Kickstarter for SS Mash Tun, Kettle and Fermenter

[user 204491]

Has anyone else had any problems with their boil kettle draining?

Basically I installed a street 90 inside mine today to act like a dip tube, and when I went to drain it, it slowed to a trickle and then stopped as soon as it met where the street 90 attached to the inside of the welded on coupler.

If I tilted the kettle so the water covered the connection it would start to drain again.

 

[Roadliner]

Sounds like you don't have a good seal on it. Not making a vacuum.

 

[user 204491]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, but it has a healthy amount of teflon tape on the threads, and I don't think you couldn't get it any tighter. It's really in there good.

That's why I asked, on my other kettle, my street 90 is just in there finger tight, and it drains nearly all the way every time.

I tried this one like that, met those results, and then I tightened it as tight as I could, and got the same results.

Was thinking maybe there was a problem with the coupler that's welded on.

 

[Roadliner]

could be on the other side maybe? there has to be an air leak somewhere to stop it from pulling the liquid.

 

[user 204491]

It seems tight as a drum from the other side. Did a water test with 10 gallons for 4 hours, and not a drop.

Maybe something with the street 90? I'll try swapping it out with something else and see if I get the same results.

I know the nipples ended up not being NPT, it'd be a shame if the couplings ended up not being either.

 

[Roadliner]

that's a possibility. You could be losing something in the threads even with plumbers tape. Water tight isn't necessarily air tight.

 

[user 204491]

Hmmm... well at this time I'm inclined to say it's the kettle. I have tried 2 different street 90s as well as a 3/8" hose barb that has a 90 degree bend in it, and all 3 met with the same results.

They basically stop draining once the water level gets to the bulkhead. I moved all 3 to my other kettle, tightened them finger tight, and they worked as expected.

There is no way you could tighten the things on the outside any tighter, so I don't think they could be playing any part.

I'm using way more nylon thread than you should have to, and the last time I didn't dare tighten the street 90 any more, or I'm certain it would have been permanently attached.

Anyone else run into anything like this?

I did notice that where the bulkhead meets the kettle on the inside it's a bit "janky" if you know what I mean, and it seems to cut up the tape a good bit by the time I take the street 90 back off.

Also, I was really surprised to see some sort of discoloration around the bulkhead and in a few places on the inside of the kettle, along with what appears to be a small rust spot on the bottom of my kettle this morning. It was upside down drip drying overnight, and that's what I discovered when I flipped it over this morning.

The only thing I've done with this kettle so far is wash it with PBW and a soft wash cloth one time and let water sit in it once for about an hour, and then for 4 hours as a water test yesterday.

I'll check it out more and post pics later if I have time. Home with a sick baby and wife today, so I was lucky to be able to make it this far.

 

[Roadliner]

It could be the threads... if those are wrong, it won't matter if you try a different elbow. Same if there is an imperfection in the weld. I'm not really knowledgeable about welding though.. I'm not sure if there are imperfections in welding small enough to be air permeable but not water..

 

[user 204491]

It could be the threads... if those are wrong, it won't matter if you try a different elbow. Same if there is an imperfection in the weld. I'm not really knowledgeable about welding though.. I'm not sure if there are imperfections in welding small enough to be air permeable but not water..

Yeah, I'm really starting to think it's the threads. It's rather difficult to get anything to start so screw in there, and then when I take any part off the tape is pretty beat up looking.

Then when I take those same parts out, re-tape them, and try them in another kettle, the go right in and work at finger tightness.

Of course if that's the case, I think it pretty much ruins the whole kettle. That bulkhead comes in at about the 1 1/2 gallon mark, so that's far too much to leave behind.

I'm also spotting what I'd call a pockmark on the inside back of the kettle where one side of the handle is welded on. I didn't notice it before, but now that the discoloration is setting in it's very obvious.

Pictures coming soon!

Has anyone else water tested their kettle and ran into these sorts of things?

 

[GaBrewZoo]

Is the drain on the outside lower than the bottom of the kettle? You have to have the liquid actually pulling, which means if you don't have a hose or something hanging lower on the outside of the kettle, it will just stop when pressure on both sides equalize.

 

[user 204491]

Pics as promised...

Looking straight down into kettle - notice marks on bottom:

Pockmark I was talking about. Inside of upper part of kettle where the handle is welded on the outside:

Close up of one of those marks on the bottom:

Close up of one of the other marks on the bottom:

Close up of the marks on the bottom/side:

Close up of marks on the side:

Close up of bulkhead in question:

Better close up of the bulkhead:

 

[user 204491]

Is the drain on the outside lower than the bottom of the kettle? You have to have the liquid actually pulling, which means if you don't have a hose or something hanging lower on the outside of the kettle, it will just stop when pressure on both sides equalize.

Ya know, I normally don't consider myself an idiot, but I certainly feel like one now. Of course you are right. In the most unscientific test ever, the kettle that drained every time had the hose, and the one that didn't drain, did not have the hose.

It's just one of those things you never think about. When I got the other kettle out, it had the barb and hose already attached, so I didn't bother to detach it.

Drains like a champ now. I used a street 90 and then one of the nipples from Chapman since I figured that wouldn't be good for much else. That extends the reach of the street 90 down to about 1/4" off the bottom of the kettle.

Still not sure what to make of all those marks/discoloration on the inside that suddenly showed up though.

 

[Roadliner]

lol simple oversight.. no worries.. I thought about that, but figured.. nah.

I'd be sending those pictures to Chapman though.. of the pit and the discoloration. It shouldn't be doing that at all.. especially not so soon. after months of hard use....... maybe.

 

[user 204491]

Yeah, I just emailed Steve and asked him to take a look. Stay tuned!

 

[kcbeersnob]

Wow...those are some pretty alarming pics!

 

[douglasbarbin]

That's the "high quality" Chinese stainless steel...

 

[user 204491]

Well, like I said, I let Steve know about it via email and directed him to my photos here. When he responds I'll let you know what he has to say about it, or he might post here himself.

Honestly I'm kinda surprised if it's a widespread problem that I'm the first to report it here. If you have a kettle and haven't used it or washed it yet, you might want to do that and see what happens.

I know a couple of people have used their Thermobarrels and haven't posted anything like this.

I guess we'll see.

 

[val214]

I haven't use used my barrel yet. Won't use it until Thursday. I will report back when I do. I did drill and modify it to fit a blichmann auto sparge

 

[Frostbrewer]

Using my steel bucket currently to ferment my oktoberfest.

Working great, no issues so far.

 

[ChapmanEquipment]

Also, I was really surprised to see some sort of discoloration around the bulkhead and in a few places on the inside of the kettle, along with what appears to be a small rust spot on the bottom of my kettle this morning. It was upside down drip drying overnight, and that's what I discovered when I flipped it over this morning.

The only thing I've done with this kettle so far is wash it with PBW and a soft wash cloth one time and let water sit in it once for about an hour, and then for 4 hours as a water test yesterday.

I just wrote drgonzo2k2 an email offering to replace the kettle, but these pictures are unsettling. The equipment wasn't pickled or passivated and is therefore leaving these rust/oxidation/discoloration spots.

I was expecting that there might be one or two issues with equipment that wasn't passivated 100%, but this wasn't even touched. The manufacturer dips the equipment in an acid wash after all the welds and polishing is done. Often cheap manufacturers will skip this part, as it's hard to tell without extensive testing. But I've talked to our manufacturer about it several times, as this is something I was worried about. I've already sent them an email with these pictures, and I'm hoping to get some sort of explanation.

As you were saying before, it would be strange if this was a problem everyone was having and this is the first anyone mentioned it. If this is an isolated incident then we will just exchange the piece for one that has been passivated. If other people start having this problem... well, let's just hope no one else has this problem.

 

[Bobby_M]

Just clean the area with bar keeper's friend and it will fix it.

 

[user 204491]

Just wanted to verify that what Steve said is correct. He contacted me late last night and offered to switch out the kettle no questions asked, and with no charges to me.

I don't think you could ask for more than that in a situation like this, so provided the new one doesn't have any issues, I'd say consider me a happy camper at this point.

As usual he has shown great customer service, and I will definitely keep that in mind in the future. I will definitely be keeping a close eye on my Chapman gear as it goes into use to spot any future issues quickly.

Again, this seems to be an isolated incident, so if you're sitting on gear that you haven't used yet, you really should check it out to make sure it stays that way!

 

[chewse]

Just clean the area with bar keeper's friend and it will fix it.

Hey Bobby - just want to understand your comment. Are you saying as long as we remove the rust with bar keeper's friend, this will keep the rust from marking the pot? And will the issue Steve mentioned always be an issue using the kettle over its life?

 

[lschiavo]

oops

 

[izzie]

I was wondering why mine hadn't shipped yet. I'll wait if it means everything is fixed.

 

[govner1]

This definitely keeps me on the sidelines for a new MLT from Chapman or any other SS equipment made in China.
It seems to be a recurring theme that the Chinese manufacturers are taking/making shortcuts (often unknown to the U.S. customer) by using subpar SS & less than satisfactory welds & finishing.

 

[decoleur]

This definitely keeps me on the siones for a new MLT from Chapman or any other SS equipment made in China.
It seems to be a recurring theme that the Chinese manufacturers are taking/making shortcuts (often unknown to the U.S. customer) by using subpar SS & less than satisfactory welds & finishing.

Everybody loses some quality assurance when they outsource manufacturing regardless of where. Very little is not manufactured in China.

Please do not throw stones at Chapman if you do not have skin in the game. The shot at the SS is just a cheap one, raise your game.

I have a ThermoBarrel and a Steel Barrel, both have pros and cons but I cannot cast muck on their first production run. Both are shiny and the finish are much better than I have expected.

Every flaw that they have found they have identified and offered to correct on their dime. Chapman is doing a better job of taking care of their customers over products that cost hundreds and not thousands of dollars, which could not be said for the car companies that are delivering products manufactured from foreign made parts and only owning the problem when they get caught.

If I needed anything else, I would consider getting it from Chapman. I have a old style megapot and I have gotten upgraded pots from Bru-Gear and Colorado Brewing, but I probably won't get more from either. This is just my personal preference but for Bru-Gear both the herms coil and the element location on the E-Kettle is not my favorite but the pots are great. Colorado Brewing is awesome and their customization is first rate but I am not a fan of their base pots.

Cheers!

-Timur

 

[Gavin C]

.

 

[Gavin C]

This definitely keeps me on the sidelines for a new MLT from Chapman or any other SS equipment made in China.
It seems to be a recurring theme that the Chinese manufacturers are taking/making shortcuts (often unknown to the U.S. customer) by using subpar SS & less than satisfactory welds & finishing.

I think @govner1 makes very fair comments.

They manufacture 3 products. Design and/or manufacturing problems are noted in all three. Significant flaws in my mind.

Volume markings off in the FV.
Dip tube with no seal
Incorrect threads
Non passivated steel
Bad packaging.

Not buying nor having bought one does not disqualify his legitimate concerns.

Sure Chapman are rectifying things as best they can on their dime. Hopefully for the buyers' sake they have sufficiently deep pockets.

As I previously mentioned the inaccurate volume markings on the FV were enough for me to cancel my order of two. Inaccurate volume marks is not acceptable in a stainless steel tool. At least not for me.

Kudos to chapman. A full refund through the kick starter was issued after a couple of emails. No problems on that end whatsoever. Very good customer service.

To each their own. Some are happy to accept the flaws and do their own work arounds. I'm not in that camp.

 

[user 204491]

At this point I'm still a Chapman supporter; however, the devil will be in the details when I get my new kettle and when I put my Thermobarrel into use, which will hopefully be soon.

These things were a steal at the Kickstarter price, and I hope it remains that way, and doesn't turn into "you get what you pay for."

I think the incorrect volume markings ended up being a design flaw, and not a manufacturing flaw. If I remember correctly I think they said they ended up changing the taper of the vessel and forgot to correct the volume markings for the new shape. Seems like that's something easy to correct in V2, but sucks for V1. Again, I sold mine when I got it, but that was more because it was just too small for me and didn't work in my setup than I was upset about the markings. I totally understand if that was a deal breaker for some though, and can't blame you.

If the problems with the kettle I experienced are wide spread, no one else has chimed in here to say "me too," but that doesn't mean it's not the case. Not sure what the intersection of Chapman customers with HBTers that participate in this thread are. They could have several email complaints that would be unknown to us; however, Chapman has owned up to everything else, so not owning up here would seem out of character.

They definitely are doing what it takes to make things right as issues arise, and service after the sale goes a long way towards making me a happy customer.