Making mash/spirits with mr. beer keg?

[Philip1993]

Well technically that's all for not, because his would be 40 proof, so you wouldn't have to cut the popov as much.

Great point. Glad you caught that!

 

[lovebeer]

this may help:
The following method is recommended by Gert Strand, in order to get optimum performance from the carbon.

• Activated carbon will work best when used in a granulated form as a filling in a filtration column using the following method.
  • Fill a tube 1.5 meters in length and at least 40 mm diameter with pre wetted granulated, activated carbon. Beware! The tube must be at least 38 mm diameter or it will introduce a "wall effect" where alcohol slips through the column without being purified. The filtration must go as slowly as possible without stopping, or the effects are much reduced. The filtration rate must not rise above approx 400ml per hour. Place one coffee cup of Norit activated carbon (0.25 to 1 mm) at the bottom of the column to reduce speed. With some carbons the speed can be higher.
  • To get achieve maximum effect from activated carbon the filtration must take place through the carbon bed without channeling, and in addition, the tube must be free of any air. To accomplish this proceed as follows;
  • Put the carbon in a bucket or kitchen pot and completely cover with 2-3 times more hot or boiling water. Mix for a minute and pour out any excess water. Repeat 4-5 times to wash out soluble material from the carbon.
  • Place filter papers in the tube. Fill the tube fill with warm water, then top up with the pre-wetted carbon so it flows into water and no air at all remains in the tube.
  • Filter 2-3 liters or more of water through the column to wash out any water soluble substances present in the carbon.
  • Start pouring the alcohol to be filtered directly "onto" the water so that no air comes into contact with the carbon in the tube. Filter all of the alcohol in one run, again to prevent any air from coming into contact with the carbon. Run about 1 liter of water through at the end of the alcohol to flush out the last of the alcohol. Taste the alcohol and stop collecting when you detect water.

thanks for the info. one question. why can't the carbon come into contact with air? all that water would dillute it a lot more.

Popov: $17.9/gal for 100 proof. Cut 4:1 for 5 gallons of horrible tasting 20proof swill. Total cost: $17.99 Total time: 5 minutes.

Your stuff: Yeast = $11.99 22# of sugar = $9.00 $20.99 for 5 gallons of horrible tasting 20proof swill. Don't forget fermenter, airlock, bottles, etc Total cost: About $50.00 Total Time: About 6 hours.


All that said, I gotta call BS. There is no logical reason to pursue this endeavor unless you're underage or you intend to distill this crap.

guy i don't know where you buy your liquor but i've never seen a gallon of popov for 17.99. a liter costs that much in some places. And if its 40% abv you'd need to buy 2.5 gallons to get the equivalent, which would cost around 50 bucks here. And i don't a fermenter, bottles or airlocks b/c i already have all of those things except an airlock which i don't need b/c i'm not carbonating it. it will cost like $20. definitely cheaper, and i can't afford to waste money, especially on alcohol.

 

[beala]

This is interesting stuff. One question, though: If I don't add any spirit flavoring, will the resulting vodka be bad? What I mean is, is the spirit flavoring required to cover up impurities?

And yeah, I've never understood the irrational hate directed toward people who want to make liquor. It's perfectly fine to inform them that it may taste bad, but personal attacks and rash assumptions about age are just out of line. Also, I doubt many of the people attacking the OP have ever actually tried the carbon filter process, so I don't know how'd they know it's a definite waste of time. The whole idea that homemade liquor is guaranteed to taste bad just seems like dogma passed around by homebrewers who, for some reason, want to hate people who experiment with liquor.

 

[CBBaron]

This is interesting stuff. One question, though: If I don't add any spirit flavoring, will the resulting vodka be bad? What I mean is, is the spirit flavoring required to cover up impurities?

And yeah, I've never understood the irrational hate directed toward people who want to make liquor. It's perfectly fine to inform them that it may taste bad, but personal attacks and rash assumptions about age are just out of line. Also, I doubt many of the people attacking the OP have ever actually tried the carbon filter process, so I don't know how'd they know it's a definite waste of time. The whole idea that homemade liquor is guaranteed to taste bad just seems like dogma passed around by homebrewers who, for some reason, want to hate people who experiment with liquor.

There is a little too much hate here for someone experimenting with liquors however the OP has indicated that he is looking for a cheap alcohol source.

Distilling does remove some impurities in addition to the water, especially if done correctly and the heads/tails are thrown out. The biggest difference between cheap vodkas and expensive ones is how careful/wasteful the distilling process is. Your undistilled spirit will have everthing still in it and so it probably will not taste very good.

You will probably get slightly better results from the yeast by targeting an alcohol level slightly below its tolerance so as to not stress it as much. An 18% ABV target should be good.

The yeast should be dry so you could split the packet into 2 batches. Just be very careful about sanitation and sealing the unused portion.

Apfelwein is an inexpensive and easy drink to make that tastes great and has had much success. I think you could even boost it to 10% ABV without much problem. I think this is a better solution for an easy alcoholic drink. And it doesn't require any flavoring to hide the taste.

Craig

 

[Tusch]

i already have all of those things except an airlock which i don't need b/c i'm not carbonating it

You don't just need an airlock to carbonate, you need it to ferment. Technically if you don't use an airlock you will only carbonate it, and turn it into a keg bomb.

But it sounds like some people have experimented with this type of "liquor" so I say go ahead and experiment. I imagine if you take all the tips to heart, such as don't completely stress the yeast, filter it when it's done and maybe use some liquor additives, you might make something decent.

Best of luck if you end up going through with it, tell us how it ends up.

 

[Philip1993]

I've never understood the irrational hate directed toward people who want to make liquor. It's perfectly fine to inform them that it may taste bad, but personal attacks and rash assumptions about age are just out of line.

There's not an irrational hate for liquor makers. I personally like the idea, but just don't have the time for another hobby.

There is, however, a general dislike of people who's only goal is to make cheap hooch. Particularly if they couldn't care less how it tastes so long as it has alcohol in it. He would have gotten much the same response if he were looking to make prison wine or 12% beer out of cane sugar.

As for the age assumptions, most of the cheap hooch makers are teenagers looking to cook up something under the bed...

 

[beala]

There is, however, a general dislike of people who's only goal is to make cheap hooch. Particularly if they couldn't care less how it tastes so long as it has alcohol in it. He would have gotten much the same response if he were looking to make prison wine or 12% beer out of cane sugar.

As for the age assumptions, most of the cheap hooch makers are teenagers looking to cook up something under the bed...

Suppose all of the above were true. Suppose he was a 14 year old just looking to make hooch. Is that good reason to dislike/hate him or even ridicule him? The only possibly sound reason is that he may be deceiving his parents, which might be good reason to dislike him, but even that is tenuous. It rests upon many unprovable assumptions. (1) Only kids make hooch (2) He lives in an area with a drinking age (3) His parents are in fact being deceived (I started homebrewing at 19. My parents knew, and didn't care). Reading the previous posts, I don't think any of those points can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. The evidence is circumstantial at best.

Second, I find it questionable that even the previous argument is sound. Does deceiving parents necessarily justify hate? Let me create an analogy to illustrate this better. Suppose there's a nation, let's call it the Nation of Beala, where it's illegal for anyone under the age of 21 to make cookies. Further suppose that there's an enterprising young man, age 14, who really really likes cookies. One day, a friend of his excitidely approaches him and exclaims that he's gotten a hold of an illegal cookie recipe. If he were to go behind his parents' back, and produce these contraband cookies, would that be seriously immoral? Further suppose that the cookies are of low quality, because he couldn't get his hands on better cookie ingredients. Would he deserve ridicule and hate for it (or even just dislike)? My intuitions say no.

The only objection I can think of to this analogy is that the idea of a cookie law is ridiculous, and that it's not at all like a drinking age, but I challenge anyone to try to make a distinction between the two. They're both arbitrary restrictions on what sorts of (mostly) harmless substances you can put into your own body.

Other clearly unsound arguments would be: (1) Making hooch somehow demeans the art of homebrewing. (2) It's off topic, because this forum doesn't deal with this subject, and therefore he deserves to be ridiculed. These, to me, are clearly unsound, and I won't even bother to address them.

 

[Yooper]

The reason underaged people are at all a concern is because it is ILLEGAL in the US to ferment if you are under the age of 21. Other countries have other laws, which we also ask you to abide by. You must attest when you sign up for HBT that you are of legal age in the country you live in. Our policy is not to assist in illegal activities, no matter if someone's parents care or not. I'm not in the business of policing other people's parenting abilities. Illegal is illegal, no matter what.

We don't have a "Hooch making forum" but I'm sure there are plenty on the internet. Google "pruno" for example. We don't have any interest on HBT to make high alcohol garbage. There are more appropriate places for that.

It has nothing to do with ridicule or hate. Let's get this back on topic, or the thread will be locked.

 

[Moonshae]

I would think that a Brita pitcher with the built-in filter would work pretty well for filtering...pour in the mess, then pour out the filtered liquid. It might take a while, and a few filters, but it would work.

I've actually heard that running cheap vodka through one of these cleans it up and makes it like premium vodkas...but haven't tried it to find out.

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

Knowledge is not illegal. What you do with that knowledge may be.

For what I know, the reason for prewetting the carbon filter is so you don't end up with fine particles of carbon powder in your final product. You run water though the filter till the black crap stops coming out, then ou filter. I guess you could let it drip dry somewhat then filter your .. beverage.

If you are doing the 5 gallon turbo yeast thing then I'd get a household carbon filter and run it through that, they are pretty cheap.

I'd also go for the liqueur flavorings. There is even a whisky flavoring. At least then it would taste better than watered down vodka.

 

[BigKahuna]

I've actually heard that running cheap vodka through one of these cleans it up and makes it like premium vodkas...but haven't tried it to find out.

I just watched the Myth Busters on that very thing.
The "Expert" vodka taster could actually rate them depending on the # of times they were filtered.

 

[lovebeer]

Suppose all of the above were true. Suppose he was a 14 year old just looking to make hooch. Is that good reason to dislike/hate him or even ridicule him? The only possibly sound reason is that he may be deceiving his parents, which might be good reason to dislike him, but even that is tenuous. It rests upon many unprovable assumptions. (1) Only kids make hooch (2) He lives in an area with a drinking age (3) His parents are in fact being deceived (I started homebrewing at 19. My parents knew, and didn't care). Reading the previous posts, I don't think any of those points can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. The evidence is circumstantial at best.

Second, I find it questionable that even the previous argument is sound. Does deceiving parents necessarily justify hate? Let me create an analogy to illustrate this better. Suppose there's a nation, let's call it the Nation of Beala, where it's illegal for anyone under the age of 21 to make cookies. Further suppose that there's an enterprising young man, age 14, who really really likes cookies. One day, a friend of his excitidely approaches him and exclaims that he's gotten a hold of an illegal cookie recipe. If he were to go behind his parents' back, and produce these contraband cookies, would that be seriously immoral? Further suppose that the cookies are of low quality, because he couldn't get his hands on better cookie ingredients. Would he deserve ridicule and hate for it (or even just dislike)? My intuitions say no.

The only objection I can think of to this analogy is that the idea of a cookie law is ridiculous, and that it's not at all like a drinking age, but I challenge anyone to try to make a distinction between the two. They're both arbitrary restrictions on what sorts of (mostly) harmless substances you can put into your own body.

Other clearly unsound arguments would be: (1) Making hooch somehow demeans the art of homebrewing. (2) It's off topic, because this forum doesn't deal with this subject, and therefore he deserves to be ridiculed. These, to me, are clearly unsound, and I won't even bother to address them.

For the record i'm 27. But you make good points. I don't understand the ridicule either. I mean why does a beverage become "cheap hooch" just because it has twice the alcohol content as beer? (even some wine has 20% Abv)

There are a whole lot of unjust laws and the drinking age is one of them in my opinion. It has nothing to do with public health. (Because why are cigarettes legal? They kill 450,000 per year in america alone) And why should we be allowed to kill in wars and own guns at 18, but not drink until we're 21? A 20 year old war vet can't even have a drink? And I'm sure everyone in this forum patiently waited until they were 21 to have a drink But i'm getting off-topic...

Knowledge is not illegal. What you do with that knowledge may be.

For what I know, the reason for prewetting the carbon filter is so you don't end up with fine particles of carbon powder in your final product. You run water though the filter till the black crap stops coming out, then ou filter. I guess you could let it drip dry somewhat then filter your .. beverage.

If you are doing the 5 gallon turbo yeast thing then I'd get a household carbon filter and run it through that, they are pretty cheap.

I'd also go for the liqueur flavorings. There is even a whisky flavoring. At least then it would taste better than watered down vodka.

But those instructions went beyond pre-wetting the carbon. It said that the carbon cannot come into contact with air while filtering, so you have to flush the carbon with water immediately before you filter. It would be hard to tell when the water stops flowing and you liquor starts flowing. I'll definitely get some of those essences. I'm not a fan of the taste of whiskey, in fact i prefer vodka. But that coconut rum flavor sounds pretty good.

Btw, That wikipedia article on distillation that someone posted said mash is normally fermented in a steel fermenter. So are people sure my mr. beer keg will work?

Also about the yeast, i've gathered it's important to keep the package airtight after using once, but why is it important to shake it? does this prevent it from becoming dormant?

I'll definitely keep people updated on the results and maybe post some pictures.

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

You are talking about mashing which is basically the same process as mashing grains for beer.

If you are going to go that route and NOT distill then why not just make some high gravity beers? It's not that hard to make a quality beer that hits 10% or more alc/vol.

 

[lovebeer]

You are talking about mashing which is basically the same process as mashing grains for beer.

If you are going to go that route and NOT distill then why not just make some high gravity beers? It's not that hard to make a quality beer that hits 10% or more alc/vol.

why make a beverage that contains 10% alcohol when i can make one that is 20% for the same price or lower? i don't think i could use this turbo yeast to make apfelwein, it would prbly taste awful due to high alc. content.

something that occured to me has got me worried. how tight should the lid be on the mr beer keg? yeast that is fermenting that much sugar is going to produce a lot of carbon dioxide, much more than beer does. i know you're never supposed to take off the keg lid during fermentation of beer b/c this can spoil it. Would this be the same for mash? The last thing i want is for my keg to explode due to pressure. should i just unscrew the lid during fermentation without taking it off to release some of the co2?

 

[CBBaron]

Btw, That wikipedia article on distillation that someone posted said mash is normally fermented in a steel fermenter. So are people sure my mr. beer keg will work?

Also about the yeast, i've gathered it's important to keep the package airtight after using once, but why is it important to shake it? does this prevent it from becoming dormant?

I'll definitely keep people updated on the results and maybe post some pictures.

Your mr beer should be good to ferment any beverage if just a little small. Many people on this forum use 6.5gal plastic buckets for fermenters. Others use glass carboys and a few lucky ones use SS conicals. I shouldn't matter what you are fermenting.

Turbo yeast is dry yeast with added nutrients which helps it ferment to those high alcohol levels. You should shake it before pouring some out to ensure it is well mixed.

You are getting lots of recommendations for producing a beverage around 10-12% ABV because you are much more likely to produce something that tastes good at those levels. When you start pushing the yeast to those really high levels you get many more undersireable byproducts that affect the flavor. The higher the alcohol content of the fermented product usually the longer it takes to age it before the flavors meld and the hot alcohols and other flavors mellow. A 5% beer is very good in a month. A 7% Apfelwein is drinkable in 2-3 months. A 12% wine at 6months to a year. When you push the beverage to 20% I would expect it to be very harsh for a couple of years or more. You would be better off making multiple batches of a smaller beer or wine.

This forum is not about producing the cheapest alcohol possible but about producing quality beers, wines and mead. Most people here are not saving money by making their own but instead are producing something they enjoy.

Craig

 

[olllllo]

And just to follow up on CBBarons post, if a poster were to say that they really liked hops- so much so that they wanted to add a pound of hops to a 5 gallon batch, that poster would get about the same reaction here.

After all why brew a balanced beer when you could punch through the IBU stratosphere.

Ridicule (your words). IMO good advice.

You've been given enough good information from the members here to do what you want. So go with it and post back in another thread whether it was worth it or not.

Another good course of action would be to seek the information in a forum where others have done what you are asking, see it's value, claim it tastes good, etc.

Just be prepared to read stuff like...

doodz this **** is teh bomb...


Closed!