Kegerator beer line lengths

[Methose]

I just bought new lines for my beer taps, as they were in real need of replacement, and when I measured the lines that I had prior, the numbers didn't match what I thought when I built the system.
I thought that I had 4' lines, but when I measured them, they were 5'.

I'm using the exact same beer line:
SuperFlex Beverage Tubing (3/16 in. ID)
Item Number: D1700BULK
Technical Specifications: 3/16" line provides 2.2 lbs of restriction per foot. Ideally pounds of resistance should equal pounds of applied pressure. 3/16" line holds 1/6 of an ounce per foot. Made from PVC. 7/16"OD

• I use an upright, side by side fridge, with the taps about 1.5 - 2' above the tops of the 5 gal corny kegs.
• The temp is set to 33 deg F
• I like my beers at 2.4 - 2.5 Vol CO2, so it looks like I should go with a pressure of 7.75 psi
• My calculation looks like it will lose 2.2 psi per foot for line resistance + about 1 psi (.5 x 2) to elevation.
• I put 4' lines on the beer taps, so my total calculation looks like this:
• (4 x 2.2) + 1 = 9.8 psi of resistance.

So this is apparently not balanced, but not sure what to do about this, which way to adjust, or what the ramifications would be.

Can someone assist in checking my math, theory, as well as in general tell me if it looks like I'm doing this correctly or not?

Thanks so much all!

 

[m00ps]

I havent done the math. I just know from experience and searching around that 4 feet is way too short for a kegerator. You should start at 10-12 feet for normal carb volumes

 

[Jim311]

I'm interested in this as well, as I think my picnic tap I'm dispensing from that only has about 6 feet of line is basically causing me to lose all the carbonation once I fill my glass.

 

[brewprint]

I don't know why when these dealers sell picnic faucets with only 5 feet of line. I've had both picnic and perlick and currently have perlick.

All of my lines are 10 feet and I have 15 on my small keg since it sits up higher in the keezer.

I would at least do 11 foot of line if you're putting your pressure at 12. There's no reason to use the short lines.

Some people will also say that they carb their keg at say, 12 psi. Then they put it at 'serving pressure' of around 6. Over time the precious brew will lose carbonation. I only do this if I take my 3 gallon keg on a trip.

 

[MagicMatt]

• I use an upright, side by side fridge, with the taps about 1.5 - 2' above the tops of the 5 gal corny kegs.
• The temp is set to 33 deg F
• I like my beers at 2.4 - 2.5 Vol CO2, so it looks like I should go with a pressure of 7.75 psi
• My calculation looks like it will lose 2.2 psi per foot for line resistance + about 1 psi (.5 x 2) to elevation.
• I put 4' lines on the beer taps, so my total calculation looks like this:
• (4 x 2.2) + 1 = 9.8 psi of resistance.

So this is apparently not balanced, but not sure what to do about this, which way to adjust, or what the ramifications would be.

Can someone assist in checking my math, theory, as well as in general tell me if it looks like I'm doing this correctly or not?

So for starters, the pressure you need to set for 33°F and 2.5 vols of CO2 will be about 8.5-9psi, not 7.5 as you stated. Another error is that you said your taps are about 2 feet above the tops of the kegs. When measuring vertical height between keg and tap, you measure from the center of the keg (the average of the height of beer that will be drawn over the course of the life of the keg). Therefore this number should be 3 ft for you.

Using the correct pressure and height numbers, and plugging into the best online calculator we have for determining hose length, we get about 7 feet of necessary line.

Again, this is the MINIMUM you will need to achieve a balanced pour. My suggestion (as well as many people on here) is to add a few feet to that number just to be safe. I wouldn't start with anything less than 10 feet. If you find a 10ft. length is too slow of a pour for you, cut a foot off and try again. Having too short a hose will cause a host of problems; on the contrary, having too long a hose will have only one side effect, and that is a slightly longer pour time (we're talking seconds here).

 

[Natdavis777]

I used to use 4-5 ' lines and ended up with issues and pouring at 2-5 psi.... Luckily I consumed the beer quickly then and they were 5 gal batches. Since then, and moving to 10 gal batches, Ive upped my lines to 10'. I still force carb 30 psi @ 24 hours, then drop the serving pressure of 10-12 psi. I get consistent pours without excessive foam, and maintain my carb throughout the life of the kegs.

This keeps the kegs at the appropriate carb while allowing me to pour without foaming.

 

[Methose]

So for starters, the pressure you need to set for 33°F and 2.5 vols of CO2 will be about 8.5-9psi, not 7.5 as you stated. Another error is that you said your taps are about 2 feet above the tops of the kegs. When measuring vertical height between keg and tap, you measure from the center of the keg (the average of the height of beer that will be drawn over the course of the life of the keg). Therefore this number should be 3 ft for you.

Using the correct pressure and height numbers, and plugging into the best online calculator we have for determining hose length, we get about 7 feet of necessary line.

Again, this is the MINIMUM you will need to achieve a balanced pour. My suggestion (as well as many people on here) is to add a few feet to that number just to be safe. I wouldn't start with anything less than 10 feet. If you find a 10ft. length is too slow of a pour for you, cut a foot off and try again. Having too short a hose will cause a host of problems; on the contrary, having too long a hose will have only one side effect, and that is a slightly longer pour time (we're talking seconds here).

Excellent, this is what I was looking for -not mere suggestions, but some numbers pointed at my setup specifically. TY
I realize most people just say use long lines, but I really like to know how it all works.

So I looked at my phone, and apparently I was actually setting it for a target of 2.4 Vol CO2 -it's amazing what difference a tenth of a Volume makes
That being said, 7.75 psi is not easily obtainable on the crappy regulator I have at current, and who knows what it actually is pointing to on that dial.
Using the website you listed showed 5.74 ft length at a Flow rate of 10 sec/pint

I would like to point out that this statement: "...having too long a hose will have only one side effect, and that is a slightly longer pour time ", is not entirely true, at least for me.
Having 40' of very thick and ridged double walled tubing sitting in my keggerator is actually a bit difficult to deal with, when swapping in and out kegs. However neat you coil them up, they are still in the way. It may be because I have an upright fridge where most people seem to have chest freezers with a collar on them, or that I also have a 4 way manifold with all the gas tubing, but either way, it gets messy in there.
I've already cut and installed the tubing, so I guess I will let it ride for a little bit, to see if it starts to foam, I'll be putting in longer lines.

I do rush carb my beers some times, at 20 - 25 psi for 24h, then switch regulators from high pressure back to the 4way manifold that holds my serving pressure.

 

[MagicMatt]

I hear ya in regards to all of that tubing clogging up your kegerator. Each setup is different, but with an upright I would try to coil each keg's line (and tape it so it stays coiled), and then affix each coil to the rear wall of the fridge. This would keep them out of the way (since you rarely will need to mess with them), but allow enough lead to reach your kegs from one end and the taps from the other. It may not be possible with your setup though.

There's 2 options I can think of that should help your short line problems:

- Inserting a mixer stick into each keg's diptube (see here) will effectively increase the length the beer must travel, and can often alleviate any minor foaming issues that are happening.

- Getting flow control faucets will definitely work - with these you can have really short lines and just dial up the resistance from the tap's side of things. This will increase the time for a pour, but it should eliminate your foaming issues.

 

[Methose]

I hear ya in regards to all of that tubing clogging up your kegerator. Each setup is different, but with an upright I would try to coil each keg's line (and tape it so it stays coiled), and then affix each coil to the rear wall of the fridge. This would keep them out of the way (since you rarely will need to mess with them), but allow enough lead to reach your kegs from one end and the taps from the other. It may not be possible with your setup though.

There's 2 options I can think of that should help your short line problems:

- Inserting a mixer stick into each keg's diptube (see here) will effectively increase the length the beer must travel, and can often alleviate any minor foaming issues that are happening.

- Getting flow control faucets will definitely work - with these you can have really short lines and just dial up the resistance from the tap's side of things. This will increase the time for a pour, but it should eliminate your foaming issues.

The flow control faucets are definitely something that I have thought about, but are pretty expensive. I think at this point I will wait for the problem to exist, then look at longer lines. It looks like that by the math that I could do 6' (5.75' to be precise), yes as a minimum, but that might work.
Just to understand, I'm looking for a 0psi at the faucet? A net 0 of the difference between psi in the tank and the resistance I get from line and elevation?

Thanks again for the response!

 

[day_trippr]

[...]Just to understand, I'm looking for a 0psi at the faucet? A net 0 of the difference between psi in the tank and the resistance I get from line and elevation?

Practically speaking, yes. You want just enough "residual" pressure at the faucet such that the beer exiting the spout fills the full diameter...

Cheers!