How long milled grain good to use?

[Presbrewterian Pastor]

I found a box in my basement with two all-grain kits from two years ago. Everything (grain, hops, etc.) never opened. Do we think its still good to use?

 

[kev211]

I would think no, but seeing as how you already bought them, might as well brew them up right? 8 bucks worth of yeast and you have yourself a little experiment!

 

[hotbeer]

The malts are probably good. However if they smell moldy toss them. But as long as they were dry all the time, they should be fine. Even if the temps were high.

The hops might be okay. If the hops smell good to you when opened, they should be good enough. Though I don't know if their bittering ability changes with age. If they were vacuum sealed all the better for them being okay, IMO.

Dry yeast? Is there a expiration date on it? It actually holds up well even after the expiration date. I just used a packet of US-05 that was nine months out of date and it did well. But I did have enough for it to be a overpitch. If the date on the yeast is long past, I might get some more. But I might not. Just depends on if I'm in a mood to see how out of date something can be or whether I definitely want to mitigate all risks.

I'd still brew them up. The finished beer will be the only way to know for certain if you shouldn't have bothered. While it might not be the beer it was supposed to be, it'll be beer.

If you do choose to get more yeast, and it's a unknown packet of dry yeast, then consider the style of beer and just get a dry or liquid yeast that is appropriate for that style. And you also have the option to get more hops. But then you are almost getting to the point of making your own new kit.

 

[mac_1103]

I guess it depends on how it's packaged and how it was stored. Your title asks specifically about the milled grain, which is probably quite stale unless it was vacuum packed. I guess some people would suggest tasting it (and some would suggest tossing it). But two years at ambient temperature certainly didn't help your hops, even if they are vacuum packed.

 

[Presbrewterian Pastor]

I guess it depends on how it's packaged and how it was stored. Your title asks specifically about the milled grain, which is probably quite stale unless it was vacuum packed. I guess some people would suggest tasting it (and some would suggest tossing it). But two years at ambient temperature certainly didn't help your hops, even if they are vacuum packed.

The grain was not vacuum packed, just in a plastic bag. The hops are vacuum packed. No expiration date on the hops.

 

[mac_1103]

There are online calculators available for hop alpha acid loss, but they might require information that isn't available on the package. There are other members who know a lot more about using those then I do. Maybe some of them will chime in.

I guess if they still smell good and hoppy they should still be useful for aroma, and you can use some fresher bittering hops along with them.

 

[hotbeer]

The grain was not vacuum packed, just in a plastic bag.

With that old yeast I used, I also had a bag of 2 row that was 1½ years old. It was just sitting in my garage in a bag that wasn't vacuum sealed either. I just bottled the beer an hour ago. It seems to taste fine and I can't wait till it's finished carbonating and conditioning.

About a third of the hops were old too. They still smelled good, but I could tell the new hops of the same type were fresher by the smell.

If you don't have to have perfect beer that kit might have made fresh, then I'd be fairly certain you'll be happy enough with it if you don't make any of the common mistakes that would mess up even a beer made with fresh ingredients. Though again, if the hops don't smell good, they won't make good beer.

 

[mac_1103]

I also had a bag of 2 row that was 1½ years old.

Crushed?

 

[Miraculix]

Prepare for almond flavour from the oxidised grains. That's what I always got when brewing with milled grains that have been lying around for longer than a few days or weeks. Waste of time, if you ask me.

 

[hotbeer]

Crushed?

Oh! I didn't think of that. Even though it was in the title! No mine wasn't crushed.

Still if it doesn't smell bad or taste bad and isn't full of weevils or bugs I'd still do the kits. Some here have claimed to brew with malts full of bugs.

Between tossing them or brewing them, I'd brew them. Just for the experience if nothing else. And to see how bad or not, old ingredients taste.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I found a box in my basement with two all-grain kits from two years ago. Everything (grain, hops, etc.) never opened. Do we think its still good to use?

The ingredients (crushed grains, hops, dry yeast), stored at typical basement temperatures (55F winter, 65F summer?), for two years, are reasonably beyond their "best by" dates. Suppliers are often conservative with those "best by" dates.

The question, for you, is where do you "cut your losses" on these old kits?

If you have spare time, brewing the kits would be one use of the time but there are other uses of that time.

If you decide to brew it, and then package it, and find it tastes "good enough", enjoy.

Otherwise, life it too short to drink bad beer.

 

[Presbrewterian Pastor]

The ingredients (crushed grains, hops, dry yeast), stored at typical basement temperatures (55F winter, 65F summer?), for two years, are reasonably beyond their "best by" dates. Suppliers are often conservative with those "best by" dates.

The question, for you, is where do you "cut your losses" on these old kits?

If you have spare time, brewing the kits would be one use of the time but there are other uses of that time.

If you decide to brew it, and then package it, and find it tastes "good enough", enjoy.

Otherwise, life it too short to drink bad beer.

Yeah I think I need to cut my losses. I don't want to brew two kits and have them taste even "kinda" bad. Can't put a $ amount on my time but it's worth something and I don't want to waste it.

 

[mac_1103]

Some here have claimed to brew with malts full of bugs.

They don't eat much.

 

[toxdoc49]

I've got a similar situation with milled grain that is at least one year old. I wanted to incorporate some of the specialty grains into a porter recipe, but it might not be a very good idea to use them. Sounds like it is better to toss them. Although they don't smell funny and have been stored in the basement dry. Too much of a chance to end up with a off flavor beer?

 

[Broken Crow]

specialty grains into a porter recipe

If you use them, it won't be likely to produce a tosser, but it also won't be what it could be with fresh grains. Using old pre-milled grain will always lose something, but I suspect darker grains lose the most....ask me how I know and ask yourself just how "good" do you want this beer to be.
I recently gave away my old grains to some very grateful chickens...IMHO; the best use for them.

 

[toxdoc49]

If you use them, it won't be likely to produce a tosser, but it also won't be what it could be with fresh grains. Using old pre-milled grain will always lose something, but I suspect darker grains lose the most....ask me how I know and ask yourself just how "good" do you want this beer to be.
I recently gave away my old grains to some very grateful chickens...IMHO; the best use for them.

Thanks; now that you mention it, my chickens might be just as grateful for them! Better use than taking a chance.

 

[ClaudiusB]

They don't eat much.

The attached pictures show my successful breeding of great-looking bugs for a beer camp.
They went through two bags in no time.

 

[Broken Crow]

The attached pictures show my successful breeding of great-looking bugs for a beer camp.
They went through two bags in no time.

Have you ever considered a career as a producer of PSA's? I'm NEVER leaving grain sit around and waiting again!!!!!

 

[MaxStout]

On the one hand, I hate to waste ingredients. On the other, my time is too valuable to waste, making mediocre (or worse) beer.

Toss 'em out, or put them in the compost bin, feed the birds, etc.

Buy fresh ingredients and make better beer.

 

[worlddivides]

Both in regards to the original post and the new post from yesterday... I've always heard that unmilled grains are good for 6-12 months and that milled grains are good for 2-3 months with specialty grains tending to be good for a bit longer (up to 18 months unmilled is the number I always heard/read). And that's assuming they're being stored in a cool, dry location and properly (so that critters can't get into them and so they aren't freely exposed to oxygen). Either way, 1 year or 2 years would both be way past the expiration date for milled grains and even after the expiration date for unmilled grains (with 2 years also being past the expiration for the longest specialty grains). For the hops, if they were stored in the freezer those whole 1-2 years, they'd probably still be good (since hops can last for a pretty crazy long period of time in the freezer, like 3, 4, 5 years), but if they were stored at room temperature, they could have lost their entire viability. For dry yeast, 2 years is around the limit of how long they can be good for, so it's possible but not highly likely. If they were stored in the fridge that whole time, the chance would be better, but 2 years is a long time for yeast.

 

[day_trippr]

I've always heard that unmilled grains are good for 6-12 months

Unmilled grains may spend that much time in a silo...

Cheers!

 

[mac_1103]

For dry yeast, 2 years is around the limit of how long they can be good for, so it's possible but not highly likely. If they were stored in the fridge that whole time, the chance would be better, but 2 years is a long time for yeast.

The people who make the dry yeast disagree. See page 16 of this document:

THE SHELF LIFE OF FERMENTIS YEAST IS 3 YEARS FROM THE PACKAGING DATE, when stored below 15°C (59°F) for an extended period of time (more than 6 months). For shorter periods of time (up to 6 months), it is acceptable to store yeast at temperatures up to 24°C (75°F).

Several HBT members say they've used much older dry yeast without issue.

 

[worlddivides]

The people who make the dry yeast disagree. See page 16 this document:

THE SHELF LIFE OF FERMENTIS YEAST IS 3 YEARS FROM THE PACKAGING DATE, when stored below 15°C (59°F) for an extended period of time (more than 6 months). For shorter periods of time (up to 6 months), it is acceptable to store yeast at temperatures up to 24°C (75°F).

Several HBT members say they've used much older dry yeast without issue.

Good point. And, despite what I wrote above, I have seen those Brulosophy exBEERiments where they've used expired yeast and really old milled grains where they were unable to achieve significance (i.e. without enough tasters being able to taste the difference between the old milled grains and expired yeast and the fresh grains and new yeast). Of the three elements (milled grains, hops, and yeast), the yeast is the most likely to still be usable after 2 years, while the hops are the least likely with the grains probably pretty stale.

 

[worlddivides]

Unmilled grains may spend that much time in a silo...

Cheers!

I'm guessing that brewers/homebrewers tend to underestimate how long unmilled grains are good for since that 6-12 month number for base malts seems to be pretty ubiquitous.

 

[mac_1103]

I have seen those Brulosophy exBEERiments where they've used expired yeast and really old milled grains where they were unable to achieve significance

They never achieve significance. Because they are statistically illiterate.

 

[Closet Fermenter]

They don't eat much.

I don’t worry so much about how much they eat, but rather how much comes out the other end!