Homer Bucket Leaching Chemicals

[njnear76]

Also, when it comes to a safety issue (i.e. leeching potentially toxic chemicals), personal experiences matter zilch! Unless they had the beer tested, it means they didn't detect and off flavors. Who knows how many taste-less substances could be coming from the plastics. It's just not a good way to determine safety, IMO.

Bottom line, unless you know for sure, it's a risk IMO.

I thought about this subject and researched a bit since I posted the thread. I don't think Hot Liquid+Homer Buckets is a good idea. High temperatures will cause any plastic to leach especially if that temperature is above 180F. That being said, I am going to drink this brew. The harm is probably on par with nuking a microwaveable meal.

Grain storage is probably OK. The grains might absorb some plastic off gasing, but probably not enough to do harm. I would have to think that boiling the wort for an hour will release some of those nasty fumes.

It does not hurt to be overly cautious. Lately there has been a lot of negative stuff on the news regarding plastics. Then again life is dangerous.

 

[rcm_rx7]

I've used homer buckets for transferring wort from mash to kettle a few times, and even used one as a secondary for about a week. I'm not worrying, hell the alcohol is probably worse for you then anything in that's going to leach into the beer.

But now I'm afraid to drink orange juice...those bottles are orange!

kidding of course

 

[Sawdustguy]

What I don't understand is why people would even take a chance with their health. I guess it's like people who continue to smoke even after they find out they have lung cancer or women who drink alcohol after they find out they are pregnant. I guess people just don't care. My local Homebrew Store has FDA Food Safe buckets for $2.00 more than a Homer Bucket. Isn't piece of mind worth $2.00 when it comes to your health? Maybe it's me, but if I had the choice to use a bucket that is made dyes that are unkown or a FDA Food Safe bucket at $2.00 more, I'm going to spend the extra $2.00. We can debate this until we are all blue in the face but don't you think it's stupid to put your health at risk over a couple of bucks?

 

[Synovia]

What I don't understand is why people would even take a chance with their health. I guess it's like people who continue to smoke even after they find out they have lung cancer or women who drink alcohol after they find out they are pregnant. I guess people just don't care. My local Homebrew Store has FDA Food Safe buckets for $2.00 more than a Homer Bucket. Isn't piece of mind worth $2.00 when it comes to your health? Maybe it's me, but if I had the choice to use a bucket that is made dyes that are unkown or a FDA Food Safe bucket at $2.00 more, I'm going to spend the extra $2.00. We can debate this until we are all blue in the face but don't you think it's stupid to put your health at risk over a couple of bucks?

Maybe its just that people aren't utterly paranoid. People take calculated risks every day. Like you said, people smoke. I could probably eat a home depot bucket and take in less carcinogens than are in a single cigarette.

And $2 difference? Home Depot are $1.97 near me. Ale Pales at the LHBS are $14.99

 

[rico567]

Economics aside, functionality aside, I have seen not one post in this thread that establishes that there is any threat to health that is possible from using hot wort in a #2 HDPE bucket. That is all.

 

[Sawdustguy]

Maybe its just that people aren't utterly paranoid. People take calculated risks every day. Like you said, people smoke. I could probably eat a home depot bucket and take in less carcinogens than are in a single cigarette.

And $2 difference? Home Depot are $1.97 near me. Ale Pales at the LHBS are $14.99

You are guessing plain and simple. You have no idea what dye was used in these buckets. Home Depot has not made that information available. That alone makes me suspicious. Some of the dyes used in plastics are toxic and some of the dyes are safe, but you have no clue what dye was used in the Homer Buckets. Even for $12 more it's not worth the risk for me, although food safe buckets at my LHBS are much less expensive than your LHBS. I agree that people take risks everyday, but for what, to save $12? Look, use the buckets if you feel safe, but I will not take the risk with my health not knowing what dye was used.

 

[jtrainer]

I have never fermented in one but I know people that have/do and they make some darn nice beers. The one guy has been brewing for 18 yrs and has used homer buckets for 10 yrs.

I called Argee the maker of my homer bucket with the dye question. The response was a low chuckle and a "no your OK.... hey you fermenting beer or wine in those buckets?" He happened to be a homebrewer too.

When I was a kid we would drink from a hose.... and were still living!

I say keep it and I think your fine....

 

[arturo7]

Economics aside, functionality aside, I have seen not one post in this thread that establishes that there is any threat to health that is possible from using hot wort in a #2 HDPE bucket. That is all.

You don't read very closely, do you?

 

[arturo7]

I called Argee the maker of my homer bucket with the dye question. The response was a low chuckle and a "no your OK.... hey you fermenting beer or wine in those buckets?"

I know that guy, he's in San Diego. I've been in his factory. I sold him some of the equipment he uses to make to those buckets. I am not saying anything negative about his integrity. He's an OK guy and I enjoyed working with him. However, I would never use one of those buckets for beer.

 

[evanmars]

FWIW from the Weber web site:

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]Not All HDPE Containers Are Food Grade[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]There is a common misconception that all containers made of white plastic or HDPE plastic bearing the

symbol are food grade containers. This is not true.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]If you are considering the purchase of a container from some place other than a kitchen or restaurant supply store, and the container is not clearly labeled as "food safe" or being made of food grade plastic, then you should assume that it is not food grade and you should not brine in it—unless you line it with a food grade plastic bag.[/FONT]

 

[njnear76]

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]If you are considering the purchase of a container from some place other than a kitchen or restaurant supply store, and the container is not clearly labeled as "food safe" or being made of food grade plastic, then you should assume that it is not food grade and you should not brine in it—unless you line it with a food grade plastic bag.[/FONT]

See. Fermenting beer and using it to collect wort is OK. It's brining that is a problem. LOL.

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

I have been using two Homer buckets...one for storing Starsan and one for storing PBW solution. Not that this means much but neither has leached any color into the solutions and the interior of both buckets looks perfect. Both solutions stay clear for months...I've never seen either solution discolor or even get cloudy.

My concern is that whenever I see something like Homer buckets for <$2 then I just assume it's from China and based on recent history with Chinese products there's no telling what's in it.

But I guess I figured that since I rinse the PBW and only leave a tiny amount of Starsan on anything that it wasn't an issue. The spray bottle I use for spraying Starsan is dark blue HDPE-2.

 

[Synovia]

You are guessing plain and simple. You have no idea what dye was used in these buckets

And neither do you.

I used home depot buckets to raise extremely sensitive marine fish and invert larvae for years. Much lower concentrations of chemicals will kill them then will hurt us.

 

[JVD_X]

The only things that concern me with anything that will contain food is if it was made in China.

I just don't trust that when they stamp HDPE 2 on the bucket that it is actually conforms to any kind of standard. From the FDA's standpoint, it probably isn't checking buckets bound for lowes, home depot, etc for suitability because they only expect a very very small amount of people to use the buckets for a food container. So, China can probably get away with putting all sorts of chemicals and whatnot into those plastic pails.

BUT - I am more concerned about the manufacturing oils and other by-products that exist on the surface. It is a good idea to wash the bucket inside and out before using it.

 

[zman]

I do not think I would use them for hot wort xfer or fermenting in but I do use them to store grains. I have not seen any leeching or smelled anything funky. I wash and oxyclean them before they touch grain

 

[McKBrew]

It is my opinion that we have gotten too worried about food grade this, or food grade that.

I am willing to be some of us smoke. I am willing to bet that some of us eat grilled food (even though there are risks associated with that. Some of us scuba dive, jump out of planes, ride motorcycles, etc... Some of us drank out of the garden hose, chewed on the Chinese crayons, and ate paint chips in Grandma's house. We are still here.

Why do we obsess about food grade and minimum contact time when we do all of this crazy stuff? And to top it off, we drink beer and some of us drink quantities far above what we should at certain times.

And yet, we have used 5 pages to argue about a bucket.

My point. We choose to engage in risky and unhealthy behaviors every day. How can we accept those as OK, and be overly concerned with a bucket?

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

My point. We choose to engage in risky and unhealthy behaviors every day. How can we accept those as OK, and be overly concerned with a bucket?

Yea but all that other stuff is just stuff that could potentially kill you...BFD. We're talking about potentially compromising our beer...totally different.

 

[njnear76]

I regret starting this thread, because it makes me feel like a wuss.

McKBrew is right. As kids we used to do a lot of dangerous crap from drinking out the hose to playing with semi-dangerous substances. Some of you Boomers even played with mercury.

Granted it's best not to chance things in life, but I am 100% sure that drinking this beer won't cause me to be crazy or get teh cancer.

I'll probably go crazy anyways though thanks to the dementia genes.

 

[arturo7]

Paying more for a bucket vs. smoking?

This is a poor analogy.

 

[Synovia]

Paying more for a bucket vs. smoking?

This is a poor analogy.

Yeah, in that smoking is much worse for you.

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

Smokers will appreciate the better quality bucket when they kick it.

 

[Sawdustguy]

And neither do you.

I will not take the risk with my health not knowing what dye was used.

Hmmmmm.....I could have sworn I admitted that in a previous post.

I used home depot buckets to raise extremely sensitive marine fish and invert larvae for years. Much lower concentrations of chemicals will kill them then will hurt us.

At least we know it's safe for fish and larvae. For humans, the jury is still out. BTW, I have no problem with you using the Homer buckets. I have a number of FDA food safe buckets purchased when my LHBS had them on sale for $6.00 a pop. It's your health, not mine.

 

[ruthven]

I saw this thread when researching if the homer bucket was food grade for a different project (I dont home brew) but wanted to come share with you. I contacted the manufacturer of the bucket (Argee Corp) and they said the buckets ARE NOT food grade....so use it at your own risk. But if you find a white bucket that says Argee on the bottom they are food grade. They only make one type white bucket, in various sizes.

 

[Synovia]

I saw this thread when researching if the homer bucket was food grade for a different project (I dont home brew) but wanted to come share with you. I contacted the manufacturer of the bucket (Argee Corp) and they said the buckets ARE NOT food grade....so use it at your own risk. But if you find a white bucket that says Argee on the bottom they are food grade. They only make one type white bucket, in various sizes.

Of course they'll tell you that. They haven't had them FDA approved, and as such its a huge liability.

 

[Synovia]

At least we know it's safe for fish and larvae. For humans, the jury is still out. BTW, I have no problem with you using the Homer buckets. I have a number of FDA food safe buckets purchased when my LHBS had them on sale for $6.00 a pop. It's your health, not mine.

The point is, fish larvae are way more sensitive to pretty much everything than human beings.