how long did it take you to get good?

[jhudson3030]

I would like to compare myself to some others. Not all of my beer has turned out geat or even good for that matter. That being said my beer now is lots better than it was in the beggining. So my question is, how long or how many batches did you have to choke down before you started having consistantly tasty batches.

 

[Spartangreen]

4

 

[jhudson3030]

and I'd like to add, what were some of the things you were doing wrong? I think one of my main reasons for error was fermentation temperatures

 

[RichBrewer]

I've never had a batch that didn't taste good with the exception of a Christmas beer that had spices and orange peel in it. It was one of my first beers and it just didn't taste good at all. I dumped it after a couple months. Everything else has been good to very good from my brewery.

Up until recently, all of my beers fermented at about 64 degrees in the basement.

 

[morticaixavier]

I'd say it took about 5 years before I broke down and figured out my temp control and learned to use enough yeast. so that's about how long it took for me beers to start being consistently good.

Some of the beers I brewed during those 5 years were fantastic by the way but some were big hot messes.

 

[BBL_Brewer]

Kind of hard to judge, since I was drinking my beer way too early when I first started.

 

[Renegades_Brew]

I'll say 1.5... granted I only can do partial mash as I don't have enough room for all grain yet.

The reason 1.5 is my first batch was a whiskey stout. While I didn't consider it that great, others were loving it. My second batch was my first time cherry wheat that I completely flubbed when I bottled it using corn syrup... granted I was able to rescue it by slowly transferring all bottles to a keg and force carbing about 10 months later.

 

[JohnSand]

It probably took me ten months and twenty batches to be consistently good enough to serve. There were a few of good batches before that, but after they really started looking and tasting like craft beer.

 

[kh54s10]

My second batch, I started the ferment on my first too warm and per advise I left it in primary and secondary longer. The second was finished first. Now 2 3/4 years later not a bad batch yet. Most are very good, a few just good, and a few were exceptional.

If you pay attention to detail, sanitation, and don't do anything strange, All your beers should be good.

 

[dstranger99]

Fermentation temps always screwed mine up in the early days, Once I got that down, got a wort chiller, and added more than 1 packet of yeast, things got alot better.

 

[mmb]

I wouldn't say that the first few batches were bad, but paying attention to fermentation temps, proper yeast pitches, and sanitation processes made a huge difference in my beer.

Ingredients are much better now than 13 years ago. Recently brewed some extract batches and the extract isn't that tin can aged stuff we used to get.

 

[Rivenin]

bout 4-5 in i think? i was gauging beer temps, finally bought a fermometer... immediately invested in a swamp cooler, and about 3-4 batches after that, i bought a wine fridge to use as a temp controller... faults of bad beer since have been water, which i've been concentrating on

 

[progmac]

it's an interesting question.

how long does it take to become a 'good' chef? quite a while, i think.

i can sometimes (ok, rarely) knock a dish out of the ballpark, but i am not a good chef. i do have one or two dishes that i can make well. and i have trouble reproducing those.

one thing that has changed, barring infection, my beers pretty much come out how i expect. well, not always. if i don't like something, i can usually identify it and i know what to change next time. i stopped using terms like 'homebrew flavor' and 'twang'

 

[MindenMan]

Well over a year, more like a year and a half. I don't know how many batches I have brewed, but rookie mistakes, sometimes even now, sneak up. I thought, how much money I could save my re-using my yeast cake? In the beginning, $8.00 a batch, as time went by, my yeast were tainted from too many re-pitches. Over attenuating, unpredictable rate of fermentation, and slightly "off" flavors. Bad Ju-ju. I also wasn't watching my ferm temps close enough either. So I was paying for my yeast, with bad product, I just didn't know it at the time. The yeast I use now is all second generation from a "mother" I have in the fridge. My techniques are much better now, and even good enough to win a Best of Category, of which I am very proud. My wife is my biggest supporter, and honest as well. If the beer is good or not, or not enough, I take her word for it. She was the reason I entered the contest I recently won. The first contest I entered was two years ago, and I got hung out to dry. The beer really did suck... Sorry for the long post.

P.S. I really love my wife.

 

[soccerdad]

Ask me again in 5 years. I'm only 5 years in.

 

[YNOT2K]

When (if?) I ever become a "good" brewer - I'll let you know.

Always learning, adjusting process, recipes, etc...

My beer ain't bad, local craft brewers and BJCP judges have tasted it and said it was good - but it will always have room for improvement.

 

[Genuine]

I haven't had any bad batches as of yet and I've been brewing for about 2 years now. Because of the mount of time and effort it takes to make beer, I'm very careful and particular about cleaning, sanitation and methods with the equipment I have. I've had beers where I didn't hit my numbers or were under by a few gravity points but haven't had any bad/off flavors. I'm to the point where I want to upgrade to a Rims/Herms system but trying to figure out the best way to go about it.

 

[poptarts]

Your beer will taste like butt cheeks until you figure out good fermentation temp and yeast pitch rate. After that its all the recipe. Also several of my brews had a plastic taste that temp control and campten got rid of instantly.

 

[Brewmenn]

I've been awesome right from the beginning.

But really, I've only brewed a couple so far and thought they we're decent. So I guess it depends on what you mean "good".

 

[heckler73]

2 batches.

The first was OK - it was beer. Made it with 1 packet dry yeast. Drinkable, and good enough to keep me interested.

Second batch was an extract imperial IPA - 13 lbs malt extract, partial boil, 5 oz hops and one packet dry yeast. That beer got cellared for 2 years hoping it would lose the boozy, headache inducing alcohol level. It was disgusting. I kept cracking one, trying half a glass and then dumping it.

After that, I changed to wyeast smack packs, yeast starters and eventually full boils and now finally all grain (4 batches in). 39 batches later, not a single beer has not been enjoyed.

A yeast change is the easiest and best improvement you'll make if you're using dry yeast.

 

[b-boy]

Any day now. At least that's what I tell myself.

 

[davekippen]

I don't think I will ever be totally happy with my output. I do make very good beer (usually) after 3 years but there is always something to improve on. If you don't think there is, you are kidding yourself.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[AerationStation]

It's hard to say because as I've gotten better at brewing I've gotten better at tasting. My definition of "good" now is wayyyyyyy different from my definition of "good" a few years ago. It's hard to pin down

 

[Clonefan94]

To get "Good" is a really tough thing to answer. I think I am really good at brewing one beer. My amber. I have the recipe down pat and you cannot tell one batch from another. I have swapped some ingredients out before, using different crystal malts and have swapped out hops and only then could I tell there was a difference in the beer.

My other beers I think are still pretty good as I seem to have my system tuned pretty well, but basically, to use the chef analogy from above, I'd consider myself a good cook right now. I have the tools, know how to use them, can repeat a recipe pretty well, but as far as being innovative, really being able to predict what results may come from tweaks, or really stepping out and designing quality beers every time out, I'm still a ways off from that.

I'm pretty lucky in that things have always fallen into place pretty easily for me. My mash is almost always within a good ph range without doing anything to it. My water quality is good once I get out the chlorine. My basement temps usually fall in a range that temperature control for my fermentation is no more than a towel and an ice pack. And I've always been a troubleshooter and tinkerer since I was a little kid. So if something seems a little off, I'm pretty good at breaking things down and finding the issue.

As far as truly "Good" goes though, I'll probably have no idea beyond what my friends say and what my taste buds say. I really have no urge to join a competition, so I doubt I'll ever have any proof saying weather or not my brews are good. I know my friends call me to come over to drink my beer and always ask me to bring it to parties. I really enjoy what I brew, so, that's good enough for me.

In the end though, proper fermentation, imo, is what really separates good beer from just beer. I'm obviously not the first one here to say it, but pitching the right amount of yeast at the right temperature really does a lot towards making good beer. As I said above, maybe I'm lucky in how everything comes together and I've always fancied myself a decent cook, so brewing is probably just an extension of that. I would think things would really have to go awry to not produce a wort, that with proper fermentation, wouldn't be decent.

I don't think it takes that long to become a good brewer. Following basic practices, learning your system and proper fermentation are all you really need to produce good beer. I think the tough step is moving to that next level. Producing great beer, that's the trick. Maybe it's just because there are so many mediocre commercial brews on the market, that I don't think there is anything that hard to producing a decent tasting, drinkable beer. The key is being able to produce that beer every time you brew, no matter what style you brew. That just takes years and years of practice. Like anything, you don't become good by reading about how to become good, you do it with practice.

 

[hunter_le five]

Shortly after joining this website. Seriously.

I spent my first few years of homebrewing literally just buying Brewer's Best kits and following the included instructions to a T. I did no outside research whatsoever, which is strange considering how much reading and research I put into my other hobbies (guns, motorcycles, hunting, etc). My beer was always "good" (read: drinkable), but never "great".

After I joined this site, I learned about:
1) temperature control
2) all-grain/mashing techniques
3) kegging
4) yeast starters/pitch rates
5) better fermentation practices
6) aeration
7) dozens of other little miscellaneous tips and tricks

My beer has gotten so much better since joining this sight and learning from everyone's collective knowledge. It's like I was brewing in the Dark Ages before.

 

[Malty_Dog]

I'm going to piggy back on hunter_la5's comments:

Shortly after joining this website. Seriously.

After I joined this site, I learned about:
1) temperature control
2) partial mash and all grain techniques
3) the value of full volume boils
4) yeast starters/pitch rates
5) aeration
6) a bunch more

Still early on (1.5 years or so) but one of the biggest compliments I ever received was from a fellow beer lover who, after sampling different batches of my beers over time, told me "I think you're at the point where you're not going to make a bad beer again." Now I doubt that highly but I really appreciated the comment. I owe most of that to the good people and resources on this site. :rockin:

 

[ajdelange]

Hasn't happened yet.

 

[jhudson3030]

This has probably been one of favorite posts yet!

 

[mgudmastad]

Good is relative. I like my beers, so do my friends.

I usually only a consider my beers good if I would pay money to drink it. I My beers improved with a combination of experience and better equipment. Brews significantly improved with the purchase of a wort chiller. They significantly improved with the purchase of a jet burner. But I also learn something almost every time I brew, i.e. hop/malt compatibility, better grain milling methods, mash techniques, etc.

 

[IvanBrew]

My very first batch was "good." So were the next several. "Good" meaning they were perfectly drinkable, even if they weren't great beers.

It all went to hell for about a year after that. I got cocky and thought I'd figured it all out. Instead of following published recipes, I started venturing off into the woods on my own. Most of what I brewed during that period (we'll just call it my Dark Ages) was horrible. I was in college, so I never dumped it, but I was usually the only one choking it down...

I finally woke up to the fact I just didn't have a clue. I went back to recipes, which fixed the problem, and started reading. I read every book I could get my hands on.

After another year or so, I started experimenting again. This time, I had enough experience and guidance to experiment in ways that still produced a drinkable beer. From there, my improvement has been steady.

I'd say it was 3-4 years before my friends were regularly asking me to bring beer to events, and probably another couple years before I'd comfortably put something I brewed up against a commercial example.

With resources like this forum, there's no reason that learning curve can't be cut dramatically, as long as you're open minded and inquisitive.

 

[BWE]

I'm going to have to agree with Malty Dog and Clonefan94. I've always brewed beers that taste good, and even other people liked them... or at least said they did.

But yes, once you get the yeast pitch rates and fermentation control down, your beer will take that step from tasting like a homebrewed beer, to tasting like a HOME BREWED BEER, if you know what I mean.

THIS sight has been incredible for me. I didn't find it till about 6 batches in. But after all the reading and researching, by efforts were not in vane. I can literally say I make good beer. Not great, not phenomenal, but good... with a once in a while great.

Oh, and don't forget about water. That's important.

 

[heckler73]

Good is relative, and you can always improve...

However, the question was (if you read the post, and not just the title)

"how many batches did you have to choke down before you started having consistently tasty batches?"


I read that as a new brewer wondering if he should stick with it or not because he's not liking the results.

 

[beersk]

it's an interesting question.

how long does it take to become a 'good' chef? quite a while, i think.

i can sometimes (ok, rarely) knock a dish out of the ballpark, but i am not a good chef. i do have one or two dishes that i can make well. and i have trouble reproducing those.

one thing that has changed, barring infection, my beers pretty much come out how i expect. well, not always. if i don't like something, i can usually identify it and i know what to change next time. i stopped using terms like 'homebrew flavor' and 'twang'

This is a good point. It does take a while and a lot of practice to become good at something. Sure, you can brew good beer your first batch, but I'll bet you money it won't be as good as your 100th batch. Or at least you'd think. I brewed a good beer on my 4th batch after 3 crappy batches. But, it's been hit and miss for the 5 1/2 years I've been brewing. It's getting to the point where most beers are turning out pretty good. But that's after dealing with an infection in my co2 system of my kegerator (caused from beer that backed up into the lines), figuring out water chemistry, learning how to formulate recipes, getting temp control...the list goes on. It's easy to make okay beer, it's hard as hell to make great beer. It's a never ending quest, I think. Wouldn't life be pretty boring if we could do and have exactly what we wanted at the snap of your fingers? (I'm almost positive some people would say "No" to that question). But for me, it's a yes. Part of the fun is the journey, the quest. Obviously, it's not fun if you never improve...

 

[Braufessor]

I have brewed on and off for 18 (ish) years. If I am being honest, I do not feel like I got to the point where I brewed consistently, really good beer until about 4 years ago.......So, it took me 14 years.

I definitely brewed some good beers along the way..... but, I brewed plenty of mediocre and bad ones too.

I brewed good dark beers more consistently than lighter beers or hoppy beers.

My biggest problems were:

#1 was sanitation, and using bleach for quite a while. PBW and StarSan have made a huge difference for me

#2 - my water is VERY hard and sucks for lighter/hoppy beers. Learning about water and adjusting with RO water has allowed me to brew very good beers of that variety now.

#3 - Healthy yeast starters and fermentation temperatures.

#4 - Just not really understanding what good beer was ....."ugly baby syndrome." "tastes good to me" is not the same thing as "tastes good." Entering competitions and getting a good deal of feed back has helped me really improve my beers and dial them in.

 

[beersk]

Hasn't happened yet.

So, does this mean that water chemistry isn't the end of the line for producing great beer? I'm surprised to read you saying this...

 

[opiate82]

I would say it took maybe 1/2 dozen batches before I put out my first "craft quality" brew. But I probably put at least twice as much time as it took to brew those beers into reading and researching.

 

[SavaShip]

I will let you know when I get good. After years of practice, I can hit most of my numbers, and produce drinkable, enjoyable, clean beers... Is that what good is though... My SRM is usually darker than I calculate, and IBU's are normally a few higher than I plan for. Until I can make everything exactly the way I intend, I'll consider myself mediocre at best.

 

[jhudson3030]

I read that as a new brewer wondering if he should stick with it or not because he's not liking the results.[/QUOTE]

I've been happy with my results just not "thrilled" I have no plans what so ever of quitting now. I already feel like I've developed and addiction! And I'm so happy to have read all these posts because it lets me know what the future may hold!

 

[BBBF]

It took me a few years to get out of the "I can ferment that" phase, where I wanted to experiment with everything. It also took about the same amount of time for me to move out of the hot apartment and into a house with a cooler basement. I still haven't gotten to controlled fermentation, but I'm better at trying to match styles to ambient temperature.

 

[prohl84]

I think it's possible to be a 'good' brewer w/o making consistently great beer. I practiced great sanitation from the beginning and I think that's the first step to being a good brewer. A happy, healthy yeast population is an extremely close second.

A great brewer otoh has a solid grasp of most, if not all, aspects of the brewing process and should be able to troubleshoot/ correct just about any flaw in that process.

I hope I can be great one day.

A master brewer can reverse engineer any beer and nail BJCP guidelines every time.