Help me make the reddest beer that was ever red

[Bradinator]

Munich Malt makes beer red.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/belgian-red-ale-278458/

That is a very red beer. I have been trying to avoid buying any 'primary' malt for my brews because I have an immense amount of Pilsner, Pale Ale and 2-Row on hand... Though I could get a few pounds of Munich just for this batch...

I'm convinced that Raspberries would work great. Of course, if you don't want fruit in your beer it could pose a problem.

Here's a picture of a beautiful Raspberry Mead (Melomel):

Gorgeous!. I thought about the fruit a bit, but I want this to be an very hoppy IPA and I don't think fruit will work well.

 

[Bradinator]

So here is my initial recipe

Munich Malt 51%
Pilsner Malt 26%
Carared 6.5%
Crystal 120L 6.5%
Roasted Barely 3% (needed?)

1oz Warrior @ 60
0.5oz Cascade @ 45
0.5oz Cascade @ 30
0.5oz Amarillo @ 20
0.5oz Amarillo @ 5

Dry Hop for 14 days with 1oz Hibiscus (more?), 1oz Safflower

Thoughts?

 

[ZamaMan]

This may not be the reddest beer ever but arrogant bastard has a great rich dark red that I find beautiful along with tasting awesome. Jamils near perfect clone was with special B. I just kegged it and the color and flavor is dead on.

 

[DannPM]

So here is my initial recipe

Munich Malt 51%
Pilsner Malt 26%
Carared 6.5%
Crystal 120L 6.5%
Roasted Barely 3% (needed?)

1oz Warrior @ 60
0.5oz Cascade @ 45
0.5oz Cascade @ 30
0.5oz Amarillo @ 20
0.5oz Amarillo @ 5

Dry Hop for 14 days with 1oz Hibiscus (more?), 1oz Safflower

Thoughts?

What is the srm of this? If it is too dark I've be afraid of it taking away from the brightness of the kind of red you get. That is pure speculation on my part though.

 

[Bradinator]

What is the srm of this? If it is too dark I've be afraid of it taking away from the brightness of the kind of red you get. That is pure speculation on my part though.

According to beersmith 17.8.

If I drop the Roasted Barely, its 12.4

 

[DannPM]

Personally I'd do that then, I'd drop the roasted barley and half the c120, that's a lot of c120 imo.

Adding a touch of melanoidan malt, maybe 4% and bump the cara red up with whatever percentage is leftover (2%?). The mel malt makes a beer red as well (I'm on my phone or I'd do the math, can't go back on the app)

 

[urbanmyth]

If you can afford it, saffron added with the hibiscus and safflower would probably do a hell of a lot color-wise. I have no idea on the flavor of saffron, never had it, least of all in beer. But I do know it is the world's most expensive spice by weight. So...I dunno if price is a limiting factor.

 

[Bradinator]

Price is not a limiting factor, just availability. If I can buy it locally I will, if I need to order it I won't be getting it. Also not too worried about any flavour the spice/herbs add because of the amount of hops being used should mask it.

Munich Malt 60%
Pilsner Malt 22%
Carared 7%
Melanoiden 7%
Crystal 120L 4%

1oz Warrior @ 60
0.5oz Cascade @ 45
0.5oz Cascade @ 30
0.5oz Amarillo @ 20
0.5oz Amarillo @ 5

 

[DannPM]

Dude that looks great IMO. I think you will have one hell of a red beer from that!

Edit: the more I look at that the stronger that recipes looks towards making a great malty hoppy red ale. Strong work man!

 

[urbanmyth]

I am very interested in the end result! Please post some pictures during and after brewing.

 

[Boy]

Forgot one other thing I found. I use beercalculus.com for my recipes. I noticed that on their SRM scales a recipe for 5 gallons at an SRM of 13 comes out fairly red with almost no brown. But on 10 gallons 13 SRM will come out more orange and 15 will be more brown. Also if you add adjuncts like hibiscus or raspberries make sure to do a thorough a cold crash. If it's cloudy it will darken up and you will lose the red. My first attempt was definitely red but was so cloudy that it gave it a weird color that wasn't brown so much as grey-ish red?

 

[emjay]

The SRM scale is really one-dimensional though. For instance, you could be in the golden range of the SRM scale, but have a beer that LOOKS brown (or blue, for that matter!). IMO, the vivid orange part of the scale is probably best to shoot for if you want a visually similar vivid red beer. I definitely wouldn't go any higher.

 

[Boy]

I agree and have noticed this. Just trying to say that when I employed the tricks I've mentioned in this thread I noticed that I needed to scale the recipes to differently to get the same coloring.

 

[Bradinator]

Awesome. Well I am going to brew this next weekend.

I am still thinking I will dry hop with various red herbs, most likely hibiscus and safflower and possibly saffron if I can find it, but that won't be for a couple weeks after the brew date.

I will keep everyone updated

 

[jonpecan]

I didn't read all (ok, just about none) of the replies, but my profile pic is beer the result of beets. On my phone now, but feel free to let me know if you'd like more details

 

[paulster2626]

I didn't read all (ok, just about none) of the replies, but my profile pic is beer the result of beets. On my phone now, but feel free to let me know if you'd like more details

I would like more details. I need to perfect a nice beet recipe by the start of next summer.

 

[VanHolton]

Check out that link posted by maxam on the first page of this thread. I used beets the same way as the guy in post #18 of that thread and had great results! VERY red indeed! You blend two peeled, raw beets with (i think) 2 cups of water and strain it. The resulting liquid is blood red and you add it to the boil at 10 min. That way you can maintain clarity quite well. I have a couple pics of mine in my profile, I believe. FWIW, I've tried roasted barley and melanoidin too, but never got away from shades of orange or brown until I tried beets.

 

[emjay]

What flavor did the beets impart?

IMO, that's not much different than resorting to food coloring, which he doesn't want to do. Being able to do it without any odd ingredients would just be a million times more awesome.

If you can get a vivid orange, you're already going in the right direction. A beet red beer is not likely, but it's actually possible, even sticking to the Reinheitsgebot, to come up with a beer indistinguishable from a bright red wine. This is just an extreme example though... I'm not one to ever care about the German purity law.

Melanoidins and sparing use of dark malts are definitely going to be important, and I'm pretty sure that an extended boil is pretty much necessary to bring out the best red possible.

Heck, one could experiment with various grain bills on a very small scale before committing to a large scale batch. Using a cooler, a bunch of smaller containers, and some small grain or hop bags, you should actually be able to mash MANY different grists simultaneously.

 

[emjay]

Also... for a roasted malt, I would consider using chocolate rye malt. I don't know what it is about rye, but rye beers (such as a RyePA) definitely tend to have a noticeably reddish hue.

 

[Bradinator]

Check out that link posted by maxam on the first page of this thread. I used beets the same way as the guy in post #18 of that thread and had great results! VERY red indeed! You blend two peeled, raw beets with (i think) 2 cups of water and strain it. The resulting liquid is blood red and you add it to the boil at 10 min. That way you can maintain clarity quite well. I have a couple pics of mine in my profile, I believe. FWIW, I've tried roasted barley and melanoidin too, but never got away from shades of orange or brown until I tried beets.

Intriguing. Do you think a batch made with a low DRM beer (say from a pure Pils or 2-Rom) mixed with a decent amount of beet could give the intense red I am looking for?

How did it affect the flavour? I am all for using herbs and misc in my beer... Unless it makes it taste like farts.

 

[jonpecan]

My experience was strange - I tried to make a "Red Velvet Ale", so I added various things like cocoa nibs, vanilla beans, etc. Also a touch of rye malt for some reason. So I can't say much for the beet taste for sure - there was too much going on, and a whitbread yeast.

But to ensure redness came through, I tried to keep my lovibond low,, so I used 8 lbs of Pilsner malt. The rest was 1 Lb rye malt. 8 oz of Victory, 8 oz carapils, 4 oz acidulated (a strange concoction). In short, nothing too darkening.

In the mash tun, I added 2 smaller skinned, chopped beets to the mash tun. It started quite red when transferring to the kettle, but as I cooked, the redness faded significantly. You could hardly tell they were added at all.

At the last 5 minutes of boil, in a muslin bag I steeped about 3 larger, skinned, chopped beets. They stayed in until transfer to primary fermenter. The redness maintained, as you see it in my profile pic. My recommendation just based on my experience is very late boil addition.

Good luck! Post pictures!

 

[jonpecan]

Though fair warning, though the beer was blood red, the foam was pink!

 

[Bradinator]

I think you sold me on the beets. It will save me some cash on specialty malts as I have a ton of Pilsner on hand and with all the hops I plan to use it should mask any oddness the beets would add

 

[passedpawn]

The beets can add a very noticeable earthiness. They also bleed red.

So, you will get the color you desire, but also a "root" flavor. (When I was young we used to pull a lot of stuff out of the ground and eat it, wild carrots, etc., that's the nature that beets add to the beer).

 

[Bradinator]

The beets can add a very noticeable earthiness. They also bleed red.

So, you will get the color you desire, but also a "root" flavor. (When I was young we used to pull a lot of stuff out of the ground and eat it, wild carrots, etc., that's the nature that beets add to the beer).

I think I know what your talking about and that actually does not sound too bad at all.

I cannot wait to see how this beer will turn out! I will post the final recipe this weekend when I brew it... Though to be honest I have have not decided on which path I will choose.

The path the traditionalist using malt to achieve the colour I want, or maybe the path of the beetmaster. For his beets are red indeed.

 

[Bradinator]

I opted for a more traditional approach to achieve the redness, though I am still planning to dry hop with a couple ounces of Safflower. I also used 1/2oz of Safflower in the boil. Sadly the LHBS store had basically none of the hops I wanted so I had to improvise.

Hopefully it still turns out!

Here is the recipe. Mashed in at ~150F for 2.5 hours (had to run an errand that took a lot longer then expected).

Grains
• 4.0 lbs Munich Malt
• 3.0 lbs Pilsner Malt
• 0.5lbs Carared
• 0.5lbs Melanoiden Malt
• 0.25lbs Crystal 120L

Hops
• 1.0oz Chinook @ 60min
• 0.5oz Cascade @ 45min
• 0.5oz Cascade @ 30min
• 0.5oz Falconer's Flight @ 20min
• ½ oz Safflower @ 10 min
• 0.5oz Falconer's Flight @ 5min

 

[VanHolton]

Intriguing. Do you think a batch made with a low DRM beer (say from a pure Pils or 2-Rom) mixed with a decent amount of beet could give the intense red I am looking for?

How did it affect the flavour? I am all for using herbs and misc in my beer... Unless it makes it taste like farts.

It did have a slightly earthy flavor. Nothing unpleasant about it. Probably could be masked if you wanted with maybe some Munich added to a light base, or even some hop bursting. Depends on what you're going for. Red as hell though.

 

[DannPM]

I opted for a more traditional approach to achieve the redness, though I am still planning to dry hop with a couple ounces of Safflower. I also used 1/2oz of Safflower in the boil. Sadly the LHBS store had basically none of the hops I wanted so I had to improvise.

Hopefully it still turns out!

Here is the recipe. Mashed in at ~150F for 2.5 hours (had to run an errand that took a lot longer then expected).

Grains
• 4.0 lbs Munich Malt
• 3.0 lbs Pilsner Malt
• 0.5lbs Carared
• 0.5lbs Melanoiden Malt
• 0.25lbs Crystal 120L

Hops
• 1.0oz Chinook @ 60min
• 0.5oz Cascade @ 45min
• 0.5oz Cascade @ 30min
• 0.5oz Falconer's Flight @ 20min
• ½ oz Safflower @ 10 min
• 0.5oz Falconer's Flight @ 5min

Do you have any pics of any brew day hydro samples for this man?

 

[Bradinator]

None from the OG, but I have some of the boil. I will be taking another reading this weekend so I will try to throw up some pictures then.

I went back to the natural food store to see if they had anymore safflower in but they are still out. I got a couple weeks before I move it to the secondary for 'dry hopping' so I am hoping they get some stock.

If not they did have saffron... Very, very expensive saffron. I think it was $8 for 20 grams. I am hesitant on buying it, not only for the price but because I am unsure if it will give the same intense red colour safflower does though according to Wikipedia it can be used as a dye. But would 20 grams be enough to make it worth using?

 

[gclunde]

Blood Orange Hefe is an already VERY popular (and published) recipe of Sam Calagione from Dogfish Head. Though I'd wager that's not exactly news to you.

I did not know that... Thanks for the information. I think I know what is going to be next in my brewpot.

 

[Bradinator]

Looking nice and red already.

 

[Bradinator]

I broke down and had a bottle last night. It is still a bit young with only 9 days in the bottles, but it was fantastic tasting none-the-less. Unfortunately I missed the colour I was trying to attain for this beer, but considering how flavourful it ended up being I am not overly disheartened.

 

[Boy]

I'll remember to post a pic of mine at bottling in about 2 weeks. Mixed the crystals I mentioned, roasted barley, and about 6oz beet juice with 2 min left in boil. Had a really interesting red hue during transfer but honestly seemed a little dark.