How do you store and then repurpose cornys?

[Cider Wraith]

After taking a corny temporarily out of service and after a thorough cleaning how do you temporarily store it until next needed? Do you try to get it completely dry? Because without waiting days/weeks that doesn't work in my experience. So then if it's stored with a hint of water isn't that a place that microbial activity could set up? So far I have stored upright with the lid detached which allows air-borne debris to enter, so some degree of re-washing is in order, a Starsan treatment at the minimum. What have you had good luck with? Thanks -

 

[day_trippr]

After cleaning I let the kegs drip dry up-side-down then lid and store upright...

Cheers!

 

[Cider Wraith]

After cleaning I let the kegs drip dry up-side-down then lid and store upright...

Cheers!

My goof-up is that after drip-drying upside-down for days then when turning right-side-up there always more water appearing that was hiding in the tubes

 

[day_trippr]

Yeah, that happened early on. Since then I keep a spare beer QD handy for draining the long dip tube. The gas side I just poke the poppet for a second...

Cheers!

 

[IslandLizard]

Good thinking of addressing this!

Most of my kegs get cleaned, then 100% Starsan pre-purged, and left empty with a little bit of Starsan in the bottom from leaking back. On next use I push that last bit out before filling with beer.

The ones used for fermentation, etc. (not for finished beer) get a last "rinse/shake" with 1/2 - 1 gallon of Starsan.
I dump most of it out, back into the Starsan bucket.
Then with some pressure (12-15 psi) I push the rest out through both dip tubes and posts as well as the PRV, until it sputters.
They then get stored (indoors) under the leftover 10-15 psi.

Question:
Is leaving them that way going to be problematic, especially the ones that weren't 100% Starsan prepurged? Reason is, there's a significant amount of air (O2) left in those kegs, (about 50%), along with CO2.
Potential mold formation? I've never seen or smelled any.

 

[Cider Wraith]

Wow @IslandLizard that is a great reply. Thanks for getting us thinking about these different angles

 

[PCABrewing]

Most of my kegs get cleaned, then 100% Starsan pre-purged, and left empty with a little bit of Starsan in the bottom from leaking back. On next use I push that last bit out before filling with beer.

That is basically my approach. Never have had any problem
I don't use 100% starsan, just the usual dilution. I leave maybe a 1/4 cup in the keg, then seal it and put 3-5 lbs of CO2 on it to keep it sealed. I know I have good seals when they hold pressure for 6 mos or so till i get around to it in the rotation. Always reassuring,
I rinse and re-sanitize before I fill them though.

 

[passedpawn]

I barely clean, dump some starsan solution in there, shake, and store outdoors. I have a rack on the side of my house.

 

[Cider Wraith]

I have a rack on the side of my house.

I'm sorry I don't understand what you mean. What is a rack?

 

[PCABrewing]

I barely clean, dump some starsan solution in there, shake, and store outdoors. I have a rack on the side of my house.

They probably get pretty hot in the Florida sun. Probably almost like an autoclave in there. .

 

[passedpawn]

I'm sorry I don't understand what you mean. What is a rack?

Shelves?

 

[Cider Wraith]

Shelves?

Ok. Upside down storage on outside shelves. Don't the opossums get interested?

 

[passedpawn]

Ok. Upside down storage on outside shelves. Don't the opossums get interested?

sideways storage. No worries. Been leaving all of my brewing gear on shelving in my side yard for 20+ years. No worries (the little anoles (lizards) do get into the fittings, but they shoot out when water is applied). I have always had hunting dogs here, and they keep the yard clear of any sort of varmint.

 

[lumpher]

I scrub them with a sponge with Starsan water, fill them up with starsan water, seal the lid with a couple quick bursts of co2, and put them off to the side.i dump the water when I'm ready to use them.

 

[Cider Wraith]

sideways storage. No worries. Been leaving all of my brewing gear on shelving in my side yard for 20+ years. No worries (the little anoles (lizards) do get into the fittings, but they shoot out when water is applied). I have always had hunting dogs here, and they keep the yard clear of any sort of varmint.

That is absolutely wild and crazy .... we're further north than you here in the Mid-Atlantic ... we've got an 11 coming up. Hard to imagine outside brewing operations outside

 

[Red over White]

That is absolutely wild and crazy .... we're further north than you here in the Mid-Atlantic ... we've got an 11 coming up. Hard to imagine outside brewing operations outside

I'm brew outside on a propane and electric system. Friday high here in NC is 47 in the morning and dropping to 25, I'm going to have to brew fast!

 

[passedpawn]

That is absolutely wild and crazy .... we're further north than you here in the Mid-Atlantic ... we've got an 11 coming up. Hard to imagine outside brewing operations outside

Not sure what that means, but yea we don't get snow here. I've never brewed indoors. Can't even imagine it ( I'm considering this event from my wife's eyes haha).

Anyway, anything made of stainless and plastic can be stored outdoors. My 15g keggles have been out there, in the southern exposure, for 15 yrs. No prob. Same for all the cornies. Heck, they like it, I did ask.

 

[Red over White]

@passedpawn just curious is your handle an en passant reference?

 

[passedpawn]

@passedpawn just curious is your handle an en passant reference?

nice. No, but I do know what that means. I'm an avid player.

[edit] to be clear, yes, my handle is a chess term. Happiness is a passed pawn. And believe me, I do push the pawns. I'll trade queens quickly in a game if possible, because I know I'll get my rooks behind a pawn and get her back.

 

[Red over White]

nice. No, but I do know what that means. I'm an avid player.

[edit] to be clear, yes, my handle is a chess term. Happiness is a passed pawn. And believe me, I do push the pawns. I'll trade queens quickly in a game if possible, because I know I'll get my rooks behind a pawn and get her back.

My brother and I play regularly, he whips out the queen early too. I play endgame from the start, tough against a strong player though.

 

[IslandLizard]

I don't use 100% starsan, just the usual dilution.

Sorry for the misunderstanding, I don't use 100% Starsan (concentrate) either. Starsan is always used at the regular working solution strength of 1 oz concentrate per 5 gallons of water.

The 100% I wrote refers to pre-filling the keg for 100% with Starsan. Then purging it all to leave behind a sanitized keg that's then 100% filled with CO2, containing no air/oxygen. That keg will receive beer, through a closed or semi-closed transfer, to eliminate O2 presence in the serving keg as much as possible.

 

[Cider Wraith]

The 100% I wrote refers to pre-filling the keg for 100% with Starsan. Then purging it all to leave behind a sanitized keg that's then 100% filled with CO2, containing no air/oxygen. That keg will receive beer, through a closed or semi-closed transfer, to eliminate O2 presence in the serving keg as much as possible.

Yes, exactly.

Thanks everyone or replies ... every reply is helpful

 

[chuckyboomboom]

After taking a corny temporarily out of service and after a thorough cleaning how do you temporarily store it until next needed? Do you try to get it completely dry? Because without waiting days/weeks that doesn't work in my experience. So then if it's stored with a hint of water isn't that a place that microbial activity could set up? So far I have stored upright with the lid detached which allows air-borne debris to enter, so some degree of re-washing is in order, a Starsan treatment at the minimum. What have you had good luck with? Thanks -

I always clean my kegs after use, rinse, then throw in 1/4-1/2 gal Starsan. I shake it up, pressurize to ~15psi, depress the liquid out until some sanitizer comes out, turn it upside down and depress the CO2 to let a bit leak out, and also the PRV. I stack them in a corner and leave them until I am ready to use again. When I am ready to fill, I shake it once and push the remaining sanitizer through my tap line. Then I open the top, purge w/CO2, and gravity fill with the new delicious brew. Works every time most of the time!

 

[TheBluePhantom]

I used to put the kegs on the keg cleaner with dip tubes in place, PBW wash, then sanitize with the same keg cleaner using the low foam sanitizer. The washer has a tube for pushing through the dip tubes as well. Then I would cap them, purge with CO2 and store upright in the basement.

One time I found little dots of something grown in the bottom, floating in the sanitizer. My best guess was that something had hidden in the crevices around the dip tubes, the CO2 purge was not 100%, and the sanitizer provided a liquid medium somehow. This was a triple failure to me.

Now I pull out the dip tubes to wash the kegs, wash, rinse and store upside down for a week or so, then loosely reassemble for longer storage. Storing them dry takes away the liquid medium for growth, the better wash takes away the food source. Yes there is oxygen, but that is all. When I go to use them I soak in StarSan and reassemble wet, then fill them. Have not seen any signs of growth since. Full teardown lets me check the o rings ( I always keep spares), and I don't worry about how long a keg has been in storage.

 

[tracer bullet]

Interesting how we all have different methods. Can't say mine is better or worse than any other but it is:

* Complete disassembly, 100%
* All pieces washed by hand with water and a dedicated sponge / brushes (I put a little strainer basket in the sink drain first)
* All lay on a towel ~ 24 hours to dry (I may come back halfway through and flip things over as needed)
* All parts go back into the keg and the lid (without o-ring) is put in place

This does leave a spot for things to go in via the in / out posts and lack of lid o-ring but I store them in a closet in the house and am not too worried.

When I am ready to use the keg I basically dump it out into a gallon or so of iodophor solution and let all those parts sit a bit. Some of the solution goes into the keg as well. I start assembling and once it's all together I dump the rest of the solution in and close the lid. Shake that all about for a few minutes then fill with water in preparation for my CO2 purge.

 

[odie]

full break down and cleaned. stored full break down open upside down. cleaned again prior to filling.

 

[Cider Wraith]

Lots of good replies. Around the time of making this post had thoroughly cleaned couple kegs and gave several days drying time, alternately upright and upside down until dry, then sealed lids and set aside. Opened them recently and they were wet and slimy inside. Naturally, condensation had formed on the walls and settled to the floor. So either upright or upside down, either way unsealed

 

[TheBluePhantom]

Slimy? What kind of humidity do you have? I have it rather humid in summer and I run a dehumidifier in the basement. This time of year I have to run a humidifier to stay comfortable. Since the humidifier is not downstairs the basement stays pretty dry. I still give the kegs a week to dry. I don't remember seeing any go slimy. Maybe your workspace is crazy humid.

 

[Cider Wraith]

Thanks for the reply. We're on the eastern seaboard and on warmer days working outside it's like taking a shower in one's clothes. I'm not a scientist but all I know otherwise dry kegs had a puddle of water on the floor

 

[Whisky River]

Lots of good replies. Around the time of making this post had thoroughly cleaned couple kegs and gave several days drying time, alternately upright and upside down until dry, then sealed lids and set aside. Opened them recently and they were wet and slimy inside. Naturally, condensation had formed on the walls and settled to the floor. So either upright or upside down, either way unsealed

I’ve had some similar experiences when storing sealed kegs. I had several kegs that I cleaned, sanitized with star San and then purged with co2. I was waiting a few weeks to use them for closed transfers but was forced to open them up, and they all smelled like vinegar and had some degree of slime, or residue in them.
Since then I try to: #1 dry them out completely and #2 don’t save purged kegs for longer than it takes to complete primary fermentation.

 

[Toblerone]

I always leave up to a litre of Starsan in my clean, sealed kegs and carboys. Airlocks on the carboys. Never had an issue with cleanliness, smell, or slime. Been doing that for well over a decade.

My cleaning:
Always disassemble everything, and pull the liquid tube (put inside keg). Soak everything in a hot PBW solution, with posts, rings, lid, etc, soaking in a small container (1 container per keg, so things don't get mixed up).
Leave soaking overnight. Rinse everything well. Spray everything with Starsan while reassembling.

If you have a vinegar smell, that's very likely an acetobacter infection. It found something to eat. You need to be more thorough in your cleaning.

 

[Whisky River]

If you have a vinegar smell, that's very likely an acetobacter infection. It found something to eat. You need to be more thorough in your cleaning.

Thanks for the suggestion. It is possible it’s a cleaning issue however I have a pretty comprehensive cleaning routine.

I think it’s also possible that purging the kegs with co2 from active fermentation allowed some biological compounds in which caused the problem. My thinking being that if the gas released from fermentation has a distinct beer smell then there must be some organic compounds carried by the gas which wind up in the purges kegs.

Regardless of the origin, my experience combined with the multiple accounts here of people finding black mound growing inside the lids of the clean containers they use to store Star San, makes me hesitant to store any container wet and sealed for any length of time.

But like all things YMMV.

 

[Toblerone]

Thanks for the suggestion. It is possible it’s a cleaning issue however I have a pretty comprehensive cleaning routine.

I think it’s also possible that purging the kegs with co2 from active fermentation allowed some biological compounds in which caused the problem. My thinking being that if the gas released from fermentation has a distinct beer smell then there must be some organic compounds carried by the gas which wind up in the purges kegs.

Regardless of the origin, my experience combined with the multiple accounts here of people finding black mound growing inside the lids of the clean containers they use to store Star San, makes me hesitant to store any container wet and sealed for any length of time.

But like all things YMMV.

Black mould will not grow/thrive on a microbiologically clean and sanitized surface. I argue that anyone finding mould on their equipment did not have a clean surface.

Some people also re-use the same sanitizer that they have been dunking questionable/dirty objects into for weeks (or longer), potentially creating a food source for mould...

When I put up to a litre of StarSan in my vessels: the sanitizer is fresh, and I shake it all around the vessels, ensuring that every surface gets sanitized.

If I encountered ANY mould, I would likely do another 100% clean/soak teardown, and replace all questionable parts (o-rings or bung as applicable).

Agreed - your fermentation gas could carry contaminants. An inline filter could reduce those contaminants. Using plenty of clean/fresh StarSan (shaken in the vessel occasionally) could also improve the sanitary conditions inside the vessel. I wouldn't be afraid to keep the vessels wet, as long as the conditions are clean and sanitary.

 

[Broken Crow]

I never let mine dry. I spent a fair amount of time experimenting and learning my routine by trying all the 'most recommended practices' I could find, mostly on this site, and evloved my routine of thoroughly washing then immediately sanitizing and purging my kegs. I'd intentionally open them up after a week or 3 to inspect and smell them, and I even pumped some boiled sugar-water into a sealed one and left it for 3 weeks to check for growths of any kind just to be sure I had my routine down.

 

[Yesfan]

Slightly off topic, but is there a particular brush some of you guys like to use to get to the bottom of the keg, especially if the keg is used as a fermenter?

One of those (new obviously) toilet brushes is great to use, but the handles seem a bit smallish compared to the height of the keg. I had to McGuyver a makeshift handle to use the same brush on my much taller 15 gallon corny keg.

 

[Broken Crow]

Slightly off topic, but is there a particular brush some of you guys like to use to get to the bottom of the keg, especially if the keg is used as a fermenter?

One of those (new obviously) toilet brushes is great to use, but the handles seem a bit smallish compared to the height of the keg. I had to McGuyver a makeshift handle to use the same brush on my much taller 15 gallon corny keg.

I was interested to see what others said as I always looking to improve, but since no-one else has answered: I use the white scotch brite / sponge pad and just reach in... it's the only way I feel sure I've got any gunk that may hide around the diptube... might not work for everyone though as I'm a skinny long-gangly-armed guy and I only just reach the bottom.

 

[Yesfan]

I was interested to see what others said as I always looking to improve, but since no-one else has answered: I use the white scotch brite / sponge pad and just reach in... it's the only way I feel sure I've got any gunk that may hide around the diptube... might not work for everyone though as I'm a skinny long-gangly-armed guy and I only just reach the bottom.

I did some looking around and found this on Amazon.

Tub and Tile Scrub Brush

It has an extendable handle, like you'd see for paint rollers, so I ordered it and see how it works. I've got a simple toilet style brush I have used for years, but the tip of the handle is just on the inside of the top of my kegs so it's a bit of a pain using it. For my 15 gallon corny, I took some paint stir-sticks and zip tied them to the brush as an extended handle. It was a bit clumsy, but worked.

 

[tracer bullet]

I was interested to see what others said as I always looking to improve, but since no-one else has answered: I use the white scotch brite / sponge pad and just reach in... it's the only way I feel sure I've got any gunk that may hide around the diptube... might not work for everyone though as I'm a skinny long-gangly-armed guy and I only just reach the bottom.

I use a blue one, and a similar process. My left arm just fits!

 

[CascadesBrewer]

My goof-up is that after drip-drying upside-down for days then when turning right-side-up there always more water appearing that was hiding in the tubes

Seems like a good way to avoid water hiding in the tubes is to not dry them with the tubes in place!

I always remove and clean the disconnect posts along with the gas and liquid diptubes. After a few days they are dry and ready to be stored. I typically store them with the disconnect posts loosely screwed back in place and the lid in place but not latched down. I keep my kegs in my finished basement so there is not a ton of dust. If needed, I will give them a quick rinse before sanitizing them.