Help, I've made a monster. First timer concern's.

[Iron_meaden]

Hello everyone. So I've read and read and watched video's. Then I threw caution to the wind. I have a gallon carboy with 3.5 (roughly) lbs of honey and enough motts Apple juice to bring it up to the shoulder. Here is my problem. Using lalvin 1118 how much yeast should I have pitched initially and should I use more? We used about a half packet but I feel confident it's going to need more. It's got a bit of fermax to help but seems like more yeast would be better? I'm not shooting for some syrupy sweet wine. Id rather go rocket fuel than low abv. Oh and had some leftover must and that got thrown in a quart container and airlocked for fun. Now I have a mead filled airlock on that little guy. I could use and would appreciate greatly any help. I don't wanna lose anything. I have a friend "helping me" and he seems to consider this carboy an acceptable loss as long as we learn something. I don't accept failure as readily and won't tolerate a bad batch if there is anything at all I can do about it. Original gravity came out at 1.150 with a projected abv of 19.6% and that's where my concern about having enough yeast comes into play. Really lost in what seemed to be a simple first time homebrew.

 

[Maylar]

3.5 lbs in a gallon of apple juice would be closer to 1.170, which would be impossible to ferment. Even if your 1.150 is correct, you're in the experts-only realm. Chances are good that it'll stall or possibly not start at all. Definitely use the whole pack of yeast, hydrated per Lalvin's instructions.

 

[CKuhns]

Add the rest of the yeast and consider splitting it into two jugs and add apple juice to fill them. Should bring the SG down to something a little easier to ferment and doubles your output.

 

[Iron_meaden]

so repitching a whole pack of yeast the right way could still pull us out of the red? This is all starting to cause arguments and bad vibes between room mates. Was supposed to be simple and fun and is now looking like it's more or less bs. Splitting it is apparently out of the question for other people involved. Idk what to do but if people continue to get mad about it I'm about a day from smashing the carboy and moving out. It's gotta work. We have foam and bubbles popping in the carboy. I think it is starting to ferment. Need some actual point a point b answers here. Everyone has so many opposing opinions and contradicting answers about the same questions. I'm not trying to be a sick I'm just getting a little more than angry with the process and people. fun isn't supposed to cause frustration and negative feelings.

 

[bigdawg86]

The apple juice may be a problem if it has preservatives in terms of yeast activity. It seems the run before you can walk thing may bite you on this one...

 

[Iron_meaden]

Steamrolled by someone who apparently has something against learning from others and suffers a lack of patience among other things. No preservatives listed on the bottle. should I just say screw it and let him destroy nothing for a long time and be fruitless alone? Or is there some solution.

 

[bigdawg86]

When you ask these questions, it would help if people were able to know what your process was or wasn't. By the sound of things you threw honey into a carboy, topped it off with juice, didn't mix anything and added yeast. Tell us exactly what you did up until this point. We can't answer questions without knowing the process. So far I hear more emotions than stuff we can help you with.

 

[Iron_meaden]

Basically. everything went into star San Honey and juice went in the clean carboy. Shook to mix until no honey settled for some time. The yeast got a very poor start no idea on water temp not way not and not way cold by any means probably well under a 15 minute rehydration. Everything being about room temp at that point. yeast was pitched impatiently and without measurement. Id say close to half a packet 1118. And a teaspoon of fermax shook a bit again. Plug and airlock with star San put in top. Has been sitting a day and a half now at about 66°. sometime overnight..... A lot of foam has developed and you can see bubbles running up the side building and breaking. Airlock activity is either happening when I am not watching or not yet at least. In this time there is already some sediment at the bottom I'm wondering if some of it is yeast that couldn't take the abuse, some of it is Apple chunks from the motts. On a side note we had some left over that went into a small container and half the airlock is full of must. Before I mess with that in trying to figure out if this is worth it, salvageable and if I need to help the gallon carboy out any. don't want to sanitize on a small scale just to turn around and have to do it with more equipment if need be. Sorry about the anger it's not for you people to deal with. I'm sure you've had an adult child room mate at some point and don't need the stories.

 

[bigdawg86]

Well if there are bubbles, then it is likely starting to ferment. There is no harm in pitching the rest of the yeast. There will always be sediment with anything that ferments so no worries there. Like others stated the yeast may stall out, but at this point you need to be patient and let it ride. Part of me wants to suggest dumping the carboy into a pot, do a quick boil to pasteurize, dilute with H20 until at 2 gallons, let it cool, then repitch. You will have more hooch in the end and the yeast will have a better chance at fermenting out completely. If that's not possible, then let it ride, be patient, and must I remind you, be patient.

 

[Smom1976]

My apple juice took over a week longer than the other 3 and with help for my first time. I ended up hydrating yeast with honey added and pitched that into the carboy along with the other stuff. It still took a long time to bubble. It's still going.

 

[bracconiere]

at 1.150 beer smith tells me 20.4% i've never gotten a yeast to ferment higher then 16%, and that was a turbo strain after washing...

i'd say you could try one of the fancy distillers yeasts that 'claim' to go that high..But being you stated you don't handle failure well, my vote is, split and dilute.

That strain claims to go to 18%? does anyone know if it actually backs up it's 'big mouth'? (but you'd still have to dillute it)

 

[Iron_meaden]

so what I'm getting is splitting and repitching is favorable? I'm wondering if taking a new sg might be beneficial as well. It's not handling failure so much as a focus on prevention. Left to my own devices id have been much more thorough. I appreciate the quick responses. I really only had hoped for 14-18% range best case scenario and nothing under 10% if possible. If we can do that well I'd be happy. I've seen claims of 20% with 1118 but I don't know enough yet to judge when someone is mistaken or full of it. My idea behind it was that at the higher tolerance and wide temp range it would potentially be a bit more abuse tolerant. I'm open to suggestions here and apparently for the moment in control. Any help suggestions or knowledge is greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time and patience.

 

[LuckyDuckAT]

so repitching a whole pack of yeast the right way could still pull us out of the red? This is all starting to cause arguments and bad vibes between room mates. Was supposed to be simple and fun and is now looking like it's more or less bs. Splitting it is apparently out of the question for other people involved. Idk what to do but if people continue to get mad about it I'm about a day from smashing the carboy and moving out. It's gotta work. We have foam and bubbles popping in the carboy. I think it is starting to ferment. Need some actual point a point b answers here. Everyone has so many opposing opinions and contradicting answers about the same questions. I'm not trying to be a sick I'm just getting a little more than angry with the process and people. fun isn't supposed to cause frustration and negative feelings.

I would dump it for the reason that it most likely isn't going to turn out well. A bad buzz and probably a sick stomach will accompany. However, you all could invest in an extract kit for a beer you all like, add some DME, or honey even to boost your ABV a little bit. You will want to bottle though for carbonation. $20 gets you some crowns and capper! Cheers

 

[bracconiere]

split it, dilute it..(goes to beer smith to calculate 14%) ...best guess using beersmith if you split it into two gallons, and top them both up with more apple juice somewhere around ~12.9%...and if you've already pitched...I don't know if the osmotic pressure would be enough to kill the yeast, i doubt it..but without diluting the alcohol would, and it'd end up sweet...

So probably don't need to repitch...(wouldn't hurt though?)

 

[Blacksmith1]

I've seen 1118 claimed at 23% Was he full of it? Am I? you have no way to know for sure and for any given question you can get several answers. Most of the guys on here know what they are doing, and just because you get 2 answers doesn't mean one is wrong. you might be looking at a difference of opinion or protocol.
that said if you are seeing foam, and bubbles in the must you probably have yeast activity. your choices are as stated above, ride it out and see, re pitch (which won't change much since you already have breeding yeasts), or split and dilute which as stated will give you more product at the end. and BTW you are making a cyser (AJ and honey) not a mead (water and honey).

 

[Maylar]

Basically. everything went into star San Honey and juice went in the clean carboy. Shook to mix until no honey settled for some time. The yeast got a very poor start no idea on water temp not way not and not way cold by any means probably well under a 15 minute rehydration. Everything being about room temp at that point. yeast was pitched impatiently and without measurement. Id say close to half a packet 1118. And a teaspoon of fermax shook a bit again. Plug and airlock with star San put in top. Has been sitting a day and a half now at about 66°. sometime overnight..... A lot of foam has developed and you can see bubbles running up the side building and breaking. Airlock activity is either happening when I am not watching or not yet at least. In this time there is already some sediment at the bottom I'm wondering if some of it is yeast that couldn't take the abuse, some of it is Apple chunks from the motts. On a side note we had some left over that went into a small container and half the airlock is full of must. Before I mess with that in trying to figure out if this is worth it, salvageable and if I need to help the gallon carboy out any. don't want to sanitize on a small scale just to turn around and have to do it with more equipment if need be. Sorry about the anger it's not for you people to deal with. I'm sure you've had an adult child room mate at some point and don't need the stories.

You're getting a lot of different replies here, let me try to explain what's up.

Yeast have a maximum sugar level that they can handle without stress. It's not just about alcohol tolerance. Above that level, they can go into what's called osmotic shock. The ferment can stall, or sometimes not start at all. You're pushing that threshold at 1.150, even with EC-1118. That's why these folks are suggesting diluting your must down to something safe. I suggest being below 1.120.

Definitely use all the yeast you have, properly rehydrated.

You have added Fermax up front, but mead needs more nutrients than that for a clean ferment. If all you have is Fermax, you can make nutrient by boiling a packet of bread yeast in 1/2 cup water. Add some now (or when you split the batch), and again in 2 days. You'll have a better chance of avoiding fusel alcohols and off flavors if you do this.

If you're seeing bubbles and getting sediment (called lees) then it is fermenting. No bubbles in your airlock just means you have a leak.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

I’m thinking that when making high ABV mead, one needs to start off with a reasonable SG, then add more honey as the yeast eats it’s way through it. When the gravity is too high the yeast are stressed, and may even die. The advice to split the batch and repitch is good. Patience is needed. If you want something to drink and be proud of approach this as a winemaker, if you just want hooch, and to get buzzed, save your effort and go to the liquor store.

 

[MaxStout]

Sure, you can go full speed ahead with your original plan, but as others have mentioned, with OG around 150 points the yeast will likely crap out long before it gets to FG. You'll have a very sweet mead--if the yeast even makes it much past the osmotic force of OG to begin with. And if by some miracle the yeast eats its way through all that sugar and you hit your target FG, you're going to have a 20% ABV mead that'll taste like rocket fuel. I made a 15% batch once, and it took 2 years aging to get it to mellow out.

Split the batch, top each off with some water to get the OG down to ~100 gravity points and repitch a full pack of yeast into each. And yeast nutrients, too.

 

[ProblemChild]

so repitching a whole pack of yeast the right way could still pull us out of the red? This is all starting to cause arguments and bad vibes between room mates. Was supposed to be simple and fun and is now looking like it's more or less bs. Splitting it is apparently out of the question for other people involved. Idk what to do but if people continue to get mad about it I'm about a day from smashing the carboy and moving out. It's gotta work. We have foam and bubbles popping in the carboy. I think it is starting to ferment. Need some actual point a point b answers here. Everyone has so many opposing opinions and contradicting answers about the same questions. I'm not trying to be a sick I'm just getting a little more than angry with the process and people. fun isn't supposed to cause frustration and negative feelings.

No use getting angry. Here you go - stay the course, wait and see. It is just fermentation. It may not work out well. No problem. It is just liquid in a bottle. I will be honest - sounds like it is not going to turn out really well. When no one is looking, decant 1/2 gallon and replace with boiled (sanitized) and cooled water. You will still wind up with a high ABV beverage and no one will be the wiser.