bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
Was Nordeast banned or something? I just tried to send him PM and it got rejected.
Was Nordeast banned or something? I just tried to send him PM and it got rejected.
To the point where you think you are completely ridding the C02, will degassing a cold sample of beer that has been can conditioning for awhile yield dead accurate FG results when using a hydrometer? Maybe not. We need more than just two experiments, one on BeerAdvocate (1.010 FG) and the other on Homebrewtalk (1.014 FG) to come to a solid conclusion.
No, I don't think so. I think the mods suspended a couple people's PM ability due to bickering and heated PM's in debate of this beer.
VT native here.Thinking of heading to the cannery sometime in the coming week. Any things I should look out for or ways I can help with the effort? I really appreciate all the footwork that's gone into this. It's a real testament to how awesome the home brew community is. It would be a pleasure to help (and to have more regular access to heady)
I'll be there Friday and will snap some pics if I see anything valuable..
To the point where you think you are completely ridding the C02, will degassing a cold sample of beer that has been can conditioning for awhile yield dead accurate FG results when using a hydrometer? Maybe not. We need more than just two experiments, one on BeerAdvocate (1.010 FG) and the other on Homebrewtalk (1.014 FG) to come to a solid conclusion.
VT native here.Thinking of heading to the cannery sometime in the coming week. Any things I should look out for or ways I can help with the effort? I really appreciate all the footwork that's gone into this. It's a real testament to how awesome the home brew community is. It would be a pleasure to help (and to have more regular access to heady)
I couldn't really see where the hoses and stuff were going to from the keg/pump combo. I'm assuming it must have been the conical. It looks like the keg is a bottom draining vessel. I wonder if there is a false bottom or something in it and they use it as a hop rocket type thing. At one point one of the workers grabbed the hose going into the keg and kinda moved to spray whatever was in it (again assuming hops).
The fermenters line the left and the right. There is a half-wall that you look over. The closest fermenter to me on the left read 54 and the one on the opposite side read 45. On one of the signs that describes the brewing process it said once most of the sugars are digested the yeast starts to settle to the bottom of the tank. This is when we chill the beer to 40 deg F to encourage settling. We condition 2-3 weeks before it is packaged.
So maybe the 45deg one was being chilled ?
edit: Oh and the whole building smelled like amazing hops from brewing!
You guys sure are skeptical, lol. I was hoping by providing the evidence we could move on and use the info to rebuild the recipe a bit. It wasn't an experiment so much as just verifying what I was told about the target FG was true. Just a question, but who would know about the real target FG of the real beer that I would have gotten this info from?
What does 1.014 do to change the beer? Will that cover the sweetness problem we've have noticed without having to add wheat or other malts? I have had conan go under 1.010 before, so I don't know what to do to get it to stop at 1.014, any ideas? No matter how much I mess with the recipe and mash temp I can only get it up to 1.011 with 8%ABV and that's with a 155 mash temp. Do you think they cold crash at around 1.014 to stop fermentation?
If you are going to the brewery.
Two things..
Get me a couple of cans to use for this cloning attempt.
Last, try and find out the hops used.. Ask different people and see what they all say. Some might say half of whats used and the other might give another set of hops. Act stupid about beer, and they'll be more likely to fish along info I've found. Start asking odd questions and they will lock it out.
Really work on #1, but #2 is important as well.
You guys sure are skeptical, lol. I was hoping by providing the evidence we could move on and use the info to rebuild the recipe a bit. It wasn't an experiment so much as just verifying what I was told about the target FG was true. Just a question, but who would know about the real target FG of the real beer that I would have gotten this info from?
What does 1.014 do to change the beer? Will that cover the sweetness problem we've have noticed without having to add wheat or other malts? I have had conan go under 1.010 before, so I don't know what to do to get it to stop at 1.014, any ideas? No matter how much I mess with the recipe and mash temp I can only get it up to 1.011 with 8%ABV and that's with a 155 mash temp. Do you think they cold crash at around 1.014 to stop fermentation?
Wow, 1.004 is nuts. I knew it could go down below 1.010 but not that far.I mashed at 152f, and finished at 1.015, which really surprised me and slightly disappointed me at the same time. But the beer tastes great, has a slight sweetness on the back end, just too much ripe fruit (I was heavy handed on the Amarillo and light on the Columbus, things to change for next time).
I went home for lunch from work today to keg a Falconer's Flight DIPA with Conan, fermented at 60f on the nose. I had a bit of a thermometer mishap, it was on the fritz for a bit, and mashed at 146f. Obviously that is not ideal and I knew I would have a dry beer, tasted it going to the keg and it was great (didnt take any notes), gravity reading 1.004!!!!
We should probably be keeping track of data like this for Conan, obviously my recent case was an extreme but it is just one more test with this yeast.
To me under pitching would make sense. Along the same methodology of underpitching yeast for a hefe...make it work a little harder to get that signature flavor profile. In this case the peachy/fruity flavors from Conan.
I am going to underpitch my 1 gallon test batch today because no matter how I mess with the numbers I can't get it to 1.014 in BS, 1.011 is as high as it goes with mash adjustments. The IPA book said he does the El Jefe at 6-7 million cells/mL at 68, then on day 3 go to 72, then chill to 42 at the end of fermentation. That is 113-132 billion cells in a 5 gallon batch.
To me under pitching would make sense. Along the same methodology of underpitching yeast for a hefe...make it work a little harder to get that signature flavor profile. In this case the peachy/fruity flavors from Conan.
I think this is something to think about here.. Seriously.
If this yeast is as robust as it sounds, then underpitching it would be ideal. For one, we all need to keep in mind that this is a brewery. Not a large one, but not a small one. They do have costs, and while craft beer guys want to make the best product possible, they do things for taste, but with the idea of saving the buck as well.
Underpitching, could be one that works for this strain. It also saves money, and it's less yeast that needs to be pulled from the beer, since he doesn't filter it as well. Stressed yeast, don't reproduce as much, as easily.
The only thing I'm curious, is if it's an under pitch, and they are fermenting really low like 50.... Holy hell this yeast has to be something ridiculous to be able to chew through the sugars, and then still need to be stopped dead in it's tracks with a slow cold crash. However, cold crashing if the yeast needed to be done, that would be odd as it wouldn't be ideal.. off flavors could result from not letting it finish up, unless they are hid well with all the hops.
I still stand by the idea that they add the first dry hop when fermentation needs to be stopped.. The oily resins will get moved around for a little while in the warmer beer, and that could explain the resinous chunks of yeast and hop particulate that will join together in the tank, that eventually find their way in their cans.. seem logical?
C. Strong ferment. You need to get close to your target FG, or if not, the sugars you leave behind must match the beer you're cloning. Hoptimum is a great example. FG is like 1.018. It doesn't taste the slightest bit sweet though; just has a full mouthfeel. So if one were to clone that beer, they would have to mash warmer, and ferment strong. A lower mash temp, and a weaker ferment would yield a sweeter beer. Make sense?
Cold crashing wouldn't work because its "bottle" conditioned with Conan, those sugars would be consumed. Fermentation temp schedule for Belgian yeasts tend to start in the upper 50's to low 60's, ramp up, cool off to condition, then finally cold (32F or below) to crash the yeast out. Probably where some of the low temps are coming from.
HT has a perceived sweetness from the fruitiness of its yeast and the abundance of late hops used, not from a higher FG.
This was the assumption at the beginning of the thread, but a few of us are beginning to think differently. No need to be argumentative. You try yours, we'll try ours, and report results.
I was simply agreeing with Scott's advice and providing reasoning as to why. 1.010 vs. 1.014 does not always mean the latter beer will be sweeter. It has to do more with body. Scott explained this rather well. I don't see the need of calling me out as argumentative for pointing out obvious facts.
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