Help using BeerSmith

[jturman35]

Hey guys I’m somewhat new to brewing. I purchased BeerSmith a few months ago and have a few questions. I’m looking to brew this Old Highland Scotch Ale recipe the LHBS game me. I put the grain Bill in BS and was looking around. Seems like I recall reading somewhere that BS requires all the correct calculations and should only be used as a recipe book.

First thing that caught my eye was the beer color looked light for a Scotch Ale? BS shows 16.9 SRM.

Second the recipe I printed shows one pack of WLP028. Looking under the starter tab in BS it recommends 4pks?

 

[ba-brewer]

Beersmith can be used for more than just a recipe book, but you do need to tweak the parameter to fit your system to get the most out of it.

I treat the color as a relative thing and not an absolute.

I do not use the beersmith yeast calculator, I use this yeast calculator.
http://www.brewunited.com/yeast_calculator.php

A vial or packet of yeast starts out at 100B cells but drops with time, look at the MFG date and enter that into calculator to get an estimate on how many cells you have. 3 or 4 vials of yeast does not seem too unrealistic for an average vial of semi fresh yeast. Best to do a starter to get a strong quick fermentation.

 

[Oginme]

Seems like I recall reading somewhere that BS requires all the correct calculations and should only be used as a recipe book.

First thing that caught my eye was the beer color looked light for a Scotch Ale? BS shows 16.9 SRM.

Second the recipe I printed shows one pack of WLP028. Looking under the starter tab in BS it recommends 4pks?

First, I don't know in what context you heard that BS2 should only be used as a recipe book. It is actually pretty powerful modelling software once you set it up to mimic your process.

Next, beer color in the picture really means nothing. It is intended to give the user an approximation of how the beer will look, but the visual impact of beer color is highly dependent upon the path length that light needs to travel through the beer. Ignore the picture, look at the SRM, brew a beer and make any adjustments you feel necessary to the next time you brew it.

Lastly, it is typically stated by the White Labs that their packets are designed for pitching into 5 gallons of wort up to 1.060 gravity. I seldom find that it will be a proper pitch size for 1.040 gravity wort. Your OG is set for 1.079 -- almost twice the sugar content. So you are looking at two packages of yeast at a minimum. Then you factor in the age of the yeast and you could be looking for more.

Personally, I look at the BS2 starter page, but more often use the pitching rate calculator at http://www.brewunited.com/yeast_calculator.php mostly because it allows the calculation for overbuilding of starters and multistep starters.

Also, if you are not doing yeast cell counts, your actual cell numbers are pretty variable as compared to the calculators. Luckily, I've found that there is enough forgiveness in yeast that close is good enough more often than not.

 

[jalc6927]

Where do you actually create recipes in beer Smith?

I have phone app but don’t see an option to create new one?

 

[Oginme]

Did you look at the videos about the mobile app on the BeerSmith web site? http://beersmith.com/video/

 

[brewing_clown]

The yeast starter tab in your recipe is pretty bad, but if you go to Tools > Yeast Starter, that calculator is quite good.

I find that the color in BS is hit and miss too, even if you have the correct malt color. That said, there are variances between maltsters, and 300 for Roasted Barley seems low. I use Crisp Roasted Barley which is 695. That could explain the lighter color you're seeing in BS.

Apart from that, as long as you have your equipment profile and brewhouse efficiency dialed in, which takes a bit of work, it's an excellent tool.

It took me a while to get things configured correctly, but now I have, BS is my primary brewing tool. It comes into its own when you start building your own recipes.

 

[jturman35]

Ok so both BS and Brew United day I need 305 billion yeast cells. I don’t have a stir plate. If I don’t make a starter can I just purchase 3 packs of liquid yeast ?

 

[ba-brewer]

If you go with dry yeast 3 packs will work, liquid yeast you need to check the mfg date or use by dates.

You can do a shaken starter but it is slower and not as effective in building more cells but is cheaper than using multiple packs of yeast.

 

[Oginme]

Ok so both BS and Brew United day I need 305 billion yeast cells. I don’t have a stir plate. If I don’t make a starter can I just purchase 3 packs of liquid yeast ?

That should get you close enough to work. I find that the yeast counts from the various calculators are fairly forgiving.

 

[kevin58]

You should really customize your equipment profile and mash profiles before you start. Once you do that your recipe and brew day calculations should be much closer to reality. The profiles that come pre-loaded in the profile are there as a starting point to customize your own equipment. Even if you find a system that seems to match your own there will be differences. I found the videos posted by Marshall S on Youtube to be helpful. (Marshall Schott from Brulosophy)

Equipment Profile -
Batch Sparge Mash Profile -
BIAB Mash Profile -

 

[jturman35]

Yes, Thanks for the replies! I used the Brew Boss add on and set my boil off rate!

Right now I’m trying to do my first starter. Does this look right? I got a pack of WLP028 / Dec 9, and the starter shows 1.5 liter using 5.20oz of DME.

View attachment 551349

 

[jturman35]

I change the boil time in Beer Smith and it doesn’t change the water volume. This is why I have a hard time trusting this. I changed the boil time from 60 - 90 mins and the water volume stays the same. ???

 

[Oginme]

I change the boil time in Beer Smith and it doesn’t change the water volume. This is why I have a hard time trusting this. I changed the boil time from 60 - 90 mins and the water volume stays the same. ???

Check your equipment profile and make sure you have the boil off rate checked as 'use boil off as an hourly rate'.

 

[jturman35]

Yes, it is checked. I can also change my beer volume from 5.5 down to 4 gal and it still shows 8.8 gal boil volume. Boil volume does not change.

 

[Oginme]

If you export the recipe as a .bsmx file and post it, I would be able to take a look at it to see what is going on. I've changed the time of boil, increased trub loss, and changed the volume to fermenter and it changes the water volumes each time.

 

[jturman35]

I may have figured it out! Sorry, I am new to all of this. I just learned you have to scale the recipe to get the volumes and calculations. Simply changing the batch size volume does nothing. However, if I change the boil time the water volumes do not change to account for the extra boil off.
I am not able to upload the bsmx file. It says unable to load file extention.

 

[FunkedOut]

beersmith doesn’t update existing recipes with any changes you make to an equipment profile.
make sure the equipment profile in the recipe has the hourly rate box checked.

 

[ba-brewer]

ya what funkedout said, If you make changes to a profile item those changes are not automatically reflected in recipe that use the profile. If you make changes with the icon with a checkmark those are immediately reflected in your recipe.

If the water volume does not change that mean you have something incorrect in your setup. You can enter incorrect information/setting and beersmith will not complain.

 

[jturman35]

Ok, so after mash for an hour I had 7.4 gals preboil. I ended up with 5.5 gal into the carboy. I had to tip the kettle and drain all but .3 gallons to get hit this mark. I will mention I also have pick up tube. I took a sample from my refractometer and was at 1.063 OG.

BeerSmith shows estimated OG 1.079. Grain bill was 15.82lbs.

Can someone help me calculate efficiency ?

 

[ba-brewer]

I can't tell for sure but I think you are between 60 and 65 BHE
I think your were not completely converted maybe only 90% but that is sort a guess by the numbers you supplied. what was your preboil gravity?

what was your mash volume and estimated BHE, was it a full volume mash or did you do some sort of sparge?

When I do full volume mashes I get about 65%BHE

 

[Oginme]

Ok, so after mash for an hour I had 7.4 gals preboil. I ended up with 5.5 gal into the carboy. I had to tip the kettle and drain all but .3 gallons to get hit this mark. I will mention I also have pick up tube. I took a sample from my refractometer and was at 1.063 OG.

BeerSmith shows estimated OG 1.079. Grain bill was 15.82lbs.

Can someone help me calculate efficiency ?

If you open the recipe in BeerSmith and go to the 'sessions' tab, there will be areas to fill in your measured values. Once you enter them in, BeerSmith will give you a calculated efficiency (both mash and BHE) versus the designed values.

 

[jturman35]

I’m using the 15gal Brew-Boss system. Full volume mash This was my first brew using this rig. My starting volume was 8.7 gal, preboil was 7.5.

I took ph reading of 6.2 after 15 mins but I’m not 100% this meter is accurate. I took a refractometer reading somewhere in the mash I got 1.040. OG was 1.063.

View attachment 551725

According to BS looks like 57%

View attachment 551726

 

[kh54s10]

If you haven't already, look at all the videos. They are accessible from the help tab. Take some time and play around. Learn how things work. Beersmith is a tool. It is not plug and play. You have to learn how to use this powerful "tool".

The most important part is your equipment profile. Even if you use a premade profile for your Brew-Boss, your system might be slightly different. It might take a few brews to dial things in. I have been using Beersmith for 6 years and still make small adjustments from time to time.

 

[jturman35]

Couple of questions.

Should I adjust my equip profile in BS to make up for low efficiency ? Or try to improve my process by adjusting mash PH? Probably both and adjust as eff goes up.

Should I mash longer?

I did some wet runs to calculate for boil off so overall I think my volumes are ok. I saw somewhere the COFI the Brew Boss doesn’t need grains crushed as much as other BIAB systems due to the recirculating mash. If this is true then I’m leaning towards adjusting my water PH before mashing. Adjusting water profiles is not an area I have gotten into yet. I just got a refractometer and ph meter for Christmas so I’m looking to start. I really want to make big beers so hopefully adjusting water will help! I also made my first starter for this batch.

 

[FunkedOut]

If something in your BS profile is way off, then adjust it right away to get in the ballpark.
That way you can use the software to predict volumes, gravities and IBU’s with some accuracy.

If something is off by a small amount,
wait until you brew a few batches to see the trend and set those BS profile values to a typical/nominal number.
Sometimes, one brew can be different than the rest. Different grains, hops and boil vigor can change things in you.

I’d work on repeatable results (precision) before worrying about efficiency.

Efficiency isn’t everything.
I can get 80%+ BH efficiency with my old kettle, a hop bag and a siphon.
My new kettle with pump for whirlpool (chilling) and drain valve has dropped me to 69%, but my brews are much less work. No stirring, lifting siphoning.
Either method, mash efficiency is right at 80% (BIAB).

I find the easiest way to get to know your system, is to brew, and model the system in your BS profile.

Fill out the session tab as suggested above.
Then follow each step and see if any measurement is far off of the predicted. Then find out why.

 

[ba-brewer]

I’m using the 15gal Brew-Boss system. Full volume mash This was my first brew using this rig. My starting volume was 8.7 gal, preboil was 7.5.

I took ph reading of 6.2 after 15 mins but I’m not 100% this meter is accurate. I took a refractometer reading somewhere in the mash I got 1.040. OG was 1.063.

View attachment 551725

According to BS looks like 57%

View attachment 551726

I can not see your attachments so can not comment on them

ph is important but that gets to water and bunch of stuff, I use brunwater and am happy with it. The beersmith tool does work too, but I found the water tools on brewersfriend to be the easiest to use and that was what I used at first before moving to brunwater.

I calculate my expected mash gravity using a spreadsheet I created using the tables and information from Palmers "how to brew book". I don't stop mashing until I am within 95% of that calculated value.

Beersmith does not list preboil gravity but you can figure it out.
pre boil gravity = post boil gravity X (post boil volume/pre boil volume)​

I use a refract to take gravity reading of my mash, I found the clear wort to be less predictable then taking a few drips of cloudy wort collected from within the mash. I give my mash a few good stirs every 10 minutes for the first 40min and get a few from drips off of the spoon when I stop stirring. After 40min I just dip into the top of the mash to get a reading.

Couple of questions.

Should I adjust my equip profile in BS to make up for low efficiency ? Or try to improve my process by adjusting mash PH? Probably both and adjust as eff goes up.

Should I mash longer?

I did some wet runs to calculate for boil off so overall I think my volumes are ok. I saw somewhere the COFI the Brew Boss doesn’t need grains crushed as much as other BIAB systems due to the recirculating mash. If this is true then I’m leaning towards adjusting my water PH before mashing. Adjusting water profiles is not an area I have gotten into yet. I just got a refractometer and ph meter for Christmas so I’m looking to start. I really want to make big beers so hopefully adjusting water will help! I also made my first starter for this batch.

Mash until conversion is completed.


If the profile you are using came from beersmith I would go into the equipment profiles and copy that to a new one with a different name and make changes to that new profile to reflect your system. Then when you make a new recipe use that profile and you will be all set.​

 

[ba-brewer]

Nevermind my comment about beersmith not showing pre boil gravity, they do show that. It is the first running gravity that it does not show. For full volume that is the same thing. I batch sparge so that is why I calculate separately.

I load the brewboss profile to see what it gives. Personally I think the 74% BHE is too high for a full volume mash, every time I do a full volume mash I get about 65% BHE. I lose 1gal to kettle trub and .25gal to fermentor trub.

grain crush will greatly effect your efficiency, too coarse and it will slow the conversion and make it had to get to full conversion. Having your own mill helps.

If you ended at 1062 with 5.8gal (5.5 in carboy + .3gal of trub) and started at 7.4gal your pre boil was 1048. You should of been up closer to 1060 so your conversion was like 80% complete.

1.6gal is a pretty high boil off. To get good numbers for efficiency you need to be accurate in your measurements of volumes and gravities. If your post volume were higher(less boil off) then you had better conversion.

Getting good results from beersmith and brewing in general take a few trys to get thing dialed in. Take note and adjust accordingly.