Help with Scotch Ale

[ThatVideoKid]

So my LHBS has a pretty expansive database of recipes that they have developed over the years. I love scotch ales and stumbled on their selection of scotch recipes. This is the one I settled on:

6.6lb Light LME
3.3lb Munich LME

8oz Special Roast Malt
4oz Biscuit Malt
2oz Roasted Barley

1oz Columbus (60min)
1oz East Kent Golding (60min)

Wyeast 1728

This is a 5gal batch BTW!

Steep Specialty Malts for 30+ minutes. Mix is LME and bring to a boil for 60 minutes. When it reached a boil remove 24fl oz of wort. Place in a saucepan and heat until it boils down to a syrup(caramelizing it). Add 2 cups water to the caramelized wort then return to the main wort.

SO. There are a few changes I would like to make and would appreciate the help of you guys! (since I am a new brewer especially)

1. I would like a little smoke, not a smokebomb, but a just perceivable amount of smoke to add depth.

2. With extract brewing, is there an easier way to get that caramel flavor without that weird wort caramelization process. Can you just steep crystal malt? The recipe said this process was a substitute for crystal malt.

3. Any other suggestions!

Thanks for the input :]

 

[ChelisHubby]

You can just steep any crystal malt. Is this a Strong scotch ale? I like scottish 80s but they don't have much roast at least mine haven't . I guess you can boil down some of the wort and it will caramelize. Good luck!

 

[Oginme]

Scotch Ales are one of my favorites. I've made them both ways: with the side reduction and 'carmelization' and without. IMHO, there is nothing that beats the side reduction. You may be able to get close with a combination of several caramel/crystal malts along with melanoidin malt, but it is really not the same in terms of mouth feel and you never really get that toffee/buttery impact.

I've long ago dropped the smoked malts from my strong Scotch ale recipes, as I find the reduction and the yeast give it a slightly earthy, almost peaty flavor without the smoke phenolics. I much prefer it that way. If you want to do the smoke thing, stay away from the peated malt and try the beechwood smoked malt from Weyermann.

 

[DromJohn]

Double contrarian here.

I'd add 2-3 oz of peated malt for the recipe above. I'm a fan. I am using 5 oz in my upcoming Terrapin Reunion '10.

For my last brew I caramelized some wort for Bush de Noël. It wasn't much trouble, smelled great, and gave me the impression of a different flavor and thickness, kinda of like working a roux to fit a recipe, or a good deglazing for a sauce. I recommend caramelizing wort at least once just to add an experience, and your recipe is your first opportunity.

 

[ArkotRamathorn]

Beechwood or Peat smoked would probably be a bit more in line with tradition.

But I would want to point out another option. Cherrywood smoked malt, only a small amount, 2-4oz in a 5gallon recipe. Its really intensely BBQ beer for the first couple weeks. It very quickly mellows into almost tart cherry or general fruitiness. The next time I do a scotch ale I'll be using it again.

Edit: Parroting the caramelizing wort is a good idea. I thought I could get away without it doing back to back scotch ales. The one without the caramelized wort but lots of crystal malts was much more thin. The 2nd batch I did the wort caramelization, made a BIG difference. Big, chewy, and sweet. Now that its been in the bottles for, uh, 6 months now (god I wish I took better notes on this batch), the carbonation is finally starting to come out and tart up the sweetness a bit. Long story short, I wouldn't skip it, I only boiled maybe, 1/4-1/2 gallon for about 15 minutes on the stove on really high heat and I think it made a gigantic difference.

 

[Snicklefritz]

Definitely carmelize the wort. Its easy to do and makes a big difference. Great choice on the yeast though, I've found I like 1728 in all sorts of things.

 

[MindenMan]

My Strong Scottish Ale recipe has an O.G. of 1.085, and if I remember correctly, something happened and I boiled for 90 minutes. I bottled it in April of last year, and cracked one open earlier this week. Wow, caramel, malt, raisin, and a touch of molasses on the front of the tongue. There is no molasses or brown sugar in my recipe. I shared that bottle with a beer loving friend, and he was totally blown away with the flavor dancing on the tongue... Honestly, I was blown away myself; that particular batch had a bunch of bottle bombs due to my not mixing the priming sugar in well enough. I guess waiting a year to drink a strong ale is actually worth it. Now I want to make another batch because SWMBO really loves the malt forward-ness and how smooth it is to drink.

 

[Oginme]

Beechwood or Peat smoked would probably be a bit more in line with tradition.

What tradition? Greg Noonan and other reports of the recipes from Scotland do not have any smoked malts in them at all. The addition of smoked malt, especially peated malts, is a relatively recent trend.

 

[ArkotRamathorn]

What tradition? Greg Noonan and other reports of the recipes from Scotland do not have any smoked malts in them at all. The addition of smoked malt, especially peated malts, is a relatively recent trend.

Rephrase then: Peated or wood smoked malts would be more modern-tradition to emulate the smokiness in a scotch whiskey.

Edit: Wouldn't a lot of malts from the times when those recipes were originally written been dried with peat for the fuel source? They wouldn't have called it "smoked" malt then, it was just "malt". I am in now way trying to call into question people who are obviously far smarter than I, but the names of our current ingredients are partially the product of a modern need to categorize something. The old recipes would've just said something to the effect of "this much barley malt, this much hops, this much water". Now it would say "This much marris otter, this much east kent goldings, this much burtonized water" and our current ingredients would rarely match up to the "traditional" ingredients.

 

[Oginme]

It may be that some of the malts way back had some smoke character to them. I do know that, from the bottles I received from a friend who was going to school in Edinburgh, that those with a smoke flavor/aromas were labeled as "peated" ales, whereas the ones simply labeled Scotch ale had no smoky phenolics in aroma or taste.

The BJCP guidelines also state " Lightly smoky secondary aromas may also be present, adding complexity; peat smoke is inappropriate." and reiterate that in the taste description.

Does this mean that you should not put smoked malts into your Scotch ale? Certainly not! It's your recipe, do what you want and be happy!

 

[ThatVideoKid]

Okay, So I am probably going to caramelize the wort, if you guys say it adds to the mouthfeel, I love a big chewy beer. I may or may not smoke it. I could maybe do a split batch, with adding like 2oz steeped in a cup or 2 of water, then that added one of the primaries?

On the note of cherrywood, do you guys know a style that would go well with both light cherrywood smoke and actual cherry flavor? My fiancee loves cherries, particularly in their tart form, and I was looking to whip her up something with many layers of cherry in aroma and taste. UNFORTUNATELY she doesn't like roasted beer. I think a cherrywood smoked cherry stout/porter could be excellent.

 

[JKaranka]

I'd call these "American Scotch Ales" as Scottish brewers neither used smoked malts nor caramelised the wort. What they did do, though, was using a fair deal of invert sugars and brewers' caramel. Closest thing in grist to a 120 year old Scotch ale is a Belgian Dubbel.

 

[Oginme]

I'd call these "American Scotch Ales" as Scottish brewers neither used smoked malts nor caramelised the wort. What they did do, though, was using a fair deal of invert sugars and brewers' caramel. Closest thing in grist to a 120 year old Scotch ale is a Belgian Dubbel.

Interesting, the Traquair House ale is made with just Golden Promise and Roasted Barley and according to the brewer's notes they reduce some of the first runnings. It certainly tastes that way.

 

[JKaranka]

I don't think Traquair House is that related to traditional Scotch ales, it started brewing in 1965. Worth investigating the Scottish export market in the first half of the 20th century.

 

[DromJohn]

The only time I have used cherrywood smoked was in an imperial brown Redhook 8-4-1 Expedition Ale. It could probably handle cherry. No roasted, and it uses 1 pound of Munich.