Help me decide between Spike CF10 and SSBrewtech Unitank

[Vale71]

If there's any questions we can help with we'd be happy to assist! If you're specifically looking at the lid then I think ours wins hands down. Our lid comes off completely for easy cleaning. With the SS you would need to stick your arm into a small port to try to clean it when the time comes. And good luck trying to get down into the cone area for cleaning!

That's a non-issue as you don't need to put your hands inside the fermenter to clean it under any circumstance.

 

[Jag75]

That's a non-issue as you don't need to put your hands inside the fermenter to clean it under any circumstance.

I'm not sure i agree with this 100%. If you have a cp ball maybe . Ive had hard krausen lines where even a long soak didn't get it completely off.

It gives me piece of mind to be able to take my lid off and inspect the inside . Ive even had to clean the inside of my lid .

 

[eric19312]

I'll add where the lid design on the Spike comes in handy... Probably not recommended but I ferment in my CF15 very very full. Right up to the lid seal when I can that is about 17.5-18 gallons. Sometimes end up with yeast in my blow off growler. My krausen "ring" frequently covers just about the entire inside surface of the lid. If I add dry hops when there is a fair amount of CO2 in suspension I can get some crazy foaming activity in there and blow off and that stuff sticks to everything. I do have the CIP ball and a decent sump pump and CIP with heated water but it really doesn't shoot a lot of cleaning solution straight up. Being able to get the entire lid off for cleaning the lid is helpful.

Also the CIP balls designed to work with homebrew pumps clog pretty easily. Can't speak for the SS brewtech CIP ball but using the Spike ball I really need to clean most of the krausen off especially if it has dry hop pellets in it before I start working on it with the spray ball else it will clog and not spin. I spray my conical down well in the driveway to get rid of the yeast, and clean the lid and any krausen ring with warm water and a soft sponge until visibly clean. Then I reassemble and CIP/SIP.

 

[Vale71]

I'm not sure i agree with this 100%. If you have a cp ball maybe . Ive had hard krausen lines where even a long soak didn't get it completely off.

It gives me piece of mind to be able to take my lid off and inspect the inside . Ive even had to clean the inside of my lid .

You just need the right product at the right concentration and the right temperature, which means hotter than what warm water comes out of your tap at. To achieve that I recirculate a caustic cleaner solution from dump port to blow-off cane (bottom to top) through my RIMS tube until I get to 80°C then let sit for half an hour. I've never had any deposit either above or below the beer level that didn't completely dissolve thus requiring no scrubbing whatsoever.

 

[Broothru]

You just need the right product at the right concentration and the right temperature, which means hotter than what warm water comes out of your tap at. To achieve that I recirculate a caustic cleaner solution from dump port to blow-off cane (bottom to top) through my RIMS tube until I get to 80°C then let sit for half an hour. I've never had any deposit either above or below the beer level that didn't completely dissolve thus requiring no scrubbing whatsoever.

+1

Had plenty of hard krausen. Never had an issue cleaning my unitank. I bought the "large" Brewtech CIP ball, hooked it up to a 17 gpm sump pump, added 1 gallon of hot faucet water (120F) and PBW. Even though it cleaned quite efficiently, it was overkill. Fact of the matter is I didn't need it, and haven't used the CIP in nearly a year.

After pressure transferring to serving kegs and recovering yeast, I now just do a hot rinse with a sink sprayer. Any residual gunk or krausen is soaked with hot water/PBW for an hour or so, drained and rinsed, sanitized with a thorough StarSan spray-down and allowed to air dry.

I do remove and clean all the TC mounted valves, sampling ports, manifolds, etc., but I'd have to do the same thing regardless of whatever fermenter I used. In fact it's the same thing I do with my Ss Brewtech Chronical with the removable lid like the Spike gear.

There are many features on the Spike gear that I wish I had on my Ss gear, EXCEPT the removable lid for pressurized operations. The tank construction of the Ss Unitank with 6" TC port has never given me a cleaning issue in the year and a half I've used it. I much prefer it to the removable lid on the Chronical and the Spike Brewing design. My $.02 cents.

Brooo Brother

 

[Bohern]

For those who own a CF10 or CF15 how do you dry hop and remain closed or low oxygen? also how hard / easy is it to get a good seal and hold pressure when carbing up?

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I have a cf15 and its a piece of cake, now there are more ways then one to go about it but i keep it simple. i push co2 in while opening the top port and have my wife quickly dump in the hops then i close it up and purge several times. for sealing and carbing i have a glycol setup so ill do crash and dump then carbonate. i have never had an issue, i think it takes me maybe 10 seconds the set the so called finicky gasket in the lid. the band tightens well, i have 2 cf15's actually and never had an issue with either one. there are ways you can dry hop that are essentially oxygen free using some extra components that i have yet to purchase. but my way works for me so not gonna spend the extra money unless i have an issue... or feel the need for to buy something new and shiny.

cheers!

 

[eric19312]

For those who own a CF10 or CF15 how do you dry hop and remain closed or low oxygen? also how hard / easy is it to get a good seal and hold pressure when carbing up?

There is a whole thread on this question here somewhere. I think this one...https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/no-oxygen-dry-hopping.663500/

I'm doing it a couple ways. When I'm lazy I do pretty much what @bailey mountain brewer said. I run CO2 in through the manifold at about 5PSI while quickly opening the 4" TC port and dumping in the hops. You want to be quick about that because if there is a lot of CO2 in solution you will get a lot of foaming and if you are not fast enough getting the 4" port sealed you will have quite a mess. (dont ask me how I learned this one )

If I want to be just a little more ambitious I hook of the CO2 to the bottom dump valve so I am blowing CO2 up through the beer. I don't think it really matters but part of what makes TC fun to play with its like legos you can change all sorts of things.

Finally when I have a lot of energy and am open to possible frustration I am still trying to get the Norcal yeast brink to work. Will be playing with that this weekend. There is some technique that isn't really covered in the site's videos but think I am getting closer. This device in theory allows you to fully purge the sight glass full of hops with CO2, pull beer into the glass to wet and disintegrate the hops and then use CO2 to shoot the hop slurry up into the cone. Problem is getting a good slurry as the pellets expand rapidly when they get wet and become hard to work with. Work in progress wish me luck.

What I haven't tried is the @mongoose33 technique. I don't have room for mounting sight glass and valves above my conical as currently configured. My conical is in a standup freezer and I've got only about 6" of clearance above the top port. I'd probably try that before the yeast brink if I had the vertical clearance.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

haha, as eric19312 said, gotta work quick. the first time i did my lazy method i got a bunch of foam also. definitely a lesson learned so now i always have a helping hand to make sure it is quick as possible. i have also connected the co2 in other places and didnt seem to have any better or worse results, i agree its just fun.

 

[NewJersey]

I ended up going with a flex+. The lid design of the SS brewtech is obviously, in theory anyways, a stronger and easier to line up design.
I've found in practice however that the band clamp design works flawlessly and holds well past 15lbs pressure if needed.
I'm not an engineer but I wish they made a TC lid fermenter that was massive. Think 12-14" across. I'm sure there are multiple reasons this is a bad idea, but it would be best of both worlds kinda

 

[eric19312]

I ended up going with a flex+. The lid design of the SS brewtech is obviously, in theory anyways, a stronger and easier to line up design.
I've found in practice however that the band clamp design works flawlessly and holds well past 15lbs pressure if needed.
I'm not an engineer but I wish they made a TC lid fermenter that was massive. Think 12-14" across. I'm sure there are multiple reasons this is a bad idea, but it would be best of both worlds kinda

how about this design:
https://www.glaciertanks.com/tanks-home-brew-tanks-fm-15-gal.html

 

[Tom R]

Or this:
8 Gallon Stainless Steel Conical Fermentor from Brewers Hardware

Or a jacketed version:
8 Gallon Stainless Steel Glycol Jacketed Conical Fermentor from Brewers Hardware

 

[NewJersey]

Or this:
8 Gallon Stainless Steel Conical Fermentor from Brewers Hardware

Or a jacketed version:
8 Gallon Stainless Steel Glycol Jacketed Conical Fermentor from Brewers Hardware

Guys I already went and looked at by their site after my post because I was curious and yes, that jacketed 8 gallon is calling my name! That would be the only way I'd ever be convinced to go glycol. very nice and I'm sure worth the money, but I'm still comfortable with my flex for now. One day tho...

 

[Bohern]

Thanks for the replies gang. I own a Spike system for my brew setup and love it for that. I guess I will just need to sit down and decide which feature of the two are the most important to me.

 

[Bohern]

@Brooothru and @Vale71 what size Unitank do you have?

 

[Broothru]

@Brooothru and @Vale71 what size Unitank do you have?

7 gallon.

 

[Bohern]

7 gallon.

You sound happy with it to, any wisdom to share if I were to go this way?

 

[Broothru]

You sound happy with it to, any wisdom to share if I were to go this way?

I'm extremely pleased with the Brewtech Unitank, but in all honesty I think you'd be equally happy with either. I feel a lot more comfortable with the solid tank (non-detachable lid) of the Ss design. I like the multiple TC ports. on the top of the Spike.

What I'm really a cheerleader for though is the 'concept' of a unitank. I really feel like I have to be super cautious doing pressure transfers in my Chronical to not exceed 2.5 psig, but a sudden pressure spike of 20 psig in the Unitank when I'm shooting for 15 is no big deal. I can spund in the unitank, cold crash from ambient to 30F with sufficient head pressure to not be concerned with suckback or negative pressure implosion. If I want to ferment under pressure I've got options AND control.

Sure, you can spund and pressure ferment in a keg, but temperature control and yeast harvesting as well as trub dumping is not available. The unitank really does combine the best features of a conical fermenter and a kegmenter with the unique abilities of a brite tank. I preferred the features of the Ss Brewtech over Spike. Personal choice. But I believe that you can't go wrong with either one.

Brooo Brother

 

[Bohern]

Thanks @Brooothru you hit on a few things I am thinking as well.

 

[NeoBrew]

I've got the 7 gallon SSBrewtech as well. I'm extremely happy with it. I can't speak for the larger size units, but at 7 gallons the size of the opening at the top is a non issue. It's large enough to get your arm in there and my arm reaches all the way to the bottom with no problem.

It was nice for me to get all the options and accessories right from the start. When I priced up the Spike for comparable accessories it was within about $50. I was also put off by Spike a little as they announced the 7 gallon and then it took the better part of a year to come to market. I understand it's a challenge to bring things to market, it just so happened to be the time I would like to have bought mine.

I'm very happy with mine and would recommend it to anyone. I can say without hesitation that I've never had to fiddle with the top to get it to seal. You put it on, clamp it down and it's sealed. No need to flip the gasket, apply lubricant, or crank down on clamps to make it work.

 

[Bohern]

I am looking to ferment 10 gallon batches but from what I have seen online the CIP does well on the larger fermenters too.

 

[Broothru]

Thats true. The larger sized CIP from Ss Brewtech is actually made for larger (14 gal., 1 bbl). But what really affects cleaning ability is pump output. Even in smaller applications, a Chugger or standard March pump might not be enough. I use a submersible sump pump I bought at Home Depot. It puts out 17 gpm and can "pump uphill" over 10' of rise. I throttled the output to the CIP ball with a ball valve on the pump initially, but later determined I didn't need to slow the flow volume.

 

[Bohern]

Thats true. The larger sized CIP from Ss Brewtech is actually made for larger (14 gal., 1 bbl). But what really affects cleaning ability is pump output. Even in smaller applications, a Chugger or standard March pump might not be enough. I use a submersible sump pump I bought at Home Depot. It puts out 17 gpm and can "pump uphill" over 10' of rise. I throttled the output to the CIP ball with a ball valve on the pump initially, but later determined I didn't need to slow the flow volume.

My first attempt will be to use one of my Blichmann Riptides with 160 deg water from my kettle, if that doesn't cut it I was going to use one like the one you mention. This guy in the video below does what I think you are talking about. Well besides the use of Starsan maybe.

 

[Vale71]

@Brooothru and @Vale71 what size Unitank do you have?

14

 

[k-daddy]

I'm not sure i agree with this 100%. If you have a cp ball maybe . Ive had hard krausen lines where even a long soak didn't get it completely off.

It gives me piece of mind to be able to take my lid off and inspect the inside . Ive even had to clean the inside of my lid .

I have a CF5 and agree completely. Be nice to the gasket, make sure it is seated correctly, use a thin layer of keg lube for a good seal (I ferment under 6-8psi) and you’re all set. The ability to access the entire conical with the lid removed for cleaning and inspection is one of the reasons I went with the Spike. I think some get hung up on the fact that it’s not a TC fitting as I almost did when deciding between the Spike and the SS.

 

[atlref]

Let me start by saying that you cant go wrong with either conical. I own one of each. Initially I bought the SS Brewtech about two years ago and was pretty happy with it. It was a big upgrade from my carboys.

A few of the things I didn't like about the SS Brewtech was the 1.5" sanitary 90 degree elbow into the 3/4" ball valve would consistently get clogged with any IPA I would brew. I would have to push a sight glass cleaning bush through it to get it to dump. What a mess it would make. The other big issue for me was the pressure transfer would not work very well. You can only put a couple PSI to it per the recommendation. It gravity transferred much better. When I would transfer to a keg it would typically take about 20 minutes to fill a keg. The other drawback was that it didn't have a sampling valve.

My recent addition was the Spike Brewing conical. I decided to try their conical after buying 3 new brew pots from them. Man! What a difference. Everything about it is top notch. I have used it 3 times now and each time I use it I love it more. To start it has a 4" cap on the lid to make adding stuff in the top a breeze. I even oxygenate through it. It also is super thick so you can put up to 15 PSI in it. The large 2" dump valve makes dumping trub and hops a breeze. It has never clogged on me and I put a pound of hops in it on my last IPA. The sampling valve makes it very easy to pull a sample for testing as well. Everything is connected with sanitary fitting, even the thermowell. To top it all off, Spike has the absolute best customer service and support I have ever experienced. The have always responded within a few hours.

In conclusion, I would HIGHLY recommend going with the Spike Brewing conical for all the reasons I listed above. I included a couple pics as well.

Let me know if you have any questions.

View attachment 417893

View attachment 417894

Can you tell me where you got that brew stand?

 

[Bohern]

14

That is exactly the size I am looking at. From what I have read of your posts even with that size using CIP cleaning is not difficult right?

The only negative I have thought of is maybe not being able to do a 5 gal batch, is that true or no?

 

[Bohern]

@NeoBrew @Vale71 @Brooothru I ordered my 14 Gal Unitank today, thanks for the info and help.

To everyone else I want to say thanks as well, I will add a Spike version in the near future. Both of these fermenters will have a place in my brewery.

 

[Broothru]

Congratulations! You wouldn't have gone wrong either way since both are excellent builds. Enjoy many years of brewing successes. Now, about those glycol chillers....

 

[NeoBrew]

Now, about those glycol chillers....

Don't do it! Enclosed refrigerators for the win!