Making Traditional rice Wine. Cheap, Fun, and Different

[sublxed]

So I finally made this, it was or is awesome. 6 cups of sweet rice and chinese yeast/mold balls made enough for 3 16 oz bottles. They are now fining and clearing in the fridge. Also they are very good.

 

[brewit75]

I personally don't think the results of this taste much like stereotypical sake or nigori, at least the cheap ones that I have generally drank, if that's what you're going for. My results with this recipe, when successful, have tasted much better than sake to me. It smells a lot like sake, but taste wise, I would say it's sweeter with more body and a slight tartness that I really like. Very drinkable on its own like a wine, which I never found to be the case with sake for some reason.

Agreed. Although it smells very much like sake, the taste of the end product using jasmine rice and yeast balls is much better than the sake I've had. Although, the sake I'm used to is the kind found at sushi restaurants. To me, it kinda tastes like warm dirty dish water.

This stuff (the recipe in this thread) has a much better taste. And, best of all, it's wine that you can drink 21-28 days after you brew it. Almost unheard of when brewing any alcoholic drink that isn't beer.

 

[madwilliamflint]

I've got 10 cups (dry) of rice going in a 2g brew bucket. I haven't taken the lid off it to check progress yet, which is killing me. I need to put it in a closet or something so I'm not staring at the opaque container lustfully.

 

[brewit75]

This is a very good article for people who are new to making rice wine. In fact, it's good for people who are experienced in making rice wine. Well done job by the author.

And, there's a link for buying Yeast Balls on eBay. Very cool indeed.

www.byjovericewine.com/blog/2017/2/22/how-to-make-a-rice-wine-kit-for-under-20

 

[eigua]

This is a very good article for people who are new to making rice wine. In fact, it's good for people who are experienced in making rice wine. Well done job by the author.

And, there's a link for buying Yeast Balls on eBay. Very cool indeed.

www.byjovericewine.com/blog/2017/2/22/how-to-make-a-rice-wine-kit-for-under-20

Did you by any chance mean this article? (Linked from the one you posted.)

Right off the bat, the article gets a major point dead wrong:

What rice to choose?
If you’re reading this guide, then you probably have never brewed rice wine before. In which case, you probably don’t need to go out and buy some super fancy expensive rice made exclusively for Sake brewers. Unlike grape wine, the kind of rice you use does not impact the flavor of the wine very much. So it really doesn’t matter what kind of rice you buy (unless you’re some Sake aficionado who has a palate that can identify minute differences between wine). You can use any kind of rice; brown or white; sweet rice or regular rice; it really doesn’t matter.

As I and many others in this thread who have done experiments with types of rice can attest, the type of rice you choose absolutely does matter greatly and will determine the final taste, the yield, and the alcohol content.

For example, here is an experiment @Leadgolem did a while back:

Initial Post
Results
Tasting Notes

 

[BeeDeeEff]

I liked my first batch of this stuff so much I went ahead and started another one last night. Will be taking more pictures this time around to show the process day by day as I've not seen many examples for others to know what to expect.

Saving my sole full bottle from my first batch to age until the second is finished, would love to see how they compare:

 

[madwilliamflint]

Nice! I'm running my batches in opaque containers so there's really nothing to see. But I was pretty alarmed at how...well...gross it looks mid-process.

Still waiting for my first batch in years to be ready. Fortunately it'll only be a few more weeks.

 

[IrishBrewer420]

Nice! I'm running my batches in opaque containers so there's really nothing to see. But I was pretty alarmed at how...well...gross it looks mid-process.

Still waiting for my first batch in years to be ready. Fortunately it'll only be a few more weeks.

Don't worry about it looking gross mid-process, that's totally normal. Actually, I'd worry if it DIDN'T look gross. Same thing with regular beer, when I check on it a few days in it usually resembles a swamp.

 

[brewit75]

Did you by any chance mean this article? (Linked from the one you posted.)

Right off the bat, the article gets a major point dead wrong:



As I and many others in this thread who have done experiments with types of rice can attest, the type of rice you choose absolutely does matter greatly and will determine the final taste, the yield, and the alcohol content.

For example, here is an experiment @Leadgolem did a while back:

Initial Post
Results
Tasting Notes

Good point on the choice of rice. I was referring more to the process and equipment.

 

[brewit75]

I liked my first batch of this stuff so much I went ahead and started another one last night. Will be taking more pictures this time around to show the process day by day as I've not seen many examples for others to know what to expect.

Saving my sole full bottle from my first batch to age until the second is finished, would love to see how they compare:

Very cool. Still can't get over how clear that bottle of wine is. Any pictures of the process?

 

[BeeDeeEff]

Very cool. Still can't get over how clear that bottle of wine is. Any pictures of the process?

I don't want to flood this thread with day-by-day pictures in multiple posts, but I'll be putting them all together in one composite image. So far haven't missed a day.

As for the clarity, all I ever did was whatever one else does, strain through a cloth. But then I let it re-settle a second time and a clear layer formed on top and I left everything else behind, which resulted in rather substantial losses (~30% liquid lost).

But here are days 0 through 5, you can see in some pocket liquid forming, but can really notice the volume drop in the container.

 

[BeeDeeEff]

Did you by any chance mean this article? (Linked from the one you posted.)

Right off the bat, the article gets a major point dead wrong:



As I and many others in this thread who have done experiments with types of rice can attest, the type of rice you choose absolutely does matter greatly and will determine the final taste, the yield, and the alcohol content.

For example, here is an experiment @Leadgolem did a while back:

Initial Post
Results
Tasting Notes

Just to put it out there as well, there are likely more variables involved, for when I used blue ribbon long-grain rice straight from cost-co I've gotten substantially higher conversion ratio, closer to 60%. Though I did let it go for a bit over to 2 months rather than just 3 weeks.

Also, no presoak, rinsed before cooking, 2:1 dry rice to water ratio, brought to boil, simmered 20 min, let cool in pot, straight into jar with crushed rice balls in layers. Treated it same as I could if I intended to eat the rice, super simple.

My progress was in these posts (note I said jasmine rice in posts below, but was wrong):
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7854888#post7854888
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7927467#post7927467
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7945140#post7945140

Wound up with ~1 liter of crystal clear rice wine, very neutral flavor.

 

[eigua]

I don't want to flood this thread with day-by-day pictures in multiple posts, but I'll be putting them all together in one composite image. So far haven't missed a day.

Just a warning: The rice tends to float up by a significant amount as it liquefies. I lost quite a bit of liquid when the mass floated up and forced the liquid to overflow. I don't fill my jars past half-way up now because of this. It doesn't happen every time, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

 

[eigua]

Just to put it out there as well, there are likely more variables involved, for when I used blue ribbon long-grain rice straight from cost-co I've gotten substantially higher conversion ratio, closer to 60%. Though I did let it go for a bit over to 2 months rather than just 3 weeks.

Also, no presoak, rinsed before cooking, 2:1 dry rice to water ratio, brought to boil, simmered 20 min, let cool in pot, straight into jar with crushed rice balls in layers. Treated it same as I could if I intended to eat the rice, super simple.

My progress was in these posts (note I said jasmine rice in posts below, but was wrong):
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7854888#post7854888
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7927467#post7927467
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7945140#post7945140

Wound up with ~1 liter of crystal clear rice wine, very neutral flavor.

That's very interesting and warrants further experimentation. The only time I got significant conversion was when I also added 1/4 cup of RYR. The flavor was still not very good compared to jasmine or glutinous rice. (Dry and slightly bitter with a bit of fruitiness from the RYR.)

That you used long-grain rice may explain why you got a neutral flavor. When you first made that post where you said it was the closest thing to a flavorless alcoholic beverage, I was kind of confused since you said you used jasmine. My results from long-grain were quite bland apart from some sourness and slight bitterness. I think you would find the taste produced by jasmine rice quite a bit more flavorful. I also found my results with long-grain to be relatively low alcohol. When you drank yours, did you feel it was equivalent to wine/sake in alcohol content?

I do know that my experiments with cooking methods definitely did make an impact on liquid volume. Cooking in a rice cooker yielded quite a bit more liquid than steaming. I chalk that up to increased water content, not increased conversion.

I'm wondering if the yeast balls used had a significant impact on the conversion ratio. You used a different brand than I did. Mine are made by Hang Hing Marine Products Co. in China.

 

[BeeDeeEff]

The flavor was still not very good compared to jasmine or glutinous rice. (Dry and slightly bitter with a bit of fruitiness from the RYR.)

That you used long-grain rice may explain why you got a neutral flavor. When you first made that post where you said it was the closest thing to a flavorless alcoholic beverage, I was kind of confused since you said you used jasmine. My results from long-grain were quite bland apart from some sourness and slight bitterness. I think you would find the taste produced by jasmine rice quite a bit more flavorful. I also found my results with long-grain to be relatively low alcohol. When you drank yours, did you feel it was equivalent to wine/sake in alcohol content?

Did you rack off only the clear? or drink it with solids left in? I can't say I know what mine would've tasted like if I drank it milky white because I just didn't try it like that. And I wonder how much of the difference in flavors between different rices would go away if all that was kept from each batch was the clear.

The flavor I would put very similar to a bone dry sake, made it very refreshing. If I had to guess I would put the alch% probably around 18%? Definitely hit harder than the store-bought Sayuri Sake, Junmai Hakutsuru (15%) that I was used to drinking, so it could've been up to 20%.

It had no sourness or bitterness at all, some people say that flavors like that occur when fermenting at too high a temp and I kept mine in a relatively cool part of my home. Other thing I noticed is that not many other people are using airlocks.

At the end of it all I have to remember that I have a sample size of 1 currently, my first batch, my second one is in progress....we'll see if I get similar results or if I lucked out and got a good product as a fluke. Lots of variables are going on in this thread between each person's ingredients and procedure, would be hard to control for all of em.

As a side note, I have to get more of these wide-mouth 1-gallon jars. They seem really suited to purpose for this process, and now I want to experiment with different types of rice, and maybe the artificial conversion and packet yeasts.

 

[eigua]

Did you rack off only the clear? or drink it with solids left in?

I didn't rack, but it settled for months before I drank it. Initially, I poured off only clear liquid, but later glasses were very much filled with sediment until the last ones were thick. The sediment does change the flavor making it taste more like the rice that was used and it changes the mouth feel, but generally the flavor was somewhat similar both ways.

The flavor I would put very similar to a bone dry sake, made it very refreshing. If I had to guess I would put the alch% probably around 18%? Definitely hit harder than the store-bought Sayuri Sake, Junmai Hakutsuru (15%) that I was used to drinking, so it could've been up to 20%.

Wow, quite a stark contrast with my results. Mine were rather low alcohol. I've never had a bone dry sake before. The last time I had sake was Gekkeikan (cheap stuff) which I would describe as mildly sweet with a melon-like flavor. I'll have to get some more long-grain rice at Costco next time and some different yeast balls and try again. I'm gonna be set on rice until doomsday with a 50 lb bag of jasmine rice, a 20 lb bag of brown rice, and 25 lb bag of Blue Ribbon long-grain rice. :smack:

It had no sourness or bitterness at all, some people say that flavors like that occur when fermenting at too high a temp and I kept mine in a relatively cool part of my home. Other thing I noticed is that not many other people are using airlocks.

I actually like the subtle tartness in my results. My house is generally in the 60's most of the year (San Francisco), so I don't think temp would have been an issue. I'm sure some of it is just due to the natural bacteria/yeasts floating around and/or in the yeast balls. As for air locks, @chonas who has done a bunch of experimentation has reported that lack of oxygen during the fungus growing stage contributes to more sourness. He's also said excess water can cause it to.

I wonder what the final PH of yours is since you say it's got no sourness. A while back I was concerned about the possibility of botulism being able to grow during the fermentation phase due to too low acidity (and low oxygen due to the fact that yeast use it up) so I tested the PH of my batch and it was <= 4.0, so no problems there. I've never read anything about botulism in rice wine, but I just wanted to be safe knowing that pretty much anything from the ground has the potential to have botulinum spores.

and now I want to experiment with different types of rice, and maybe the artificial conversion and packet yeasts.

Me too. I've done experiments with long-grain, jasmine, glutinous, and glutinous rice flour. From my results, the best taste and highest alcohol yield was achieved with mostly jasmine with a bit of glutinous mixed in cooked wet in a rice cooker. (I feel like a little extra water helps it vs steaming the rice.) I'm really interested in trying ARL though.

 

[madwilliamflint]

Good grief. You guys are taking this to a higher level. I wouldn't have known what to even bother trying to measure. I'm going to have to take a good look at my processes and buy a bunch more yeast balls and a few 2g brew buckets.

 

[sarthak]

Hey! I have made this wine once before in winters. An I make this at a temp of 25-27c? I have arl and ec 1118 or Cotè Des Blanc.

 

[FatDragon]

Hey! I have made this wine once before in winters. An I make this at a temp of 25-27c? I have arl and ec 1118 or Cotè Des Blanc.

Gotta use the ARL. ARL isn't just yeast, it also contains fungi that break down the starch in the rice into simple sugars that the yeast can ferment. You might get slightly different fermentation character if you add a wine yeast in addition to ARL, but it's certainly not necessary.

25-27C is totally okay, temperature-wise.

 

[BeeDeeEff]

Hey! I have made this wine once before in winters. An I make this at a temp of 25-27c? I have arl and ec 1118 or Cotè Des Blanc.

Others in this thread have had a higher chance of going sour/vinegary in higher temperatures, so be careful with the amount of oxygen you allow in after its fermenting.

Most success is had around cooler temps of 15°C to 20°C (or in the 60's °F or even lwoer)

 

[JoshMcMadMac]

I've got 10 cups (dry) of rice going in a 2g brew bucket. I haven't taken the lid off it to check progress yet, which is killing me. I need to put it in a closet or something so I'm not staring at the opaque container lustfully.

How did you efficiently cook and cool 10 cups of rice? I took this approach last night, and it took forever.
How many yeast balls did you use?

 

[user 211287]

How did you efficiently cook and cool 10 cups of rice? I took this approach last night, and it took forever.
How many yeast balls did you use?

Aroma Housewares 20 Cup Cooked (10 cup uncooked) Digital Rice Cooker, Slow Cooker, Food Steamer, SS Exterior (ARC-150SB) Around $40 on Amazon or Walmart.

I cool my rice is a huge stainless bowl covered in a towel or just let it set in the cooker overnight.

 

[JoshMcMadMac]

Aroma Housewares 20 Cup Cooked (10 cup uncooked) Digital Rice Cooker, Slow Cooker, Food Steamer, SS Exterior (ARC-150SB) Around $40 on Amazon or Walmart.

I cool my rice is a huge stainless bowl covered in a towel or just let it set in the cooker overnight.

Awesome, thanks! I just snagged one off of Amazon for ~$30; that will be a lot easier next time, as my little Aroma took one look at the 5lb bag and scurried back into the cupboard.

I only used three yeast balls, and am thinking I should add another one (or more?) today. How many did you use for ten cups?

 

[user 211287]

I normally used 1 ball per 2cups of dry rice BUT i usually added some red yeast rice too. Its been awhile since i used them but IIRC that is correct.

 

[madwilliamflint]

How did you efficiently cook and cool 10 cups of rice? I took this approach last night, and it took forever.
How many yeast balls did you use?

Well... "efficiently" isn't the word I'd use.

BUT

I used a 22qt pasta/lobster pot to cook the rice in one go. Didn't take any longer than cooking any other qty of rice.

I only used that because I left my rice cooker behind when I moved to Nashville. That thing was gold and cooked rice perfectly every time.

Cooling it was a headache. What I ended up doing was spooning it out and flattening it (more or less) on a cookie sheet while I went and did other stuff with my evening.

I MAY have overdone it on the yeast balls. I kept looking and couldn't seem to get a straight answer, so I used 1 per dry cup of rice. I bought a bunch from our buddy over on eBay.

I mixed it up a bit when I handled the yeast balls. The idea of "evenly distributing" crushed yeast balls in what's essentially a full 2 gallon brew bucket just seemed stupid. So I put them in the blender with about 3/4 cup of room temp water.

Once the rice was in the bucket I just poured the resulting slurry pretty evenly around the top, then took a large wooden spoon and worked it around as well as reasonable.

One batch is at exactly one month today, the other is 2 weeks old and, while I haven't cracked the top to look, this approach seems to have done wonders. When I pick either pail up by the handle and swish it around, it seems to be mostly fluid (one less so obviously.)

I might rack the first batch this weekend, see what I get. (I like it to be crystal clear, so I spend quite a long time on the clarification/reracking process.)

 

[JoshMcMadMac]

I mixed it up a bit when I handled the yeast balls. The idea of "evenly distributing" crushed yeast balls in what's essentially a full 2 gallon brew bucket just seemed stupid. So I put them in the blender with about 3/4 cup of room temp water.

Once the rice was in the bucket I just poured the resulting slurry pretty evenly around the top, then took a large wooden spoon and worked it around as well as reasonable.

That sounds like a great idea. Pounding on the yeast balls, not getting it everywhere, and layering it throughout the rice was annoying. I will definitely try it your way next time, thanks!

 

[eigua]

How did you efficiently cook and cool 10 cups of rice? I took this approach last night, and it took forever.
How many yeast balls did you use?

I just cook the rice, put it in the jar, and put it in the fridge overnight. The next day, I let it warm up, then put the yeast balls in. I suppose you could do the same without putting it in the fridge if your jar is too large for the fridge.

 

[ten80]

I mixed it up a bit when I handled the yeast balls. The idea of "evenly distributing" crushed yeast balls in what's essentially a full 2 gallon brew bucket just seemed stupid. So I put them in the blender with about 3/4 cup of room temp water.

I took a similar approach and crushed the yeast balls, then added them to a flask with some wort which I then put on a stir plate. I let it run for about a day then poured over the cooked rice. It seemed to do a nice job starting off the fermentation and distributing the yeast.

 

[madwilliamflint]

I took a similar approach and crushed the yeast balls, then added them to a flask with some wort which I then put on a stir plate. I let it run for about a day then poured over the cooked rice. It seemed to do a nice job starting off the fermentation and distributing the yeast.

That definitely sounds like a further improvement.

 

[madwilliamflint]

That sounds like a great idea. Pounding on the yeast balls, not getting it everywhere, and layering it throughout the rice was annoying. I will definitely try it your way next time, thanks!

A few years ago, when I always had some in process I did it that way. It's just too much of a pain in the neck.

I don't like the fact that this is adding water to it. But it's a pretty small price to pay over the long haul I think.