Liquid Yeast Sux

[Firewalker11]

I agree with the original poster, liquid yeast sucks! Under yielding cell counts, extremely prissy temperature tolerances, mandatory starters and expensive! Have at it fanboys but I am done with them, plenty of good dry yeasts out there!

 

[bkboiler]

liquid yeast is more work, but for beers where I am really swinging for the fences, it's worth it.
I guess living in SD, the white labs yeast has pretty high viability, but the pure-pitch should help out a lot for those that must mail-order.
don't give up!!

 

[drainbamage]

When you guys mention quality dry yeasts, where (and what) are you finding?

My LHBSs carry mostly the standards...US-05, S-04, Nottingham, Saflager W-34/70, occasionally Belle Saison. While those are all solid choices, if I want something more specialized (I like to brew Belgian styles a lot), I don't have any good options in dry yeast.

 

[MarshmallowBlue]

I hope Mangrove Jack's dry yeast becomes more readily available, it's one of my favorite dry yeasts if I can get my hands on it. Liquid is good for belgian styles that need really specific yeast qualities only (and sours).

 

[m00ps]

I switched to exclusively liquid about a year ago, halfway through my brewing history. My beers have definitely improved. But that is also due to more experience. I brew a lot of Belgians (NEED liquid IMO) and IPAs. For the IPAs, I like to use something a littel more interesting than US-05. Conan and WY1318 I like. Until there is a comparable variety of dry yeast, Im not going back.

Plus, I havent had to buy a new yeast strain in a year. Harvesting from starters is amazing

 

[slym2none]

When you guys mention quality dry yeasts, where (and what) are you finding?

This is the dry yeast selection for beer at my LHBS, Bull City Brewing:

Danstar Belle Saison Yeast
Danstar BRY-97 American West Coast Yeast
Danstar CBC-1 Cask and Bottle Conditioned Beer Yeast
Danstar Munich Wheat Beer Yeast
Danstar Nottingham Yeast
Danstar Windsor Ale Yeast
Muntons Standard Dry Yeast
Safale American Ale US-05
SafAle English Ale S-04
Safbrew Abbaye Dry Brewing Yeast
SafBrew S-33
SafBrew T-58
SafBrew WB-06
SafLager S-23
Saflager W-34/70

 

[Ungoliant]

When you guys mention quality dry yeasts, where (and what) are you finding?

My LHBSs carry mostly the standards...US-05, S-04, Nottingham, Saflager W-34/70, occasionally Belle Saison. While those are all solid choices, if I want something more specialized (I like to brew Belgian styles a lot), I don't have any good options in dry yeast.

My LHBS carries the full range of Danstar, Mangrove Jack, and Fermentis dry yeasts. I'm not really left wanting for variety considering they've got 2 double-door commercial fridges full of liquid yeast and another 3 full of hops.

I use Altantic Brew Supply in Raleigh, NC

 

[xandersaml]

I've not had a problem with either liquid or dry yeast. Admittedly, I generally overpitch. I have used both beyond their expired date and still got good fermentation. I use starters and/or just pitch from packages on both. Could be just dumb luck... because, dumb I can do

 

[drainbamage]

This is the dry yeast selection for beer at my LHBS, Bull City Brewing:

My LHBS carries the full range of Danstar, Mangrove Jack, and Fermentis dry yeasts. I'm not really left wanting for variety considering they've got 2 double-door commercial fridges full of liquid yeast and another 3 full of hops.

I use Altantic Brew Supply in Raleigh, NC

Aside from Mangrove Jack and a couple others here and there, those look pretty much like the options I have.

These days, I'm probably at a 50/50 split between dry (usually S-05, occasionally Notty) and liquid (Belgian strains, or hybrids like Kolsch or Cali Common). Dry is more resilient for sure, but I can't really pick up on any difference in quality otherwise.

 

[Billy-Klubb]

I'm done with "liquid" and "dry" yeasts! they suck! from now on I'm only using fire yeast!

 

[Terek]

I agree with the original poster, liquid yeast sucks! Under yielding cell counts, extremely prissy temperature tolerances, mandatory starters and expensive! Have at it fanboys but I am done with them, plenty of good dry yeasts out there!

im with this. I hate liquid yeast. so much work and you get less cells for more money. I made a wookie jack clone last week, and it called for WL002. nine freakin dollars......Plus the need for a 2 liter starter (OG is 1085)
The cost of the yeast and the starter was almost as much as all the other ingredients. Almost cried as i grabbed that $9 pack, with the $4 us-05 right under it. Not to mention i have a washed us-05, as well as a few others, that would be free. Liquid yeast seems a scam to me.

edit: but back to the OP, i have used many many liquid packs, and never had one be bad. Even when the LHBS was clearing out the old stock, and gave me some wyeast for free, cuz it was almost a year past the best by date. Those took of just fine

 

[pshankstar]

I have found that whenever I use liquid yeast the beer ferments fine but it seems like a very mellow ferment. Whereas when I have used dry yeast the fermentation is very aggressive and apparent. The reason I say this is, the gravity readings show when I ferment with liquid and dry they both do just fine. What I have noticed is there has been no airlock activity when using the liquid yeast, but with dry yeast there is a lot of airlock activity. I know this is not a good indication of fermentation, but I am just letting the OP know what I have experienced. The krausen ring is not as large with liquid yeast compared to the dry yeast. I have pitched with and without a starter with the liquid yeast and have the same results.

Now, do I think liquid yeast sucks? No I do not, but I am starting to wonder if I should save my money and go back to buying the dry yeast. Reading this thread is making me ponder this... Well, now that I have harvested the WLP001 California Ale Yeast and the Wyeast 1272 American Ale yeast, I will continue to use them and make starters as needed. But the next time I use dry yeast I will harvest it and try to reuse it again later too.

Any how I wanted to share what I have noticed with my experience with the two kinds of yeast and I wish the OP the best of luck! Stick with dry yeast and don't give up on this hobby just yet! Cheers!

 

[SeraW]

Whatever floats your boat, I guess. For me I use White Labs. I have 5 strains I like that I rotate through, harvesting and reusing, so I haven't bought new in a while and offsets the cost pretty easily. Making a starter to me is just part of planning the brew, and I do love to plan. I guess I'd say it hardly qualifies as "Sux."

 

[Beer-lord]

I've never had liquid yeast not work for me whether it be bought online or the LHBS but I make starters 98% of the time.
I like liquid yeasts. I make huge starters and make enough yeast to make it work out to be about $1 per beer.
Dry yeast is fine. Use what works for you and you'll be fine.

 

[Brettomomyces]

Nothing inherently wrong with the way any kind of yeast is packaged, but hey, more Conan for us liquid folks

 

[Aristotelian]

92% success rate is pretty good.

100% is better. Which is what most people have with dry.

 

[jleiii]

I've had very good luck with liquid yeasts, with starters. It's really not that hard....or expensive.
Just this past weekend I broke out some ECY10 yeast that I saved from the starter the last time I used it (about 20ml, last propagated Jan 2015), and with 1 qt of free wort (AG second runnings I canned) over 2 days, it blew up in about 4 hours after pitching.
I buy 1-2 yeast packs a year, usually because it's a unique strain I need. Probably 90% of mine come from saved starters. Washing is soooo much more of a hassle.
I've used dry a few times as well, but lag times are significant in comparison. Nothing wrong with the beer it made!

 

[Ungoliant]

I've had very good luck with liquid yeasts, with starters. It's really not that hard....or expensive.

Just this past weekend I broke out some ECY10 yeast that I saved from the starter the last time I used it (about 20ml, last propagated Jan 2015), and with 1 qt of free wort (AG second runnings I canned) over 2 days, it blew up in about 4 hours after pitching.

I buy 1-2 yeast packs a year, usually because it's a unique strain I need. Probably 90% of mine come from saved starters. Washing is soooo much more of a hassle.

I've used dry a few times as well, but lag times are significant in comparison. Nothing wrong with the beer it made!

"Expensive" is relative. Not everyone saves or reuses yeast. I, personally, don't yet (but I plan to, in order to save more money). Obviously in your case, you're saving a lot by splitting and saving starters.

But, with a limited budget to brew with, the difference between $3.50 and $9 can mean a lot, especially if I'm looking at a high gravity beer. For example, Double IPAs will drain my budget because hops can be pretty expensive, especially if you need a pound or so of hops for one 5 gal batch.

 

[bkboiler]

yeah, and I've even used expired liquid yeast that the LHBS gave me for free (since they couldn't ethically sell it)...just made a starter, stepped it up to lager-level cell counts and it made amazing beer. on the other hand, the dry yeast I used in a similar recipe turned out pretty sulfury.
I've had experiences with both that could be used to argue that one is better than the other...
dry yeast is definitely cheaper, but when I'm putting as much effort in to making a great beer recipe that would retail commercially for 3x, I don't mind spending another $3 to get it closer.

 

[Billy-Klubb]

100% is better. Which is what most people have with dry.

so what you're saying is, "Most of the time it works every time." ?

 

[Firewalker11]

I'm done with "liquid" and "dry" yeasts! they suck! from now on I'm only using fire yeast!

Hmmm, not what I heard...

I heard you are 100% berry yeast, you know, once you go sack, you never go back.

 

[Firewalker11]

Whatever floats your boat, I guess. For me I use White Labs. I have 5 strains I like that I rotate through, harvesting and reusing, so I haven't bought new in a while and offsets the cost pretty easily. Making a starter to me is just part of planning the brew, and I do love to plan. I guess I'd say it hardly qualifies as "Sux."

Whoa! there pardner! The OP was about the viability etc of liquid yeast, reusing is a whole other discussion and I have four liquid bases yeasts I saved and use from time to time but buying new yeast for a brewday? No thank you...

 

[Qhrumphf]

Vaginal yeast!

Wait...

Seriously, several hundred batches under my belt, probably less than 10 with dry yeast, the rest with liquid, and I've only ONE dead vial, which was shipped cross country in the middle of the hottest heatwave on record and arrived untouchably hot (the last time I ever ordered liquid yeast during the summer, have done so exactly once since during winter for a strain I couldn't get locally).

Sorry mate, but it sounds like user error on your part.

 

[Firewalker11]

Vaginal yeast!

Wait...

Seriously, several hundred batches under my belt, probably less than 10 with dry yeast, the rest with liquid, and I've only ONE dead vial, which was shipped cross country in the middle of the hottest heatwave on record and arrived untouchably hot (the last time I ever ordered liquid yeast during the summer, have done so exactly once since during winter for a strain I couldn't get locally).

Sorry mate, but it sounds like user error on your part.

Um, scrotal yeast actually...

 

[grrickar]

Out of 50+ batches I have had exactly one failed liquid yeast pack. After a solid week it finally showed a tiny bit of activity. I repitched, and would have sooner if I had that yeast strain readily available.

 

[brewbama]

I am in a location that a LHBS is not readily available. Therefore I rely on the Internet and delivery service. I cannot control shipping and handling conditions. I guess it is my fault because I could move but that's not real practical based on my primary source of income. The rant was based on ANOTHER unsuccessful reviving attempt of dead or severely deficient liquid yeast. Not sure if I could improve the odds.

So 92% success rate vs 100% success rate. I realize my position is unpopular and folks tend to view a dissenting vote from a narrow perspective. No yeast starter or smack pack, just open, hydrate in 1 cup of warm water for 15 min and pitch! Way easier and I cannot tell a difference in flavor, body, etc.... As someone said above -more liquid yeast for you. Have fun!

 

[DurtyChemist]

I am in a location that a LHBS is not readily available. Therefore I rely on the Internet and delivery service. I cannot control shipping and handling conditions. I guess it is my fault because I could move but that's not real practical based on my primary source of income. The rant was based on ANOTHER unsuccessful reviving attempt of dead or severely deficient liquid yeast. Not sure if I could improve the odds.

So 92% success rate vs 100% success rate. I realize my position is unpopular and folks tend to view a dissenting vote from a narrow perspective. No yeast starter or smack pack, just open, hydrate in 1 cup of warm water for 15 min and pitch! Way easier and I cannot tell a difference in flavor, body, etc.... As someone said above -more liquid yeast for you. Have fun!

Is it how you're storing it that contributes to the yeast death? Most places wil include ice packs so right now would be the best time to order yeast for summer brewing. Maybe stick with one or two liquid yeasts, harvest from starters and store them in sanitary conditions below 40F. Where was this "dead or severely deficient liquid yeast" from and how was it shipped and cared for?

 

[Qhrumphf]

I am in a location that a LHBS is not readily available. Therefore I rely on the Internet and delivery service. I cannot control shipping and handling conditions. I guess it is my fault because I could move but that's not real practical based on my primary source of income. The rant was based on ANOTHER unsuccessful reviving attempt of dead or severely deficient liquid yeast. Not sure if I could improve the odds.

So 92% success rate vs 100% success rate. I realize my position is unpopular and folks tend to view a dissenting vote from a narrow perspective. No yeast starter or smack pack, just open, hydrate in 1 cup of warm water for 15 min and pitch! Way easier and I cannot tell a difference in flavor, body, etc.... As someone said above -more liquid yeast for you. Have fun!

So what you're saying-

It's not liquid yeast that sucks. It's where you live that sucks...

Seriously. I'm not suggesting that you should move. But don't blame it on the yeast.

My apartment doesn't allow dogs! Dogs suck!

Seriously though, it takes a lot to legit kill yeast. Usually you can coax it back up from sequential starters, just like harvesting from a bottle. Is it always worth it? Maybe not. Maybe dry yeast is a better choice given your circumstances. But again, don't blame the yeast for that.

 

[brewbama]

So what you're saying-

It's not liquid yeast that sucks. It's where you live that sucks...

Seriously. I'm not suggesting that you should move. But don't blame it on the yeast.

My apartment doesn't allow dogs! Dogs suck!

Seriously though, it takes a lot to legit kill yeast. Usually you can coax it back up from sequential starters, just like harvesting from a bottle. Is it always worth it? Maybe not. Maybe dry yeast is a better choice given your circumstances. But again, don't blame the yeast for that.

True. There are dog people and cat people. Dog people think cats suck. Cat people think dogs suck. Cat people think dogs are not worth it. Dog people think cats are not worth it. I came to a point the other day that I decided it's not worth it - even though I've had a 90+% success rate. After daze of trying to coax liquid yeast back to life that I paid over $6 bucks for, I decided I'd go with 100% sure thing. Cheaper and Easier. ...and makes great beer.

 

[specharka]

It's funny, because I am the polar opposite. In 3 years of brewing and 50+ batches, I've used dry yeast a handful of times, and I've been gravely disappointed every single time. One of my first kits was a NB hefeweizen with dry yeast that neither tasted good or even remotely resembled a hefeweizen. I credit the awful dry yeast for that dumper.

In contrast, I've been very pleased with 95% of my liquid yeast selection. I've resurrected smack packs that were 3-6 months out of date with good results. Liquid yeast does reinforce good yeast management techniques, so if you can demonstrate yeast harvesting and propagation techniques, there's no limits. And guess what? That's what commercial brewers do.

Graduate to liquid yeast and eventually you'll be able to propagate bottle dregs for even more variety. It's worth the effort.