt. Special B for some color. I will double decoct this:
51% 2 row
29% pils
5% Munich
4% caramunich
4% caravienne
4% biscuit
4% aromatic
<1% special B

Is my thinking adding up here?

 

[BigEd]

So I got a request to make an octoberfest beer (im going to assume he means the orange marzen beer, and not a modern fest beer) , and strangely, even though Ive done a gazillion lagers, Ive never actually made one. So I thought Id ask on here:

1: To add 60Lish crystal of some type, or not. There seems to be disagreement.

2: I have the harvested modelo yeast (940) and the Ayinger yeast (833) on hand. 833 would seem an obvious choice, but the 940 attenuates drier and is closer to the 34/70 I keep see people using.

3. Do I bother with any finishing hops?

4. Water/mash PH, my basic plan is just to add enough calcium chloride to hit a 5.3 mash ph and call it done. (my tap water is exceptionally soft and near RO)

5. Does this look sane/any other advice:

14P/1.057

30% Weyermann Flr Mlt Bo Pilsner
30% Weyermann Flr Mlt Bo Dark (9L munich)
40% Weyermann Vienna (or maybe MFB Special Aromatic which is like a 5L Vienna)

Mash 131-152 5.3 Mash ph.

28 IBU total

Warrior for a 60 min bittering charge
Maybe a 1/2 oz to ounce of liberty at 20 min from end of boil.

Ferment with 940 at 50 degrees F.

I'm a little late to this thread but here goes.

1) No. Eschew the temptation to add crystal malt. Lots of dark Munich is the way to go here.

2) Either would be fine. The 940 seems to scare people away because it's a "Mexican Lager" yeast and everyone thinks of something like Corona when Mexican beer is mentioned. 940 is a great lager yeast and will work very nicely in an Oktoberfest or Vienna.

3) No. Late hops are not necessary and frankly unwanted here. Malt is the star of the show in this style. Either a single first addition or a small second addition @ ~30 minutes (which I favor) are the way to go.

4) CaCl2 is all you need IMO, especially with a start of very soft water. Get the Ca+ up to 60-75ppm and let it roll.

5) More Munich II; Try about 70% Munich II and 30% pils. Small amounts of Vienna and/or CaraFoam/CaraPils are optional. The OG looks good, I'd cut the IBUs just a tad, maybe 24 or so and drop the mash temps a couple of degrees with a main rest of 148/149F. I'm a decoction advocate with this type of beer but you can get by with a simple mash.