How do you make (AG) wort for a starter?

[Dan]

I'd like to make wort to use in my yeast starter. I'll use 2-row barley and want to make around 1/2 gallon. Any help on water and grain volumes would be very much appreciated. Looking for gravity to be around 1.030 - 1.040

 

[mux]

No DME on hand?

 

[mux]

1.07 gal water to 10.7oz 2 row, BIAB
will give you around .5 gal at 1.035
At 72% efficiency
with .5 boil off at 60 min boil

 

[theonetrueruss]

seriously, just use dme for your starter

 

[rancidcrabtree]

If you're brewing on a budget $1.50 to buy a lb of grain to make a starter is a much nicer looking option than dropping $5 of a lb of DME.

 

[Revvy]

So are you gonna can it after and keep it on hand?

 

[Revvy]

seriously, just use dme for your starter

Why? Lots of folks make real wort starters, and can them for use later.

 

[Rev2010]

If you're brewing on a budget $1.50 to buy a lb of grain to make a starter is a much nicer looking option than dropping $5 of a lb of DME.

When you're only using like 3oz of DME are you really saving much doing an AG starter? That's like 5 starters per pound of DME. And there's no hassle of having to mash it.


Rev.

 

[theonetrueruss]

It seems like a lot of trouble to save an insubstantial amount of money. Maybe my perspective is out of wack. It seems pretty cheap for the few oz dme needed. If you want to make wort for it sure, you can save a few dollars. It won't make a hill of beans difference in your end product, just cost more time on a starter. I guess if you are already setup for canning then maybe it makes sense. For me, I'd need to by a pressure cooker and other canning supplies... dammit, now I am talking myself into going this route.. damn me

dme still seems easier... but hey... I guess if easy was the object we would just buy beer

 

[Revvy]

When you're only using like 3oz of DME are you really saving much doing an AG starter?

I pay .56 cents a pound for 2-row. The smallest amount of DME I can buy is a pound from my lhbs, for about 5 bucks, iirc.... Since most conversion is actually usually done after the first 20 minutes or so, you can easily make up several mason jars of starters in maybe an hour, 2 at most, and store them in the fringe after canning. Perfect thing to do on a winter or rainy afternoon on the stove when you got the brewing jones but don't really want to go outside. Heck with a two gallon cooler you can get a lot of them done.

And since it's technically brewing...it's fun to do, so "time" is not a factor for me.

And I don't have to slap my head and say, ****head you forgot the dme again....

 

[BradleyBrew]

What a great idea! So you could make a gallon (or two) of wort, rack to mason jars and store in the fridge? Then obviously boil them and proceed with the starter?

 

[Goblism]

i just did a quick BIAB for my starter wort, boiled for 15 minutes and cooled. 1 lb of two row was $0.70 and made about 3 quarts of good starter wort....good enough for me!
$6 for 1 lb at the LHBS, which equals roughly 1.7 lbs of 2-row, which yeilds a $4-5 savings...worth it for me. Just need to get a canner and I will make up numerous starter worts to grab in a hurry.

 

[rancidcrabtree]

$0.70 for a lb. of 2 row?? I might be making a drive out to Mankato soon!

 

[bwomp313]

or you could always brew a beer and save some of the runnings for yeast starters. boil it, cool it and refrigerate it in a sanitized container or freeze

 

[Dan]

No DME on hand?

Nope, no DME on hand. I used some old LME on the last starter I made and dumped the whole 2000 ml starter into a 10 gallon batch, should have decanted. The final product had a twang to it, like burnt LME.

This time just want to make a starter out of fresh grain.

 

[Dan]

or you could always brew a beer and save some of the runnings for yeast starters. boil it, cool it and refrigerate it in a sanitized container or freeze

I was thinking about something similar, just don't want to do it on brew day, would rather have the starter wort available a day or two before.

 

[Dan]

1.07 gal water to 10.7oz 2 row, BIAB
will give you around .5 gal at 1.035
At 72% efficiency
with .5 boil off at 60 min boil

Thanks Mux

 

[Dan]

So are you gonna can it after and keep it on hand?

I don't know Revvy but making a gallon or two might not be a bad idea to have on hand later. Not real familiar with the canning process, I suppose I can Google that.

 

[Gargon]

easy way would be dme at first. but if you think about it it is more fun making a batch wort A.G. style and making many pre made starters that will save time on the next batch you need a starter for. 1 small mini AG wort starter batch will get ya set for 5 batches. you could so same with dme but there is where the money comes in play

 

[Dan]

It seems like a lot of trouble to save an insubstantial amount of money. Maybe my perspective is out of wack. It seems pretty cheap for the few oz dme needed. If you want to make wort for it sure, you can save a few dollars. It won't make a hill of beans difference in your end product, just cost more time on a starter. I guess if you are already setup for canning then maybe it makes sense. For me, I'd need to by a pressure cooker and other canning supplies... dammit, now I am talking myself into going this route.. damn me

dme still seems easier... but hey... I guess if easy was the object we would just buy beer

I'm not trying to save money, just don't want to buy DME since I have grain at hand. I plugged the numbers into BeerSmith and for a quart starter it said to use 6.4 ounces of grain to get a 1.041 wort but the water required part was over a gallon and included a 60 minute boil. I'm thinking about just putting 4 quarts of water in a crockpot with a half pound of grain. Thinking of adding it all together and setting the crockpot on low for a few hours. If the starter OG is to high I'll add some water and if to low, do another crockpot mash with more grain or just let evaporation occur and when the gravity is correct stop the process.

I'd like to come come up with a starter wort around 1.035 to have on hand.

 

[BBL_Brewer]

I don't know Revvy but making a gallon or two might not be a bad idea to have on hand later. Not real familiar with the canning process, I suppose I can Google that.

You need a pressure cooker. They are a little expensive for a good one, but come in handy for canning food, ribs, pulled pork, all kinds of stuff. I make up 5 gallons of starter wort at a time and can it up mostly in pints and quarts. Just mash and off to the canner. You end up with some break in the jars if you don't boil first, but you can leave most of that behind with some careful pouring. It's a lot easier than a regular brew day, and then you have enough starter wort for quite a few batches.

 

[Dan]

Thanks BBL! Would you mind giving me the basic directions to canning? I have 6 or 7 pint size mason jars and a pressure cooker.

 

[BBL_Brewer]

Thanks BBL! Would you mind giving me the basic directions to canning? I have 6 or 7 pint size mason jars and a pressure cooker.

Well, as far as basic directions go I would consult the manual for the canner you have. Ie, how much water you need to put in the canner and that sort of thing. If you are not familiar with the process at all and don't have the manual, let me know what kind of cooker it is and I'll help you out. As far as directions for canning the wort itself, can it at 15 psi for 15 minutes. Leave a little head space in the jars so they don't boil over and glue your rings to the jar threads. Check to make sure all the lids sealed after they cool by tapping on them and then store. Nothing to it really.

 

[Dan]

I can put 1.5 gallons of water in it with about a 1/4 inch space left at the top. There is no PSI gauge on the lid, just three settings. One no air out, two some air out and three more air out.. ha ha.

So how does this canning process work?

 

[BBL_Brewer]

To be honest with you, I've never seen one like that. All the ones I've ever saw either had a jiggler or a pressure gauge (I have both kinds). What is the brand and model? Sounds like maybe that one is meant for just cooking and not canning.

 

[ElDuderino]

I started doing something on brew day that always gives me starter wort when I need it. When I am done brewing I dump the remaining wort at the bottom of my keggle into a bucket. Yes, it is full of protein/hot break material and looks as bad as you can imagine. I layer a couple paper towels in a large funnel and place this in another catch pot. I then pour it in and let it sit and filter. I usually have about two quarts leftover and this all filters crystal clear -- It's amazing. I then pour this clarified wort into labeled/dated freezer bags and freeze them until I need one. At that point, I thaw them, boil for fifteen minutes in my Erlenmeyer flask, cool and pitch.

I am not really spending any extra time and I would dump out the kettle dregs otherwise. I wish I had a picture of the before and after filtering, because it is dramatic.

 

[Dan]

So it's 10:22 pm, I have a gallon of water and 4 cups of crushed two row (my scale died so had to do basic volume measurements) sitting in a crockpot which for the time being is set on high. I didn't realize it was so late so thinking about setting the crockpot to low before I go to bed and just let it mash away till morning.

I'll probably pour the mash into a collander (placed above another pot), sparge with some hot water and take a gravity reading. If to (edit) low I'll boil for awhile to evaporate the excess water and if to (edit) high dilute with (boiled/cooled) water.

After that need to preserve it somehow, canning sounds like a good idea, just need to learn how to.

I planned on brewing Sunday 1/29 but my scale and thermometer are broken and need to be replaced. Next weekend I won't have the time due to family commitments. Next brew day will not be until February 11th

 

[Dan]

To be honest with you, I've never seen one like that. All the ones I've ever saw either had a jiggler or a pressure gauge (I have both kinds). What is the brand and model? Sounds like maybe that one is meant for just cooking and not canning.

It might be BBL, I really don't know. Can you give me an idea of the process? I goggled it and there are plenty of videos about canning, however they sort of assume you understand canning in the first place.. Know what I mean?

 

[Dan]

I started doing something on brew day that always gives me starter wort when I need it. When I am done brewing I dump the remaining wort at the bottom of my keggle into a bucket. Yes, it is full of protein/hot break material and looks as bad as you can imagine. I layer a couple paper towels in a large funnel and place this in another catch pot. I then pour it in and let it sit and filter. I usually have about two quarts leftover and this all filters crystal clear -- It's amazing. I then pour this clarified wort into labeled/dated freezer bags and freeze them until I need one. At that point, I thaw them, boil for fifteen minutes in my Erlenmeyer flask, cool and pitch.

I am not really spending any extra time and I would dump out the kettle dregs otherwise. I wish I had a picture of the before and after filtering, because it is dramatic.

You know, I have recently thought about using some of the last runnings as starter wort, just have not done that yet so have none on hand. You say you filter your last runnings and freeze? That's a great idea! I suppose I could do that with the wort I'm now making for a starter, brew day is in two weeks. You think that would work? Been talking with BBL about canning which I think is a great way to save wort for an indefinite period. You ever can?

 

[BBL_Brewer]

When you pressure can something, you boil water (and your jars) in a somewhat sealed vessel and the pressure builds up inside. There is always some sort of pressure relief that regulates the pressure. Different foods need to be held at a certain pressure for a given amount of time to properly preserve. 15 psi for 15 minutes will render the wort sterile. For yours, I'm not sure what the settings correspond to in terms of pressure. If you knew what model it was I might be able to look it up.