Janet Brown Finished at 1.022 FG

[Adam78K]

Hey guys have no clue whats going going here because I'm 5 points over what the recipe is supposed to be at 1.017. I pitched a 1.7 L starter of Wyeast 1056 American Yeast on a stir plate. Aerated the wort as usual and have never had a problem with a beer under attenuating. The beer started out fermenting like crazy but now is a air bubble every minute or so which I'm super confused about because that signs of fermentation still but I have taking a hydrometer reading 3 days in a row and has been a steady 1.022. Let me remind you that the hydrometer is calibrated to distilled water and is not off. I pitched the yeast at 64 F, and every day raised the temperature 2 F. So for the final 2/3 of fermentation raised the temperature up to 71 F to ferment completely. This has been on a temperature controller the entire time. The only reason I can think that there is such a high FG, I swaped to Wheat malt with Torrified Wheat. Let me know, any help would be greatly appreciated and here was the recipe if you want to look it over.

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Vandalized Brown
Brewer: Adam Korby
Asst Brewer:
Style: American Brown Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 6.00 gal
Boil Size: 6.87 gal
Estimated OG: 1.065 SG
Estimated Color: 19.9 SRM
Estimated IBU: 61.8 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 71.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
11.00 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 73.33 %
1.25 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 8.33 %
1.25 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 8.33 %
1.00 lb Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) Grain 6.67 %
0.50 lb Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3.33 %
1.25 oz Northern Brewer [10.30 %] (60 min) Hops 34.7 IBU
2.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.00 oz Northern Brewer [10.30 %] (60 min) (Mash Hops 5.5 IBU
1.00 oz Northern Brewer [10.30 %] (15 min) Hops 13.8 IBU
1.50 oz Cascade [5.30 %] (10 min) Hops 7.8 IBU
1.50 oz Cascade [5.30 %] (0 min) Hops -
1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [Starter Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Adam Korby Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 15.00 lb
----------------------------
Adam Korby Batch Sparge
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
60 min Step Add 16.00 qt of water at 172.4 F 154.0 F
10 min Step Add 18.00 qt of water at 190.7 F 172.0 F


Notes:
------
Water Profile
Starting Water (ppm):
Ca: 8.9
Mg: 1
Na: 6.8
Cl: 4
SO4: 2
CaCO3: 17.5

Mash / Sparge Vol (gal): 4 / 4
RO or distilled %: 0% / 0%

Total Grain (lb): 15
Non-Roasted Spec. Grain: 1.25
Roasted Grain: 0.5
Beer Color (SRM): 19.9

Adjustments (grams) Mash / Boil Kettle:
CaSO4: 6 / 6
CaCl2: 2 / 2
MgSO4: 2 / 2
NaHCO3: 0 / 0
NaCl: 0 / 0
CaCO3: 0 / 0
Lactic Acid (ml): 0
Sauermalz (oz): 0

Mash Water / Total water (ppm):
Ca: 135 / 135
Mg: 13 / 13
Na: 7 / 7
Cl: 68 / 68
SO4: 275 / 275
Cl to SO4 Ratio: 0.25 / 0.25

Alkalinity (CaCO3): 18
RA: -87
Estimated pH: 5.07

Mash
A.) Added 16 qts water to mash tun at 178 F. Water stabilized at 154 F for 60 mins.
B.) Added all the salts and then took the pH and it read 5.3.
C.) First runnings read 1.102
D.) Collected total of 2.5 gallons.
E.) Added 18 qts of water at 189 F, stabilized at 170 F for 10 mins.
F.) Collected total of 6.25 gallons of water.
G.) Final gravity of all runnings read 1.091.

Boil
A.) Added the rest of the salt.
B.) Added .75 gallons of water to dillute boil, gravity read 1.079.
C.) Added 60 mins hop addition of NB
D.) Added 15 mins hop addition NB.
E.) Added 10 mins additon Cascade with worth chiller and irish moss
F.) Added 0 mins hop addition Cascade.
G.) Final gravity 1.061 with 6 gallons of water.

Yeast
A.) Pitched American yeast at 62 F to a 65 F fermentor.

Fermentation
3/12/11- Fermenting temperture is 64 F and started to bubble at 10:30 PM.
3/13/11 -Raised fermentation temperture to 67 F, still bubbling.
3/14/11- Raised Fermentation temperture to 68 F, still bubbling.
3/14/11- 6:20 PM, gravity ready 1.022, raised temperture to 70 F.
3/15/11 - 7:00 PM Raised temperture to 71 F.
3/16/11 - Temperture at 71 F, graivty read 1.022.

 

[benbradford]

how old was the yeast? was it ever too cold in package? you made starter, and had some kind of activity on the stirplate? thought about pitching a nuetral nottingham or such to finish?

 

[elproducto]

I've brewed Janet's Brown 3x now, and it always finishes at 1.011 or 1.010. I use US-05, but it shouldn't matter. I ferment at 65 for a week, and raise to 68 for dry hopping.

 

[Adam78K]

Was brand new yeast only about a week old. Took it out of the fridge like usual to let it warm up then popped it. It began to swell. After a couple of hours I pitched the yeast into a 1.7 L starter that was on a stir plate for 48 hrs and then cooled the starter in a fridge for 24 hrs. Took it out on brew day the next day and was visible yeast on the bottom of the starter, so decanted off liquid like usual. Left a little liquid from starter in it. Let the starter come to room temperature for a few hours on a starter and then pitched the yeast at 64 F. Have no clue whats going on here, could it be the 1 lb of torrified wheat that I used instead of white wheat?

 

[sleepystevenson]

IMHO, it's not the wheat.

Do you always dough in with such a thick mash? It looks like you used about 1 qt strike water per pound of grain. I know when I have mashed that thick in the past, I have always gotten a higher FG. I have tried everything from 1 qt to 2 qt per lb grain strike water and have found that the thin mashes lend themselves to a more fermentable wort with a lower FG and the thicker mashes lend themselves to a less fermentable wort. I have settled on 1.5 qts for the most part. Maybe you dough in this way every time, or maybe it was mash tun space constraints this time.

Another question - are you confident in you mashtun thermometer's accuracy? I see your sacc. rest was 154, but if your thermo is reading a couple degrees low, that would put your rest up into more dextrous wort territory. I think mine was about 2 degrees low, and I was having the same problem with a high FG.

Also - I see you mashed for 1 hr, which is what I standardly use, as well. However, I have found that a longer (90 min) mash will make for a more fermentable wort. I have used longer mashes on beers I want to be very dry - usually light "pseudo" lagers - with Notty yeast fermented low to reduce ester production for a very lager like beer. However, I guess this really doesn't apply to your case. Just an observation.

Of course - YMMV and these are just my experiences.

You seem quite experienced and organized with your notes, which will help you analyze your process.

Good luck

 

[Montanaandy]

Yeah, impressive notes.

A bit of a puzzle. I ran into a similar situation with a red satin recipe that I brewed. I used White Labs Cry Havoc which I was told was similar to Pac Man. It isn't - at least was not based on my experience. It stalled around 1.020 and is way too sweet for my tastes. This recipe also had torrified wheat so perhaps there is something. When I brew a hefe using malted wheat I don't have attenuation problems.

 

[elproducto]

You really should get it drier.. whether that means adding a pack of US-05/Notty, or what. This is my favorite beer, but it really needs to be drier.

 

[Adam78K]

Calibrated the thermometer before and also it is a thermoworks one so don't that would be the problem. I usually never had a problem with the yeast pooping out on me but good observation with the thick mash can't believe I didn't see that. I usuall always go 1.25 Qts per lb of grain so this could be the reason. Any more input guys, I really appreciate all the help

 

[jfowler1]

Again, you are taking great notes, and honestly, your process looks great; it should be pretty bulletproof.

As someone else noted, your thermometer could be a bit off, but you seemed really confident that you mashed at 154F, so I am going to trust that number is accurate. Besides, Lagunitas IPA is mashed at 160, uses an English Yeast that should not ferment as far as the Chico strain, and still finishes lower than 1.022. For that reason, I am ruling out the mash temp. For someone as thorough as you, I am going to rule out all issues related to faulty equipment.

It leaves two possibilities, and both are ingredients.

1. Carapils. Mike includes it in the Janet's Brown, IMO, because he wants to maintain a full mouthfeel in the finished product. Perhaps he found that a 154 mash in his system dried out the beer more than he wanted, so Carapils was incorporated into the recipe. Actually, almost all of his recipes (Pliny clone w/ NB kicker, Tasty APA, Janet's Brown) include carapils. I imagine if you asked Jamil, he would exclude the carapils because it contributes much more to body than to flavor, and body is something you can tweak with mashing. Mashing seems to be a process you have a really good grasp of, and I bet you could eliminate/reduce the carapils on your next batch and still have the mouthfeel and flavor Mike intended for the recipe. Everyone's mash results in wort of slightly different fermentability. Your 154F may be Mike's 160F; hence the Carapils.

2. Wyeast 1056. Tod Mott from the Portsmouth Brewery in NH had an article a ways back in Zymurgy comparing 4 yeast options in a typical ale recipe.

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/1228/JAzym06_YeastDebate.pdf

You will see an interesting chart on page 5. His experiment showed WY1056 finishing a full degree plato (4 gravity points) higher than the US-05, and even higher than Cal Ale V (personally, I think WLP001 would have been a better choice for comparison). You will also see the Wyeast pack experienced a much longer lag time. I have heard before that some pople have less than stellar results with Wyeast, so you may have been destined to have low fermentibility from the start. However, I use White Labs myself, so I can't say from experience that this is true.

That said, I still lean towards eliminating the Carapils, because your system might not need it. Regardless, I am sure you will have a "Tasty" beer.

Joe

 

[Adam78K]

I do appReciate all the help guys I taste the beer and it doesn't seem overly sweet which leads me to think that it did ferementing out correctly if I didn't take a hydrometer reading. I just rembered on last thing that could affect it bit wouldn't think or would. I collected a total of 5.25 gallons of wort for the boil which is low so had to up it to 6 gallons by adding .75 gallons of water to the boil. Still very drinkable beer but maybe from the high mash temp, and also torrified wheat, and carapils it lead to a more unfermentable wort. Like the post said previously my mash temp affect can be different than tastys. I usually do use us05 and never had a problem so it could be 1056.

 

[sleepystevenson]

Jfowler - good point about the carapils. I missed that, but i also find that makes for a higher finishing gravity - especially in amounts over 5% of a grain bill