Help with Saison

[kingludwig01]

So I started my first ever beer 8 days ago, on the 14th. I decided for my first beer to do a Saison due to its friendliness to warm temperatures, as my apartment is usually about 74 degrees and the closet I store it in might be a few degrees warmer. I did 5 gallons of water, 5 pounds of LME, a pound of table sugar (I realized I wanted a higher ABV), a couple ounces of Mosaic hops, and a packet of T-58 Saison yeast. I noticed that fermentation went from aggressive bubbling to virtually no bubbles in only 3 days, which worried me, and so I opened up the fermentor 6 days in and did a gravity reading. A wonderful smell (albeit a little alcohol-forward) beer permeated the air, and sure enough the gravity reading indicated about 1.010; super close to my estimated final gravity of 1.0125 (I think the sugar lowered final gravity a little bit). Satisfied, I closed it back up after resanitizing the lid, and let it sit for 2 more days. Today I checked the gravity again, and its still 1.010, but instead of an alcohol-forward ale permeating the air, bananas did. Like not a hint of banana, I mean full on ripe banana smell. It was wonderful, but unexpected! I know beers that ferment warm like Hefeweizens are very banana-clovey, so is this to be expected as my Saison was fermenting in relatively warm temperature? I tasted a small amount of the beer just to discern any remaining sugars or prevalent banana smell, but the beer was quite dry and there was no taste of bananas, only smell.

Overall, Im not upset by banana smell; Im actually quite pleased. However, Im curious if this is normal for Saisons. The recipe I roughly emulated mentioned nothing about the taste and smell of the product, so I dont know if banana is to be expected. Im also curious about my fermentation process; Im only 8 days into fermentation, and the recipe I looked at calls for two weeks of primary. This leads me to believe my beer fermented at lightning speed; what are the consequences of such a fast fermentation? Should I be worried? Do I let my beer go through the whole 2 week primary, or should I start bottle conditioning pretty soon? Thanks.

 

[Dr_Jeff]

You can bottle it now, if you want to.

 

[kingludwig01]

You can bottle it now, if you want to.

I read that letting the beer sit in primary helps smoothen out some rough edges and make it better, with some people leaving it in primary for a month before bottling. Is this true?

 

[Dr_Jeff]

I've never left beer in a primary for a month.
I usually package after two weeks.
Half of that time is a cold crash and usually force carbonation in the fermenter.

 

[AlexKay]

Same gravity two days apart seems like you’re good to go.

I’ve used T58 a fair number of times. I’ve never had a banana smell. It’s not really a saison yeast, but more of a generic Belgian ale.

 

[AlexKay]

Fermentis specifically calls out banana on its web page for T58, so maybe not so weird.

 

[kingludwig01]

Same gravity two days apart seems like you’re good to go.

I’ve used T58 a fair number of times. I’ve never had a banana smell. It’s not really a saison yeast, but more of a generic Belgian ale.

Thats interesting, so even though Fermentis states the banana and clove and fruitiness of the yeast, you haven't experienced it? I wonder why mine came out so banana like and yours haven't. As for the bottling, do you think that I should bottle now or should I let it sit longer? I mentioned above that I read somewhere that leaving your beer in primary for a few days or even longer after its done with fermenting helps the yeast clear up any off-flavors. Do you think after only 8 days of primary that I should be good to bottle? or will it affect the final product negatively?

 

[AlexKay]

If you wanted to wait for a few days, it won’t hurt anything. There’s certainly no need to primary over 2 weeks for this beer; that’s how long I generally let things sit. Don’t forget the yeast have a few more weeks to work things out while you bottle condition.

 

[RM-MN]

Thats interesting, so even though Fermentis states the banana and clove and fruitiness of the yeast, you haven't experienced it? I wonder why mine came out so banana like and yours haven't. As for the bottling, do you think that I should bottle now or should I let it sit longer? I mentioned above that I read somewhere that leaving your beer in primary for a few days or even longer after its done with fermenting helps the yeast clear up any off-flavors. Do you think after only 8 days of primary that I should be good to bottle? or will it affect the final product negatively?

How much trub do you want in your bottles. I've bottled quite a few batches after 7 days but I got tired of the 1/4 of trub in each bottle. It won't hurt your beer either way but I prefer to let the trub settle and stay in the fermenter instead of transferring all the suspended material to the bottles. 2 to 4 weeks in the fermenter lets a lot of the suspended material settle out.

 

[SRJHops]

I'd recommend keeping it in primary for at least two weeks, and even 4 wouldn't hurt. No secondary of course. I've never regretted keeping my beer in the fermenter too long, but I've regretted bottling it too early. This hobby rewards patience.

 

[MikeCo]

It sounds like it's done, but it still may attenuate a bit more, and it will certainly clarify if left in the fermenter as mentioned by RM-MN. I would leave it for 3 weeks before bottling.

 

[duncan_disorderly]

T-58 is a yeast that can keep attenuating very slowly, in my experience, so I give it a good 3 weeks before bottling. Which also helps it to clear. More banana with higher temperature.

 

[odie]

I didn't think T-58 was a Saison yeast? I've used it for Dubbel, Tripel and Quad. Am I using it wrong? Or using the wrong yeast???

 

[duncan_disorderly]

I didn't think T-58 was a Saison yeast? I've used it for Dubbel, Tripel and Quad. Am I using it wrong? Or using the wrong yeast???

I think it depends how you define saison. People use T-58 for saison, probably people who brewed before saison specific dried yeasts appeared, mostly. And before saisons became trendy and got narrowly defined in relation to du Pont.

I think Mangrove Jack M31 makes a good saison, but they brand it as a Belgian Tripel yeast. It's a diastaticus strain that gives a very dry finish and saison flavours, IMO.

 

[DuncB]

I think you're heading more belgian ale than Belgian Saison with LME and sugar.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

I think it depends how you define saison. People use T-58 for saison, probably people who brewed before saison specific dried yeasts appeared, mostly. And before saisons became trendy and got narrowly defined in relation to du Pont.

I will admit I am guilty there! I love Saison Dupont so much and I do look for that character in a Saison. I think it was an AHA article that addressed all the different yeasts using in Belgium to make beers labeled as a "Saison", including a brewer that used a Chico variant.

I think Mangrove Jack M31 makes a good saison, but they brand it as a Belgian Tripel yeast. It's a diastaticus strain that gives a very dry finish and saison flavours, IMO.

One list has Fermentis - BE-134, M31 Tripel Ale and WLP590 - French Saison as the same yeast strain.