Kölsch Yeast

[rinhaak]

Has anyone ever fermented with a Kölsch at 53°? I'm doing some lagers, and I'd like a quick turnaround ale to do at the same time. The Wyeast website says the optimum range is 55-65. But I wonder what 2 extra degrees would do?

 

[LandoLincoln]

I'm wondering why you just don't ferment at 55°.

 

[mattclough]

I was actually just about to post a reply to one of my own topics on this matter. I just used White Labs German Ale/Kölsch yeast and fermented at 55F, which is its lowest limit. Check out the byproduct levels tested by White Labs.

http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp029.html

The diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione more than triple when you ferment at temperatures that low. I gave my beer a week-long diacetyl rest and even still I've got a doppelbock that tastes like it's filled with honey.

 

[Nuggethead]

I was actually just about to post a reply to one of my own topics on this matter. I just used White Labs German Ale/Kölsch yeast and fermented at 55F, which is its lowest limit. Check out the byproduct levels tested by White Labs.

http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp029.html

The diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione more than triple when you ferment at temperatures that low. I gave my beer a week-long diacetyl rest and even still I've got a doppelbock that tastes like it's filled with honey.

According to WhiteLabs, the lowest limit for 029 is 62f with normal temps between 65f-69f. I've used it numerous times at 62-64 but never tried it in the 50's.

 

[bratrules]

The lowest I have use kolsch yeast is at 57-58. But I wouldn't pitch at that temp. I always drop it down to 57 after fermentation has started. If you want to ferment lower than that I would go with wyeast 2124 or Wlp810.

 

[scoundrel]

For what its worth, this was a response from white labs when a batch using this yeast got down to 53, by accident in a new, untested chest freezer:

Going too cold is far better than going too warm, at least from a fermentation perspective. If the yeast is still actively fermenting, then you can safely warm it up to 62 and be pretty sure that you'll have no ill effects on the beer. Despite what the description of the WLP029 says, I know plenty of people who like to ferment cooler with this strain and it seems to do OK as long as you can get through the lag phase at warmer temperatures.
If the yeast has stalled out, I'd recommend letting it warm all the way up to room temp (about 70F or so) and rousing the yeast by swirling the fermenter to get the yeast up off the bottom and into contact with the beer. Once it gets going again, you can slowly lower the temp back to 62 for the remainder of primary.
Either way, I don't think you'll need to pitch more yeast, it sounds like you have plenty in there now.

 

[rinhaak]

For what its worth, this was a response from white labs when a batch using this yeast got down to 53, by accident in a new, untested chest freezer:

Going too cold is far better than going too warm, at least from a fermentation perspective. If the yeast is still actively fermenting, then you can safely warm it up to 62 and be pretty sure that you'll have no ill effects on the beer. Despite what the description of the WLP029 says, I know plenty of people who like to ferment cooler with this strain and it seems to do OK as long as you can get through the lag phase at warmer temperatures.
If the yeast has stalled out, I'd recommend letting it warm all the way up to room temp (about 70F or so) and rousing the yeast by swirling the fermenter to get the yeast up off the bottom and into contact with the beer. Once it gets going again, you can slowly lower the temp back to 62 for the remainder of primary.
Either way, I don't think you'll need to pitch more yeast, it sounds like you have plenty in there now.

Thanks, Scoundrel! This is super helpful.

In answer to LandoLincoln, because I would be fermenting this in the same fridge as my India Pale Lager, I don't want to alter the temp beyond 53°.

I'm starting to think that I'll just hold off on the Kölsch until I can set the fridge temp to the ideal Kölsch temp.

 

[bribo179]

Why don't you just make a second lager?

 

[stat]

I was actually just about to post a reply to one of my own topics on this matter. I just used White Labs German Ale/Kölsch yeast and fermented at 55F, which is its lowest limit. Check out the byproduct levels tested by White Labs.

http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp029.html

The diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione more than triple when you ferment at temperatures that low. I gave my beer a week-long diacetyl rest and even still I've got a doppelbock that tastes like it's filled with honey.

So that's why my kolsch tastes like honey

 

[helibrewer]

I was actually just about to post a reply to one of my own topics on this matter. I just used White Labs German Ale/Kölsch yeast and fermented at 55F, which is its lowest limit. Check out the byproduct levels tested by White Labs.

http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp029.html

The diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione more than triple when you ferment at temperatures that low. I gave my beer a week-long diacetyl rest and even still I've got a doppelbock that tastes like it's filled with honey.

Yes but....
The diacetyl detection threshold is .05-8ppb which is 50-800ppm. The 55F diacetyl is barely into the lower range of the flavor threshold.

The 2,3 -pentanedione threshold is 1ppm which is 1000ppb, the amount in the White Labs test is way below the threshold.

 

[rinhaak]

I was looking at doing the WYeast strain anyhow, which can go down to 55° according to the website.

In answer to bribo179, I'm already lagering a bock and fermenting an IPL. I wanted a quick turnaround beer (couple of weeks) that I could do without waiting the full three months from start to finish.