Kettle False Bottom with All Pellets?

[Catt22]

I'm always amazed at the efforts some go through in an attempt to keep hops and trub confined to the kettle and out of their fermenters. I use a false bottom in both my mash tun and my boil kettle. I do the whirpool thing at the end of the boil (when I remember, that is) and only minimal hop debris/trub winds up in the fermenter. So little, in fact, that I never give it a second thought. After racking the beer from the primary, all that I see remaining is a thick yeast cake on the bottom which appears to be quite clean. I use a counterflow chiller. I can see that there might be problems using a plate type chiller with it's narrower passages, but other than that, any debris should settle out in the primary and IMO won't do any harm. I've also read that it can actually benefit the yeast to have some of this stuff present in the primary. I use both whole hops and pellet hops depending on availability and neither have caused any problems. Maybe I'm just lucky or something.

 

[Yooper]

I'm always amazed at the efforts some go through in an attempt to keep hops and trub confined to the kettle and out of their fermenters. I use a false bottom in both my mash tun and my boil kettle. I do the whirpool thing at the end of the boil (when I remember, that is) and only minimal hop debris/trub winds up in the fermenter. So little, in fact, that I never give it a second thought. After racking the beer from the primary, all that I see remaining is a thick yeast cake on the bottom which appears to be quite clean. I use a counterflow chiller. I can see that there might be problems using a plate type chiller with it's narrower passages, but other than that, any debris should settle out in the primary and IMO won't do any harm. I've also read that it can actually benefit the yeast to have some of this stuff present in the primary. I use both whole hops and pellet hops depending on availability and neither have caused any problems. Maybe I'm just lucky or something.

Well, I don't strain normally, but if you're using a CFC (as the above poster is), you'll have a mess and a clogged chiller in seconds if you don't have a way to keep the hops and debris out of the chiller. I'm thinking of just using a mesh screen, since I don't have a CFC (I use an immersion chiller) but don't want to clog up my ball valve.

 

[Catt22]

Well, I don't strain normally, but if you're using a CFC (as the above poster is), you'll have a mess and a clogged chiller in seconds if you don't have a way to keep the hops and debris out of the chiller. I'm thinking of just using a mesh screen, since I don't have a CFC (I use an immersion chiller) but don't want to clog up my ball valve.

Prior to installing the false bottom in my boil kettle, I simply used an SS scrubbie under the pickup tube. That worked very well for me. I'm sure that some fine particulates do make it past the false bottom or the scrubbie, but only a very small amount and that has not caused any problems. The CFC hasn't given me any trouble at all. Fine particulates pass right through it and anything of significant size is held back by the false bottom.

 

[WortMonger]

I'm thinking along the same lines as a false bottom Catt22, just like my mash tun. I like the idea the hops have the room to go anywhere like that. However, I would also like a finer filtration just after my chiller. Nothing like post fermentation filtration, but still something small enough to pull anything larger than smaller proteins out. I get enough oxygen and for lagers clean seems to be key (some use centrifuge cold break filters). Ales not so much, but I would like the ability nonetheless. If it were too clean, or the beer suffered I could always go back to just the false bottom. I dought I woul dbe able to filter out too much good stuff.

 

[Catt22]

Wortmonger,

Not to discourage you in any way, but IMO it isn't at all necessary to filter the wort before it goes into the fermenter. I brew lagers regularly and have no problem with clarity. Everything drops out during the lagering period. I know most commercial breweries use some kind of filtration, but I think that is mostly to speed the product to market. It's too costly to perform a long cold lagering process. I usually cold condition my ales too, but for a much shorter duration than my lagers.

Here's one of 'em:

 

[Catt22]

Here's a recent Classic American Pilsner that I brewed and lagered for six weeks:

...now I'm getting thirsty!

 

[Seabee John]

For those who use march pumps to recirculate during chilling, be careful of your flow rate! I used a mix of whole leaf and pellets on one brew, and between the suction created by the pump, and heat effect on my Northern Brewer false bottom, it literally "collapsed" my false bottom. I was able to pop it back into shape, but I learned that I could regulate the flow and encounter less problems.

 

[WortMonger]

Nice beers Catt22! I'm gonna start with the false bottom and see if that gets me where I need to be. What does your false bottom look like Catt22? Do you have a picture so I can see the screen size on it?

 

[Catt22]

WortMonger,

I use a 10 gallon Polarware kettle as my mash tun and it's equipped with a Polarware full width false bottom like the one shown here:

40 QUART STAINLESS FALSE BOTTOM @ Williams Brewing

I have a keggle equipped with a false bottom from Nothern Brewer. I got the one with the 1/2 inch hole in the center and made my own pick up tube with copper plumbing fittings. I designed the pickup tube so that it holds the false bottom down firmly to prevent anything from getting under it. To do that, I simply cut down a coupling to make a ring that would slip over the down tube and sweated it in place. The pickup tube has a pipe union in the middle to make it easy to disconnect in order to remove the false bottom for cleaning. The union provides a positive seal and is easily loosened with a wrench. Here's a pic of the false bottom from the NB site:

http://www.northernbrewer.com/pics/fullsize/abt-false-bottom.jpg

Neither of these FB's were cheap, but they are very durable and haven't come anywhere close to collapsing even when I've had a stuck mash and sucked down hard on them with the pump. Both are very strong designs.

The reason I have FB's in both kettles is that on occasion I use the keggle to mash in for really big beers when the grain exceeds the capacity of the 10 gallon kettle. Under those circumstances I lauter into the Polarware kettle and also a second kettle. After collecting the wort, I clean out the keggle and pump the wort back into it for the boil. I only need to do this for very high gravity 11 gallon batches. The 10 gallon kettle maxes out at about 28 lbs of grain. Someday I want to get a 15 gallon Polarware kettle, but that's another serious chunk of change that will have to wait awhile.

I'll take a pic of the pickup tube tomorrow and post it so you can see how the retaining ring and union are arranged. I'm very pleased with the performance of both of these kettles.

 

[hammer one]

I'm jumping in pretty late on this thread but you guys have some great ideas, I like the screen tube that seems to have potential. Here's what I'm thinking I have a false bottom in my kettle but to keep it from cloging you need a filter bed. So my plan is to make a filter bed by attaching S/S scrubbies to it. The scrubbies are cheap enough 2 for $1 at the dollar store. Pro's Con's What do you think?

 

[bzomerlei]

I'm jumping in pretty late on this thread but you guys have some great ideas, I like the screen tube that seems to have potential. Here's what I'm thinking I have a false bottom in my kettle but to keep it from cloging you need a filter bed. So my plan is to make a filter bed by attaching S/S scrubbies to it. The scrubbies are cheap enough 2 for $1 at the dollar store. Pro's Con's What do you think?

Hammer One,
I had been using a scrubbie, but not with a false bottom at the same time. Will a false bottom stop some of the pellet hops? I'm thinking a big hop bill will clog a scrubbie based on my experience this weekend with a 9oz of pellet hops.

I'm thinking the best solution for pellet hops is to use something like a 'hop stopper' screen with more surface area, perhaps with some form of internal frame to support it in a cone or pyramid shape.
Brent

 

[hammer one]

I havn't tried this out yet, but from all the people that I've talked to for the false bottom to work and not clog you need a filter bed and to get that you need to add a few oz of whole hops. I was thinking that the scrubbies would take the place of the whole hops.

 

[Catt22]

A false bottom should not need an additional screen or filter bed when used in a boil kettle. I've never had the FB plug up with either whole or pellet hops. When using pellet hops alone, I didn't use any kind of a screen, scrubbie or FB. I just did a whirlpool at the end of boil and opened the valve to drain. The vast majority of the trub, break and hop debris was left in a pile in the center of the kettle bottom. Very little of this stuff left the kettle. Leaf hops required a pickup tube and scrubbie to hold them back and keep them out of the outlet port/valve.

 

[Mobstar]

I use all pellet hops and immersion chill, and I have tried a number of different methods of getting the beer out of my keggle. I have tried several types of false bottoms, fine screen collanders, and hose braids. I have gone back to a big siphon because I could never get anything to work 100% of the time.

I'm also having this problem with my keggle! I've used dual SS braid and it just clogs right up. What I've done to reduce the sludge is create a hop mesh cylinder that I use to steep the hops. It's basically a 4" CPVC reducer with a nylon mesh attached to it with a SS round clamp. There's a pipe going across the diameter of the reducer that sits on each and of the keggle.

This reduces the HOP sludge.. Now I need to figure out how to prevent the cooled wort from clogging the SS mesh