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Is this an infection I’m so confused

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Beenym88

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I’ve been all grain brewing for a year I have about 10 batches done nothing has ever gone wrong until now. I brewed a chocolate porter I put cocoa powder in the mash and end of boil then nibs during secondary. When I took hydrometer readings it looked slightly carbed. When I merged it it looked fine. I kegged it and carbed it and it’s pouring with the weirdest bubbles I’ve ever seen does anyone know what this is?
 

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IslandLizard

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Beer? Are you kidding? That looks like chocolate milk you poured out there!

If it's indeed beer, then yes, it surely looks infected. [Edits] That weird foamy, slimy look could well be an infection that lives in your beer, or maybe from the cocoa. Does it taste sourish or weird?

As long as your beer fermented OK, otherwise, it shouldn't make you sick, infections are usually harmless. How's the overall taste and smell of that beer?

It's probably so sludgy, because you transferred trub from your fermenter to the keg. That trub settles on the bottom of the keg, that's where the beer pours from.
 

jddevinn

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What coco powder did you use? Not a mix that has condensed milk correct? Did you soak the nibs in a liquor before adding?
 
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Beenym88

Beenym88

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What coco powder did you use? Not a mix that has condensed milk correct? Did you soak the nibs in a liquor before adding?
No the cocoa powder was good. I had the nibs in a vaccum sealed bag but did not sanatize them I read a lot of people say you don’t have to I’m thinking that was wrong
 

IslandLizard

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Cocoa, including powder, contains a lot of fat, oils, so that could explain the thick foaming too.
The color and opaque appearance likely due to cocoa powder still in suspension, probably together with yeast and trub.

How much cocoa powder did you use in total?
Why did you add part of that in the mash?
 
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Beenym88

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But the weird part is it when I opened my fermenting bucket it looked fine.
 

IslandLizard

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But the weird part is it when I opened my fermenting bucket it looked fine.
Did you take a sample for a gravity reading? Was it clear or already looking like chocolate milk?

The thick oily/slimy foaming can well be from the oils in the cocoa, and/or an infection. Infections usually exhibit sourness and/or funky flavors and aromas.
 
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Beenym88

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Did you take a sample for a gravity reading? Was it clear or already looking like chocolate milk?

The thick oily/slimy foaming can well be from the oils in the cocoa, and/or an infection. Infections usually exhibit sourness and/or funky flavors and aromas.
That’s how it looked the whole time and when poured hard always produced bubbles like that but not to that extent.
 

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extra proteins from the nibs creating some crazy efficient head retention??
 
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Beenym88

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So now I’ve got it sitting in my keezer not hooked up to a gas line and I let all the air out. Each time I go check on it I pull the pine and it lets a good bit of air out. Does that change things?
 

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Pfft, man I call shenanigans. I know what it looks like when you your kids blow bubbles in chocolate milk. J/k

Your beer will obviously still have some carbonation in suspension which will release over time. If it tastes fine the likely your problem is being caused by fats/oils of either the coco nibs or powder. Time will tell because if its infected it will get worse. Thats a crazy looking brew though.
Did you take a final gravity reading? If not, grab one and compare to your projected.

Edit: changed ouls to oils 3 times. Common Siri, wth.
 
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Beenym88

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OG was 1.062 FG was 1.02 stayed at that for several days I can’t seem to get it lower than that when using lactose
 

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So now I’ve got it sitting in my keezer not hooked up to a gas line and I let all the air out. Each time I go check on it I pull the pine and it lets a good bit of air out. Does that change things?
The beer will release the CO2 that it has in suspension into the headspace until it is balanced again. It will do that every time you release the pressure.
 

jddevinn

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Try pouring some of the beer through a coffee filter. Does it catch a bunch of trub and cocco that is still in suspension?
 
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Dgallo

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I used cocoa nibs a lot, that’s certainly not from the nibs. I’ve never used cocoa powder but I could see it happening from that if it isn’t pure cocoa power. What do you clean your kegs with? Any chance you used a soap product?
 
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Beenym88

Beenym88

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I used cocoa nibs a lot, that’s certainly not from the nibs. I’ve never used cocoa powder but I could see it happening from that if it isn’t pure cocoa power. What do you clean your kegs with? Any chance you used a soap product?
I use pbw and starsan. It was the first time I put beer in the keg with a good bit of starsan foam still in it.
 
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Beenym88

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Alright everyone thanks so much for responding it’s definitely not infected. That pic was take at 1030 this morning after a good old shake method carbonation. Now it does a little bit of that crazy bubbling but is goes away very fast I definitely think it’s from the fats. Here what it looks like now the weird head last for like 5 second it taste good except it’s over carbed for the style.
 

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Dgallo

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To be honest your last set of pictures prove something went wrong. If you have a high carb level in a dark beer your head production and retention should be through the roof. The lack of a true head and then how quickly it dissipates indicates to me massive amounts of oils or you in fact had an infection. Look at picture 3, that’s not normal film on a beer. A dark beer head should really look like this and hold about a 1/8-1/4 inch of head the entire time until it’s gone.
41941263-0878-4A8A-8D7E-6621C9D2FC39.jpeg
 
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Beenym88

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I’m hoping it’s not an infection it taste good. I used 8 ounces of 100% cocoa by reading the package that’s 45 grams of fat.
 

IslandLizard

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It's much clearer now. That first pic must have been the sludge pour.
As @Dgallo says, the oils from the cocoa must create havoc with the head formation.

The film floating on pic#3 is indeed abnormal for beer, could well be those oils and perhaps some cocoa colloids.
It does not look like an infection now.
Those big, quick fleeting bubbles are likely due to excessive oils interfering with head forming proteins. I had similar bubbles in an Oat Mild containing a metric ton of flaked oats (oats contain oils). No thick creamy head as in @Dgallo's picture above. Even at 40 psi there was basically no head. The beer was good though. :D
 
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Beenym88

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That makes me feel much better about it.
 

FromZwolle

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To be honest your last set of pictures prove something went wrong. If you have a high carb level in a dark beer your head production and retention should be through the roof. The lack of a true head and then how quickly it dissipates indicates to me massive amounts of oils or you in fact had an infection. Look at picture 3, that’s not normal film on a beer. A dark beer head should really look like this and hold about a 1/8-1/4 inch of head the entire time until it’s gone.
I’m hoping it’s not an infection it taste good. I used 8 ounces of 100% cocoa by reading the package that’s 45 grams of fat.
the fat is from emulsified oils and will certainly kill head retention.

The first picture looks a lot like a chocolate egg creme, which would make sense if the cocoa powder had powdered dairy and/or whey in it.

 

Dgallo

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It's much clearer now. That first pic must have been the sludge pour.
As @Dgallo says, the oils from the cocoa must create havoc with the head formation.

The film floating on pic#3 is indeed abnormal for beer, could well be those oils and perhaps some cocoa colloids.
It does not look like an infection now.
Those big, quick fleeting bubbles are likely due to excessive oils interfering with head forming proteins. I had similar bubbles in an Oat Mild containing a metric ton of flaked oats (oats contain oils). No thick creamy head as in @Dgallo's picture above. Even at 40 psi there was basically no head. The beer was good though. :D
God damn oats and it’s high lipid % lol
 

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To be honest your last set of pictures prove something went wrong. If you have a high carb level in a dark beer your head production and retention should be through the roof. The lack of a true head and then how quickly it dissipates indicates to me massive amounts of oils or you in fact had an infection. Look at picture 3, that’s not normal film on a beer. A dark beer head should really look like this and hold about a 1/8-1/4 inch of head the entire time until it’s gone. View attachment 703422
Off topic. Can you start a thread on this masterpiece?
 

Dgallo

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Off topic. Can you start a thread on this masterpiece?
I think I might have One. It’s my schwarzbier. I’ll look too see and pm you the link
 
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Beenym88

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the fat is from emulsified oils and will certainly kill head retention.

The first picture looks a lot like a chocolate egg creme, which would make sense if the cocoa powder had powdered dairy and/or whey in it.

the fat is from emulsified oils and will certainly kill head retention.

The first picture looks a lot like a chocolate egg creme, which would make sense if the cocoa powder had powdered dairy and/or whey in it.

Omg it does what is a chocolate egg cream outside of Cadbury!? Also my recipe did have a pound of oats in it too.
 
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FromZwolle

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Omg it does what is a chocolate egg cream outside of Cadbury!? Also my recipe did have a pound of oats in it too.
never had one, but i think it's just chocolate milk and seltzer water.
 
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