Head Room in Growlers?

[justinthehull]

Does anyone have experience bottle conditioning in growlers? I have flip top and cap style growlers, both kinds are 64 oz. How much head space should I leave. I really don't want to destroy them, especially because a couple may not be mine.

 

[dbrewski]

I tried to bottle condition in a growler once, with a screw cap, a really nice one with a soft vinyl gasket, but it would not hold pressure. Waited two weeks for flat beer. The flip top one might do a better job, if it is tight, like a Grolsh flip cap. As far as headspace, for most bottles stop within an inch or so of the top. When you remove the bottling wand the level will go down some.

 

[justinthehull]

I tried to bottle condition in a growler once, with a screw cap, a really nice one with a soft vinyl gasket, but it would not hold pressure. Waited two weeks for flat beer. The flip top one might do a better job, if it is tight, like a Grolsh flip cap. As far as headspace, for most bottles stop within an inch or so of the top. When you remove the bottling wand the level will go down some.

I've been afraid they wouldn't hold pressure, but I'm hoping putting something around the cap, maybe heat-shrink, will seal it completely. I filled a growler at a brewery once from their tap and they put heat-shrink on the growler top. It still had great carbonation over a week later.

I know that an inch or so from the topmis good for a regular bottle, but it seems like more beer = more yeast and sugar = more CO2. Has anyone had sucess using growlers?

 

[LKABrewer]

Growlers are not meant for carbing beer. If you put carbonated beer into a growler, it needs to hold pressures of 10-15psi. If you carbonate in the growler, it will have pressure of 25+psi as the beer is carbonating. Do a search, and you will find several people that went down this road only to get either flat beer or exploding growlers.

 

[justinthehull]

Growlers are not meant for carbing beer. If you put carbonated beer into a growler, it needs to hold pressures of 10-15psi. If you carbonate in the growler, it will have pressure of 25+psi as the beer is carbonating. Do a search, and you will find several people that went down this road only to get either flat beer or exploding growlers.

Well, I'm glas I asked. I don't know how any new brewer survives without these formus. Thanks!

 

[jakehale]

I've condition in two growlers before i started kegging. they were the growlers you get from Gordon Biersh. they worked perfectly fine. as far as head space. i just filled them like i did the 12 oz bottles using the bottling wand, when i pulled it out that was the space that was there. neither "blew up" and both had good carb.
I havnt done it since though....

 

[justinthehull]

I've condition in two growlers before i started kegging. they were the growlers you get from Gordon Biersh. they worked perfectly fine. as far as head space. i just filled them like i did the 12 oz bottles using the bottling wand, when i pulled it out that was the space that was there. neither "blew up" and both had good carb.
I havnt done it since though....

Were they flip-top? The flip-top growlers I have are just like the ones they sell on northern brewer. People are always saying rhey use Grolsch bottles, so I figured it was possible. Now I have to decide whether or not to risk it... Has anyone else done this?

 

[H-ost]

Duck tape the screw top caps on I'm sure with enough you will succeed!

 

[JustLooking]

Were they flip-top?

Most flip tops are fine for carbing in. It's the screw tops that are only made for transporting beer.

 

[HawksBrewer]

I have bottle conditioned in growlers successfully in the past. It was a screw-type cap and I put a double layer of plastic wrap over the bottle before screwing on. It was a bourbon ale that I let sit under the counter for 4 months before drinking and it was perfectly carbed. FWIW it can be done, just fill to the line and enjoy.

 

[justinthehull]

I've decided not to risk it based on the replies here and this other thread I found:https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/bottle-conditioning-growler-78808/index3.html

 

[Revvy]

For every guy that says they do it, we have 2-3 guys who posts threads like "Growler goes Boom"

They're NOT MADE TO HOLD CABONATING BEER. Carbonating beer and carbonated beer are not the same.

Even Northern Brewer says so....

This is direct from northern brewer website:
Standard issue 64 oz liquid libation transport vessel for the Civilian Brewing Division. This growler features a blank white space for adding in details on the beer inside and date bottled; using a dry-erase marker allows you to change it at any time. Takes a #6 stopper or a 38 mm screw cap. Pressure capable to 2.4 volumes of co2, not recommended for highly carbonated beers. Avoid bottle carbonating or priming with these growlers, as an unintentionally high level of carbonation could cause the glass to break.
Civilian Brewing Division Growler : Northern Brewer

I would hate to see you have a mess.

There's always a few who say they have no problem, but folks also have sex without condoms- Or still smoke, despite knowing its risks.

To carb a beer whether or not is is done naturally or with co2 you are forcing the gas into the solution. The pressure builds up, then there's a point where either the bottle fails or the co2, seeking the path of least resistance, forces itself into solution. You could call it a peak point, where there is a lot of pressure in the bottle, both already in solution and in the headspace trying to go into the solution, eventually it balances out and the beer is carbed.

Beer bottles, champagne bottles and kegs are rated with a higher psi/volume of co2 than wine bottles and growlers.

Already carbed and kegged beer is at a stable volume of co2 which is below the volume that growlers and winebottles are rated at. The FORCING of the co2 already happened. Why do you think kegs are made of metal and very very strong? To handle the pressure.

Our Buddy Rukus did this right up.

This is because during carbing, the pressure can go above 30 or 40 PSI. I have a thread in the cider forum where I did several tests bottle carbing sweet hard cider. There is allot of data there if your interested.

I have a bottle with a pressure gauge on it. I recorded pressures during the carbing process. This is how the data was generated. I also recorded pressures while pasteurizing the cider.

I recently bottled some lager I made. I also filled my gauge bottle and my lower pressure gauge bottle pegged at 35 PSI as that was the limit of the gauge. It probably ended up in the 40's, but no way to tell for sure.


When we bottle condition beer, we are really simulating force carbing like the keg folks do. We cause a ferment by adding sugar. This creates a high pressure in the bottle. CO2 doesn't like to dissolve in a warm liquid. We then put some bottles in the fridge. The temperature of the liquid drops and the CO2 then begins to dissolve in the liquid.

It seems to take several days at fridge temperatures for the CO2 to fully saturate the liquid for a maximum saturation for that liquid temperature.

While the CO2 is moving into the liquid, the pressure slowly drops. I've monitored this process as well with the pressure gauge.

Pressures go way higher than folks think while bottle conditioning. In the following data, I carbed sweet hard cider and stopped the carbing and then pasteurized the cider when the bottle was at 22 PSI. My Lager went above 35 PSI. The data doesn't show the extremes the pressure rises with beer as I stopped the cider at 22 PSI, but it would have continued if i hadn't stopped it.

The gauge bottle has a nice side effect, it tells you when your bottles are conditioned as the pressure rise stops. I then throw them in the Fridge to cold condition for several days before I open. The gauge also tells you when they are carbed as the pressure drop stops. Pretty basic really.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f32/bottle-carbing-idea-final-data-review-205862/

No, when you bottle condition, the slight fermentation we cause by adding priming sugar just builds pressure up in the bottle. The pressures seem to go up into the 30's and 40's PSI from what I've seen.

The CO2 doesn't really move into the liquid until the temperature drops. Some CO2 may, but not the majority of it. CO2 doesn't dissolve into solution until a lower temperature.

This is really what we do when we force carb in a keg. We raise the pressure up when the beer is cold. The CO2 moves into the solution. The tap pressure is lowered for proper delivery and the beer either sets for cold aging, or it is consumed at that time.

What you would see with the pressure gauge (if you use one bigger than my first bottle had. Should use a 100 PSI Gauge) is that the pressure climbs over time and will level off.

Once the pressure levels off, that means all of the priming sugar has been used up by the yeast. Next, you put them into the fridge. You will see the pressure drop over several days. Eventually, it also will level off. I like to let them sit for a few more days after that, but really if the pressure stops dropping, all of the CO2 that can be dissolved at that temperature has been achieved.
.

I think it goes down to this.....is it worth playing Russian Roulette with your money and the time you spent bringing your brew along from grain to bottling day???

*shrug*

 

[H-ost]

I think what revvy is trying to say is just fill the bottles up halfway... did i get that right?




Nah I'm just poking you....

 

[justinthehull]

Revvy, it's fitting that you posted that because it was your post in the thread I
Iinked that finally convinced me not to use my growlers. Thanks for helping again. That's probably the 5th time this week, lol. You and unionrdr must be really nice guys judging by how much you help others.

 

[jakehale]

Were they flip-top? The flip-top growlers I have are just like the ones they sell on northern brewer. People are always saying rhey use Grolsch bottles, so I figured it was possible. Now I have to decide whether or not to risk it... Has anyone else done this?

Yep, flip tops with the bail and big rubber gasket. Like i said, i never had a problem with them , now , i only did it twice then started kegging. i am sure you might want to swap out the washer after a few batches.

but like i said, ,not a problem one. saved a few extra bottle fillings. matter of fact that is why i used them. first batch, first bottle and didnt have enough bottles so i used the growlers.

good luck.