Man, I love Apfelwein

[dave8274]

Mine's been in the fermenter 6 weeks now, still no clearing. Pretty much looks the same is it did 3 weeks ago, back to the color of Apple Juice but can't see through the carboy.

 

[Leadgolem]

Mine's been in the fermenter 6 weeks now, still no clearing. Pretty much looks the same is it did 3 weeks ago, back to the color of Apple Juice but can't see through the carboy.

If that's important to you, pick up some pectin enzyme. You probably have pectin haze. The directions say to use it before fermentation, it will still work after it just takes a few days instead of an hour.

 

[dave8274]

If that's important to you, pick up some pectin enzyme. You probably have pectin haze. The directions say to use it before fermentation, it will still work after it just takes a few days instead of an hour.

I'm assuming that it just isn't done. Last I checked, the SG was still 1.006

 

[munro]

First batch is at .996 after 6 and a half weeks. Tastes pretty good. Going to carbonate it. Thinking maybe bottling so it will age more and not tie up a keg. Have my 2nd batch in as of last night. Sorry how do you back sweeten? Lactose?

 

[munro]

Also I had to use Lalvin ec 1118 yeast. No one at my lhbs had even heard of Montrachet yeast or w/e it was

 

[jstampler]

Mine's been in the fermenter 6 weeks now, still no clearing. Pretty much looks the same is it did 3 weeks ago, back to the color of Apple Juice but can't see through the carboy.

Why not add something to clarify it? I added Super-Kleer to mine after 6 weeks and a week later it cleared right up and I bottle a week after that.

 

[munro]

First batch is at .996 after 6 and a half weeks. Tastes pretty good. Going to carbonate it. Thinking maybe bottling so it will age more and not tie up a keg. Have my 2nd batch in as of last night. Big difference between regular and back sweetened?

 

[jstampler]

I just walked into my brew room where my Apfelwein is bubbling like crazy. I farted and the room instantly smelled better.

 

[Kdog22]

To be honest, I followed the recipe to the T and I thought my brew close smelled just like fermenting apple. In a good way. Nothing smelled bad at all.

 

[keahunter]

This probably has been answered here but i don't have a 5 gal carboy, only 6.5 gal. Do I make the recipe for a 5 gal and not worry about the extra headspace or do I have to up the ingredients for 6.5 gal?

 

[jstampler]

This probably has been answered here but i don't have a 5 gal carboy, only 6.5 gal. Do I make the recipe for a 5 gal and not worry about the extra headspace or do I have to up the ingredients for 6.5 gal?

I used a 6.5 gallon carboy and left the space without a problem and I think a lot of people did the same. My second batch that's going right now I threw in an extra 3/4 gallon of juice and a half pound or so more dextrose.

 

[dave8274]

Just took a hydrometer sample, and my apfelwein is at 1.006. Isn't that unusual at 5 weeks? It's been in the basement at a constant ~68-71 degrees. Wait longer, or even possibly repitch yeast?

11 days later, after I moved it upstairs to a slightly warmer room. Now at over 6 weeks since pitching, and still at 1.006. Not sure what to do from here.

 

[TexasWine]

11 days later, after I moved it upstairs to a slightly warmer room. Now at over 6 weeks since pitching, and still at 1.006. Not sure what to do from here.

Taste it. If you like what you've got, proceed as usual. If not, repitch.

 

[dave8274]

Taste it. If you like what you've got, proceed as usual. If not, repitch.

I actually did taste the hydrometer sample, and it tasted really good, though slightly sweet. Proceeding for me would mean bottling, and I would worry about bottle bombs.

When I moved it upstairs a couple weeks ago, I gave the yeast at the bottom a good stir, but it doesn't seem to have changed anything. I suppose I could try re-pitching, I do have some Montrachet in the fridge. I wonder what happened though, it fermented a a pretty rock solid 68-70 degrees in the furnace room and seemed to bubble pretty vigorously for a while at first.

 

[keahunter]

I used a 6.5 gallon carboy and left the space without a problem and I think a lot of people did the same. My second batch that's going right now I threw in an extra 3/4 gallon of juice and a half pound or so more dextrose.

Thanks jstampler! Can't wait to get this started

 

[TexasWine]

I actually did taste the hydrometer sample, and it tasted really good, though slightly sweet. Proceeding for me would mean bottling, and I would worry about bottle bombs.

When I moved it upstairs a couple weeks ago, I gave the yeast at the bottom a good stir, but it doesn't seem to have changed anything. I suppose I could try re-pitching, I do have some Montrachet in the fridge. I wonder what happened though, it fermented a a pretty rock solid 68-70 degrees in the furnace room and seemed to bubble pretty vigorously for a while at first.

I agree. It's odd that it stopped. But it sounds like you've given it every chance to start back up. I wouldn't be too concerned about bottle bombs. But if it causes you to lose sleep, you could always pasteurize per the sticky in the cider forum.

 

[Leadgolem]

I agree. It's odd that it stopped. But it sounds like you've given it every chance to start back up. I wouldn't be too concerned about bottle bombs. But if it causes you to lose sleep, you could always pasteurize per the sticky in the cider forum.

That's exactly what I was going to recommend. If you don't mind the sweetness, bottle and then bottle pasteurize.

Montrachet does have a reputation for stalling out mysteriously occasionally. If you want it to finish dry, I'd repitch with a different strain. Champagne is good for that if you want it dry. It tends to chomp through anything remotely fermentable.

 

[dave8274]

I could try some different yeast, I definitely want it dry. Is there any possibility it's just slower because it fermented a little cooler, or is that unlikely since SG hasn't changed at all in 11 days?

What's weird is I have another carbohydrate in the basement that started a few days later. I haven't checked gravity, but it isn't clearing either.

By the way, I also didn't really have any sulfer smells during early fermentation that others have described.

 

[Leadgolem]

I could try some different yeast, I definitely want it dry. Is there any possibility it's just slower because it fermented a little cooler, or is that unlikely since SG hasn't changed at all in 11 days?

What's weird is I have another carbohydrate in the basement that started a few days later. I haven't checked gravity, but it isn't clearing either.

By the way, I also didn't really have any sulfer smells during early fermentation that others have described.

If it hasn't changed in 11 days, then it's probably not going to.

The sulfur smell is a nutrient deficiency thing, usually in combination with somewhat warm fermentation temps. Some batches of juice have better nutrient contents, plus it's much less of a problem fermenting cool. So the lack of that smell is probably more due to the temperature, and really that's a good thing. Your apfelwein will probably be fantastic, lower temps also mean fewer fusel alcohols.

You know, I really think you have pectin haze. Pectin is a water soluble carbohydrate, so it very well could be contributing to the gravity reading without actually being fermentable. About 3/4 of the commercial juice on the market is cleared by treating the juice with pectin enzyme. That last quarter is cleared by running the juice through a centrifuge to remove the particulates. That process removed the particulates and clears the juice, but it leave the actual pectin intact. So, if you ferment it, you get particulates stuck in it again. You will also get gravity readings that are a little high as some of what you are measuring is non-fermentable carbohydrate.

If it was mine and I wanted it dry, I'd mix a little pectin enzyme in and sprinkle a packet of champagne on top. Be careful if you decide to do that, you could end up with an apfelwein geyser from the dissolved co2...That reminds me, it wouldn't hurt to degass it. It's much more common to do that in mead, but reducing the dissolved co2 might get things going again too.

 

[adiochiro3]

I started my first batch this evening. 3 gallons with Wyeast cider yeast. The clock is ticking!

 

[dave8274]

If it hasn't changed in 11 days, then it's probably not going to.

The sulfur smell is a nutrient deficiency thing, usually in combination with somewhat warm fermentation temps. Some batches of juice have better nutrient contents, plus it's much less of a problem fermenting cool. So the lack of that smell is probably more due to the temperature, and really that's a good thing. Your apfelwein will probably be fantastic, lower temps also mean fewer fusel alcohols.

You know, I really think you have pectin haze. Pectin is a water soluble carbohydrate, so it very well could be contributing to the gravity reading without actually being fermentable. About 3/4 of the commercial juice on the market is cleared by treating the juice with pectin enzyme. That last quarter is cleared by running the juice through a centrifuge to remove the particulates. That process removed the particulates and clears the juice, but it leave the actual pectin intact. So, if you ferment it, you get particulates stuck in it again. You will also get gravity readings that are a little high as some of what you are measuring is non-fermentable carbohydrate.

If it was mine and I wanted it dry, I'd mix a little pectin enzyme in and sprinkle a packet of champagne on top. Be careful if you decide to do that, you could end up with an apfelwein geyser from the dissolved co2...That reminds me, it wouldn't hurt to degass it. It's much more common to do that in mead, but reducing the dissolved co2 might get things going again too.

I used Tree-top just as the OP said, but on the label it did show a something like 31g of Carbs and 28g of sugar, so maybe that's the issue?

I'll try these suggestions. I actually have a drill mounted degassing wand because we just made a wine kit.

Edit: I just went ahead and degassed it. I got quite a geyser, but I think I got most of the CO2 out. I'll go grab some pectic enzyme and yeast when the LHBS is open later, any idea how much enzyme I should use, and should I wait a few days to do this now that I have degassed??

Also, will the champagne yeast change the taste of the final product?

 

[Kdog22]

Champagne yeast will probably change the flavor, compared to the original recipe. But this is suppose to finish dry anyways..

 

[dave8274]

Champagne yeast will probably change the flavor, compared to the original recipe. But this is suppose to finish dry anyways..

Hmm, any reason I shouldn't just use a fresh packet of Montrachet then?

 

[gregblatz]

Hello all,
I've made this many times but I have never used fruit until recently.

I simply went with 2.5gal apple juice with 1 can of Oregon Fruit blackberries.
Montrachet
OG - 1046

My Question:
Can I leave the fruit in until bottling or should I remove the fruit once the fermentation settles down.

Anyone do something similar? How were your results?

 

[keahunter]

Anyone use kmeta before bottling so that it keeps? how long will it keep without it?

 

[dave8274]

That reminds me, it wouldn't hurt to degass it. It's much more common to do that in mead, but reducing the dissolved co2 might get things going again too.

So my degassing this morning completely stirred up the lees, and now I have a cloudy carboy that resembles orange juice. Hopefully this will settle out and not hurt anything?

 

[Tulpa]

Well, I just bottled my first batch yesterday after 4 weeks. Sampled a gallon of it with my friend last night and didn't have any hangover to speak of. Drank it with a small splash of sierra mist in each glass. I just ordered more montrachet yeast to make some more. Think I'll add 3-3.5 pounds of sugar to this next batch.

 

[Leadgolem]

I used Tree-top just as the OP said, but on the label it did show a something like 31g of Carbs and 28g of sugar, so maybe that's the issue?

I'll try these suggestions. I actually have a drill mounted degassing wand because we just made a wine kit.

Edit: I just went ahead and degassed it. I got quite a geyser, but I think I got most of the CO2 out. I'll go grab some pectic enzyme and yeast when the LHBS is open later, any idea how much enzyme I should use, and should I wait a few days to do this now that I have degassed??

Also, will the champagne yeast change the taste of the final product?

No need to wait before adding the pectin enzyme. Just follow the directions on it for juice.

Champagne yeast will probably change the flavor, compared to the original recipe. But this is suppose to finish dry anyways..

True, but this batch is probably down to it's last 0.012 of gravity. So it's not going to actually ferment enough of the total batch to throw things off much. In addition, both strains are commonly used in white wine making. I have found that they aren't all that different in flavor profiles even when used in exclusion.

Hmm, any reason I shouldn't just use a fresh packet of Montrachet then?

Only that if I'm wrong about why your batch stalled the montrachet may stall out again. The champagne yeast probably won't.

So my degassing this morning completely stirred up the lees, and now I have a cloudy carboy that resembles orange juice. Hopefully this will settle out and not hurt anything?

It won't hurt anything, you'll just have to wait for it to settle again. If your in a hurry for some reason you could pick up some bentonite powder or another fining agent while you're at the LHBS.

 

[dave8274]

Cool, thanks for the help. No hurry, was just worried that the dormant yeast getting mixed in could cause a problem.

The pectic enzyme mixed right into the carboy that had been degassed with no problems . I made a bit of a mistake and went ahead and added to another couple of batches that I had in the basement that I didn't degas, and made a bit of a mess didn't realize adding it to something with C02 in suspension made a volcano.

I bought a couple packets of champagne yeast and am going to try it out to see if fermentation starts up again.

 

[Leadgolem]

Cool, thanks for the help. No hurry, was just worried that the dormant yeast getting mixed in could cause a problem.

The pectic enzyme mixed right into the carboy that had been degassed with no problems . I made a bit of a mistake and went ahead and added to another couple of batches that I had in the basement that I didn't degas, and made a bit of a mess didn't realize adding it to something with C02 in suspension made a volcano.

I bought a couple packets of champagne yeast and am going to try it out to see if fermentation starts up again.

Yeah, it's all the dissolved co2. Any powder you add to a batch that's close to saturation with co2 is going to cause it to foam like crazy. You are adding an enormous number of nucleation points. It's sort of the same principle of serving beer or sparkling wine in a glass that's super clean to keep it from going flat to fast.