How do I mash flaked wheat?

[Singletrack]

Due to a windfall of fresh fruit (read zest) and my LHBS's shortage of Saison yeast, I find myself brewing something completely different (for me) -- a Witbier. My recipe has 42% flaked wheat and 10% flaked oats. The recipe calls for a protein rest at 122 F for 15 min, with gradual increase to 154 F. (This is based on Jamil's Wittebrew from BCS.)

I've done only a couple step mashes before. They made beer, but I'm not so sure the beer benefitted from my floundering through the steps trying to hit temps using infusions in a 10 gal round cooler.

Step mashes are a little more difficult for me, because when I add boiling water to raise the temp, I am adding only about 190 F water, due to my altitude.

My calcs show that I should strike using only 0.64 qt/lb, then add boiling water to 1.74 qt/lb to hit 154 F. This would max out my 10 gal cooler for my 7.75 gal batch size. I have never mashed so thick, and I have never used flaked grains. Will 0.64 qt/lb be okay with 52% flaked grains?

If so, how long should I hold at 154 F for complete conversion. 45 min? 60 min? More? (I don't have iodine.)

If 0.64 qt/lb is too thick, what should I do instead? Single infusion? Smaller batch size?

Appreciate any advice!

 

[Homercidal]

You don't have to do anything special for flaked wheat. It's already been gelatinized by the flaking process. You can crush it up and mash at 154°.

IF you want to do a protein rest, then mash at 122° and just heat up to 154° and hold for 45-60 minutes. Honestly, most people will get complete conversion in a little over 30 minutes. The 60 rest is mostly 60 minutes just to make sure.

If you wanted, you *could* remove some of the mash and boil and add back. Then you won't be adding too much water. This is decoction, and I'm not sure it's normally used for witbier, but I don't see why it hurt anything.

 

[porterpounder]

I'd also toss in a good amount of rice hulls as that much flaked wheat is likely to get gummy and stick you sparge (assuming that you are sparging).

 

[IslandLizard]

I've brewed Witbiers using decoction. It increases the malt flavor, and perhaps some of the best Witbier I've made. Link is under Recipes under my avatar. The decoction process changes the raw wheat flavor into something more biscuity, if I had to describe it.

Instead of a full decoction to heat up to the next step, you can just scoop out half or more of your mash and heat it up in a large pot (or your kettle) to a bit higher (5-10 degrees) than your next step, and dump back, mix and do it again. Stir really well of course, so it doesn't get too hot on the bottom and denature the enzymes.

Or mash everything in your kettle, applying heat slowly while stirring really well, bringing the hotter mash to the top, to prevent denaturing the enzymes. When ready to lauter, dump the whole mash into your cooler tun.

 

[Singletrack]

Thank you! I'm thinking a decoction could work for me, and it will be a fun new adventure in brewing. I need to do a little research. For example, I've never understood why a decoction is okay without denaturing the mash. And why shouldn't I exceed 170 F at mashout, but boiling the mash is fine.

I will read all about it.

 

[Singletrack]

I'd also toss in a good amount of rice hulls as that much flaked wheat is likely to get gummy and stick you sparge (assuming that you are sparging).

Yup, got a pile of rice hulls ready to go! Can't wait to stick it up.

 

[Singletrack]

I've brewed Witbiers using decoction. It increases the malt flavor, and perhaps some of the best Witbier I've made. Link is under Recipes under my avatar.

Hey I-Lizard,

I like your recipe and wish I was brewing that instead -- but there's always another brew day. I'm not a big fan of subtlety in my beers. I found it humorous that you stepped up the ABV to 5.9%, exactly the same as my interpretation of Jamil's, which is "supposed" to be 5.0%.

Your recipe's decoction concoction is a mind-blower for someone who specializes in single infusions. Hope I can develop an appropriate simplification to avoid catastrophic decoction malfunction on brew day.

 

[Gavin C]

Yup, got a pile of rice hulls ready to go! Can't wait to stick it up.

Soak them in water first so they don't absorb wort. That way you can disregard them in your mash calculations for grain percentages and volume losses.

I've recently been playing with step mashes via directly heating the mash-tun and with infusions. Infusions were less work. Constant stirring was a pain in the a$$. Did one thin decoction to mash out. Easy enough.

The extra mash complexity adds time to the brew but still wrapped up the mash in 90 mins approx. I'm full volume mashing on the direct heated mash. Slooooow ramping to the rests but very doable. Just keep stirring. Easier with a less than full volume mash.

 

[BigEd]

Due to a windfall of fresh fruit (read zest) and my LHBS's shortage of Saison yeast, I find myself brewing something completely different (for me) -- a Witbier. My recipe has 42% flaked wheat and 10% flaked oats. The recipe calls for a protein rest at 122 F for 15 min, with gradual increase to 154 F. (This is based on Jamil's Wittebrew from BCS.)

I've done only a couple step mashes before. They made beer, but I'm not so sure the beer benefitted from my floundering through the steps trying to hit temps using infusions in a 10 gal round cooler.

Step mashes are a little more difficult for me, because when I add boiling water to raise the temp, I am adding only about 190 F water, due to my altitude.

My calcs show that I should strike using only 0.64 qt/lb, then add boiling water to 1.74 qt/lb to hit 154 F. This would max out my 10 gal cooler for my 7.75 gal batch size. I have never mashed so thick, and I have never used flaked grains. Will 0.64 qt/lb be okay with 52% flaked grains?

If so, how long should I hold at 154 F for complete conversion. 45 min? 60 min? More? (I don't have iodine.)

If 0.64 qt/lb is too thick, what should I do instead? Single infusion? Smaller batch size?

Appreciate any advice!

52% flaked grain is nuts. Where the hell did you come up with that quantity?

 

[Singletrack]

52% flaked grain is nuts. Where the hell did you come up with that quantity?

Ha! Well, you very well may be right about that. I'm trusting Jamil Zainasheff and his book called "Brewing Classic Styles" -- that's the "Jamil's Wittebrew from BCS" that I referred to in my post. Yeah, Jamil is a big name and all, but nothing says I can do what he can do, and it may be nuts for me to try.

OTOH, Jamil seems to think extract brewers can do this somehow, since his crazy book ostensibly is written for them, not AG brewers. So what do you know about this flakiness that I should know, before I create a disaster?

 

[Singletrack]

Soak them in water first so they don't absorb wort. That way you can disregard them in your mash calculations for grain percentages and volume losses.

I've recently been playing with step mashes via directly heating the mash-tun and with infusions. Infusions were less work.

Thank you Gavin.

Good advice on soaking the hulls. I always do that. Plus, when you drain them, the water is crap brown, so you avoid that in your beer.

I haven't tried direct-firing my plastic cooler, but maybe some day. In the mean time, I will do infusions, or remove some of the mash for a decoction (I guess), since I dread the thought of dumping 10 gal of mash from my BK (direct-fired MT) into my cooler for lautering.

Might be a good application for BIAB? I really need more time to experiment with stuff.

 

[Gavin C]

....

I haven't tried direct-firing my plastic cooler, but maybe some day.

That's a thread I look forward to reading.

Best of luck with the Wit

 

[dcrog]

That's a thread I look forward to reading.

Reading heck.

When you try it you must video. :rockin:

 

[RM-MN]

Thank you! I'm thinking a decoction could work for me, and it will be a fun new adventure in brewing. I need to do a little research. For example, I've never understood why a decoction is okay without denaturing the mash. And why shouldn't I exceed 170 F at mashout, but boiling the mash is fine.

I will read all about it.

This has to do with extracting tannins from the husks of the grain. That extraction is driven by pH of the mash with temperature being the secondary. When you decoct and boil, it is assumed that the pH of your mash is less than 6.0 and you won't extract a noticeable amount of tannins. When you drain the mash tun and add water to the grains it tends to raise the pH. Each time you sparge, the pH goes up so while you can increase the extraction of the malt sugars by multiple sparges, you increase the chance for tannin extraction. As long as you keep the temperature lower than 170, little tannin will be extracted even if the pH goes up.

 

[Singletrack]

I did a single decoction, and that went fine. Lautering was a little slow and painful, but eventually I got enough for a 60 min boil. It will be a long time before I consider another recipe with 50% flaked grains, but I have high hopes for this one.

Flaked grains don't seem to occupy the same volume per lb in the mash tun as crushed barley, nor absorb the same amount of water, nor require the same heat to raise temp, so my calcs were off, and I brewed like a Neanderthal. I was prepared for that, and it was a fun change, but not something I plan to repeat often.

Thanks for the help and advice!