Has fining taken the place of filtering?

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

JONNYROTTEN

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 21, 2009
Messages
4,053
Reaction score
1,333
Location
Long Island
You never hear much about filtering around here. I was thinking of doing a gravity fed filtered beer with an under counter home water filter. After some research many people across the web mention that a cold crash and fining does the same job or better without the extra work....Trying to get some info on filtering.
Will it clear the beer(yeast bite) immediately after reaching FG and give me a clear beer by day 5 kinda thing?
I've heard lots of times "the pros turnaround quick beer because they filter" among other things
 
I can't think of a good reason for a homebrewer to filter. You can get near brilliant with a combo of time, cold, and finings. They're not as fast as filtering, but you're not concerned with keeping a product brilliantly clear through the distribution chain, and turning it around as quickly.

Plus a centrifuge is in many ways preferable to a filter anyway.
 
Yeegods, the only reason I'd filter a home brew is if it was a clarity specimen to be sent in for competition, something that's bloody unlikely. Personally, I like the proteins and minor hazing in my beer because they contribute to the taste and character of the styles I tend to brew.
Don't get me wrong, the brilliance of a clean lager is something to see and the yeast clouding (and intestinal gas) can be a pain, but as long as I bottle those pesky yeasts are small beans to tolerate.

My approach ... A good hot break, some whirlfloc, and a good chill after everything has bottle-carbed to satisfaction. I can see the point of filtering if you keg and at some point, it's an issue that might interest me.
 
Last edited:
There's really no good way to gravity filter a beer. It's not like you can run it through a loose media filter IE brita filter. Using gravity in an open system will oxidize the hell out of the beer. Not to mention the micron level would have to so large otherwise the beer will not flow through the filter. You're better off using whilfloc or other finings and cold crashing. You can get brilliantly clear beer with cold and time.

The plate filters that I've seen have three filters and a pump to force the beer through (made for wine). I've heard people talk about possible oxidation with them. The only way I can see doing it right is keg to keg transfer with an inline filter between the two kegs.

I think filtering beer strips away some of those complex flavors I'm look for in a good craft beer. There is a reason the BJCP only awards 3 of 50 points to appearance (color, clarity, head). Reading the score sheets clarity is 1 point.
 
My beer is always crystal clear without filtering or fining. It's also just the last 5'ish pints of the keg. :)

But really, dialing in the right mash pH, using whirlfloc tablets and a careful transfer, my beer is pretty clear even without cold crashing before kegging.
 
Agree with starting with a good brew process - good hot break and cold break, fast chill, plenty of gravity time, finings/gelatin, cold-crashing. Have always heard that attempting to mechanically filter at the HB level risks the introduction of oxidation, esp. post-ferm. The two things money can't buy --- time and gravity --- will make beer as clear as it needs to be.
 
I've made close to this same beer before and have been down the never clearing road. I'm in the middle of a test. Two layers of coffee filter vs non. Both sitting for over a half hour to eliminate co2 bubble "color". It obviously shows the filtered being clear and ready to drink. Its smoother and flat out good while the other one has your typical bite of an unclear beer.
This is after a 7 day ferment and 3 days at 32 cold crash...Granted, if I wait a month or more I'm sure it will clear but if it tastes great after running it through a coffee filter why wait...The filtered one is actually amazingly fresh and quaffable...So I just need to filter. For whatever reason gelatin doesn't always work or clears right about when I kick the keg
Looking into a way to filter beer from fermenter bucket without oxidation...it would need to be for a sanke keg...I would have commercial quality beer ( or better) in in 10 days.




i

20171001_203821_resized.jpg
 
Hey guys, throwing my two cents in the ring here. All grain brewer for the last 10 years, and I have microfiltered every batch, through a double filter: first chamber is 5 micron, second is 1 micron. Fun fact: brewers' yeast cells are roughly 3 micron in size.

Why do I filter?
Many years ago I was introducing brewing to a friend; on brew day we were brewing, and naturally sipping on some beers I had made recently (these were unfiltered). Had a blast, made a great beer that day. The next day, he calls me, is having a pretty unpleasant GI reaction, and is itchy all over his body. He is able to get in to a dermatologist the following day, and the issue is quickly identified as a yeast allergy.

Not to be deterred from brewing, he and I tried different attempts at pasteurizing (this is of course back in the bottling days, pre-kegging), to some success, but ultimately found that microfiltering resolved his problem 100%.

Regarding oxidation: If you are gravity feeding your filter (better clear your schedule, this takes forever if you're using filters that are truly as fine as indicated), you will absolutely introduce excess oxygen. The process I have used for years with success is to pressure feed from the carboy, by using one of those silicone orange carboy caps, a large hose clamp to keep it from popping of, and running about 2psi of CO2 in to the carboy. This keeps oxygen contact to an absolute minimum, and moves the beer through the double filter quickly (again: 5 micron, then 1 micron. The 5 micron keeps larger particulates from clogging the fine 1 micron filter). I always brew in 10 gallon batches, and I'm able to run all of it through the filters, split between two kegs pretty quickly, I'd guess 10 - 15 minutes.

Has anyone else out there had an experience with someone having a reaction to brewers' yeast? To everyone else's credit who says 'nay' to filtering, I've never met another home brewer who filters. I do it personally because of my experience years ago with a friends' reaction, and I also enjoy the very clean, refined 'commercial' look of my beers. Cold-crash, filter, enjoy! :)

To each their own. Would love to hear others experiences with filtering and their process. Happy to answer questions.
 
That will work! I have a pair of these for half the price, but need to buy fittings. Many years ago I bought in bulk a 50 pack of 5 micron and 50 pack of 1 micron filters (individually wrapped) at a great price. As you said, they are single use.
 
I worked for a brewery that centrifuged, into a DE candle filter then into barrels.Then out of the barrels into a Horizontal plate DE filter, into a plate and frame to a bright tank where it would go to a HTST pasteurization unit. Needless to say I became a cellar pimp turning beer back into water. Now I work at a small microbrewery. I choose not to filter, we use cold conditioning and gelatin fining. On a small scale I'd say filtering is not really necessary, if you condition your beer properly you will have brilliant bright beer.
 
I tie a synthetic hops bag on the end of the fill hose to keep stray chunks from getting into my keg. If I don't, the keg output gets clogged all the time.
 
I tie a synthetic hops bag on the end of the fill hose to keep stray chunks from getting into my keg. If I don't, the keg output gets clogged all the time.

Sounds like your running your autosiphon / racking cane too close to the bottom of your carboy, and sucking up a bunch of solids. If you're not already, it sounds like you could benefit from cold-crashing, and racking to a clean carboy, cold-crashing again for another 24 hours, before kegging. That seems like a lot of really large solids if you're clogging your keg fittings. Let us know what your process looks like, maybe we can help!
 
I tie a synthetic hops bag on the end of the fill hose to keep stray chunks from getting into my keg. If I don't, the keg output gets clogged all the time.

I think that would technically be straining, not filtering. A nuanced difference, but still a difference.

Aside from the aforementioned allergy situation, there really is no need to filter. With or without fining agents, you can get clear beer without filtering. It just takes some patience, which many people don't have. Lagering at 30-32F for two months will clear pretty much anything.
 
It just takes some patience, which many people don't have. Lagering at 30-32F for two months will clear pretty much anything.

+1 to that. Many don't understand the importance of lagering below serving temperature is critical to a clean-looking beer. Lagering is not just for "lager" style beers! If this is news to anyone, I recommend reading up on how temperature affects the ability of a liquid to hold dissolved solids in suspension. Always lager several degrees below your serving temp.
 
The only reason I'd consider filtering beer was to have immediate clarity for perhaps a competition. However, in my case, fining with gelatin is extremely effective in clearing up a beer in about a week, and at 2 weeks it's crystal clear.

This Pale Ale was brewed with 20% oats and the wort was extremely turbid in the hydrometer. After fermentation I kegged and fined with gelatin, and 1 week later the beer was sparkly clean.

Oats Before & After.jpg
 
Most of my beers look like the one that is filtered in the pictures posted. Only a couple out of 93 batches looked like the unfiltered one. I use Irish Moss and don't cold crash. To me filtering would only make brewing more of a hassle and if I felt I had to filter I would probably stop brewing. Why not try letting the beer go a few days longer? I get good clarity after only 14 days. I have never packaged any sooner. I am not in that much of a rush.
 
Good looking beer @FVilatoro ! I agree that you can get a perfectly clean 'clear' beer with proper cold crashing (which I do) and finings, be it Irish Moss (which I do), gelatin (which I don't do), or other methods. The one thing microfiltering does that no other fining process can, is strip the dormant yeast cells out. That's the one and only reason I microfilter.
 
Sounds like your running your autosiphon / racking cane too close to the bottom of your carboy, and sucking up a bunch of solids. If you're not already, it sounds like you could benefit from cold-crashing, and racking to a clean carboy, cold-crashing again for another 24 hours, before kegging. That seems like a lot of really large solids if you're clogging your keg fittings. Let us know what your process looks like, maybe we can help!

Using the Craft a Brew Catalyst conical. I am using the optional racking valve. Unfortunately some crud still hangs around the 45 degree lower section. I don't mind using the hops bag at all. The korny keg ball locks and dip tube do clog easily. I'm impatient once the 2 weeks fermentation is complete. Goes right into the keg and into the fridge to force carbonate. On my sixth batch and the beer has been excellent.

IMG_20170516_154734.jpg


IMG_20170521_172217.jpg


IMG_20170521_215028.jpg
 
My keg system doesn't leak and I'd rather not unhook and rehook lines to push through with c02 I could just by a new sanke coupler I guess with no regulator.

I had a thought which is always dangerous.
I have the 12v little brown pump (the one in threads here) that I don't use. I was thinking it has a pretty slow flow. I was wondering if I could use that or if it would introduce oxygen?
I would just get a vinyl line from the fermenter to the pump, then to the inline filter then to keg. Same concept as my auto siphon only with a pump and filter?
I'm wondering if the back pressure would burn out/effect the pump? Or again, introduce oxygen
 
@Jonnyrotten -- I think your pump would work just fine. A nice slow and consistent pressure through your filters should be fine, no real opportunity to introduce oxygen. Regarding the CO2 method I use, I have a 5# CO2 in my garage chest freezer 'keezer', where I ferment, cold crash, and use for extra keg storage when not fermenting, and where I do new keg carbonation. In my actual kegerator, I use a smaller 20 oz Paintball CO2 setup, since all it is doing is dispensing, it lasts quite a long time. I have that tank on a quick disconnect, so I can use it for things like pushing beer thru my filter system.

@hootowl, I'm jealous of that conical fermenter! I might suggest, even though patients is very difficult, to move your freshly fermented beer in to a vessel inside your beer fridge there to cold crash for at a very minimum of 5 days, then from there rack it in to your keg. Try it once just as an experiment; I think you'll be amazed how much crud is left behind after the cold crashing!

Either way, beer is beer and we all make what we like, and what makes the most sense for our time constraints as well.
 
@Jonnyrotten -- I think your pump would work just fine. A nice slow and consistent pressure through your filters should be fine, no real opportunity to introduce oxygen. .
You mention that gravity would introduce oxygen. How would a pump not but gravity would? Basically the same thing only one uses a pump? Would the churning of the pump create turbulence/oxygen? I would hold everything below the primary to prime and push out the air before running the pump

You mention along with others the filters are non reusable. Theres a YouTube video of a guy simply washing the water filter out in the sink. Looks like it would work. I "think" I saw someone say they use the filter over 200 times and that's whats it rated for...I would need to find that for conformation..It seems like you should be able to get more than 15 minutes out of a filter??
 
You mention that gravity would introduce oxygen. How would a pump not but gravity would? Basically the same thing only one uses a pump?

The issue with gravity feeding through a filter is it takes a very long time, and as beer leaves the vessel, it is replaced by air. I believe (maybe overkill, admittedly) that you ought to backfill that air space with CO2.

You mention along with others the filters are non reusable. Theres a YouTube video of a guy simply washing the water filter out in the sink

Possibly do-able, however I've had poor results with this. My experience the last time I tried to clean a 1 micron filter and re-use it later, was it then smelled sour, of old beer still embedded in the layers of the filter. I have re-used filters if I was doing multiple batches in the same day or even within 2 days time, just throwing them in a 1 gallon zip-loc bag and in to the refrigerator, but any longer than that I feel like is risky. Curious of others' experience with re-using filters.
 
Honestly, I don't even see a reason to clarify a beer beyond cold crashing with gelatin. The whole notion of filtered beer just doesn't seem to be an issue with craft beer drinkers, homebrewers or even micro breweries. No one cares because it doesn't hurt the beer. So long as you fine it with cold crash, there is nothing wrong with a hazy beer. The only time I'd want a clear beer would be like a nice crisp saison or pilsner. I'll definitely be settling my brett saison that I have going, since I want it ready for the spring anyway, it's going to have lots of time to clarify. 3-4 weeks of fermentation time means I won't be bottling it until the end of the month anyway. So what if a beer is hazy? Doesn't mean it's bad. So long as you get all the fining's out of the beer, I see no reason to filter beyond that. As they say, keep it simple stupid.
 
Honestly, I don't even see a reason to clarify a beer beyond cold crashing with gelatin. The whole notion of filtered beer just doesn't seem to be an issue with craft beer drinkers, homebrewers or even micro breweries. No one cares because it doesn't hurt the beer. So long as you fine it with cold crash, there is nothing wrong with a hazy beer. The only time I'd want a clear beer would be like a nice crisp saison or pilsner. I'll definitely be settling my brett saison that I have going, since I want it ready for the spring anyway, it's going to have lots of time to clarify. 3-4 weeks of fermentation time means I won't be bottling it until the end of the month anyway. So what if a beer is hazy? Doesn't mean it's bad. So long as you get all the fining's out of the beer, I see no reason to filter beyond that. As they say, keep it simple stupid.
You missed the point of the post. Quick clear beers. I know I can wait I just don't want to
 
I have great results simply racking into my keg with no cold crashing, put the keg in the keezer leaving it at serving pressure for 24 hrs. Then add gelatin to the keg and up the pressure to 30 psi for 24 hrs then reduce the pressure back to serving pressure. Wait another two or three days and then pour out a couple of pints and I have nice clear beer.
 
I've been brewing for over 25 years and filtering for more than 20. Not so fond memories of depth filtration with DE under vacuum, but very happy with my current setup of a peristaltic pump to push beer from my conical to corny through a 1 micron spun polypropylene filter in a standard 10" housing. I Whirlfloc and cold crash to clarify, but I use the filter to polish my beer. This minimal addition of effort and cost is rewarded every time I pour myself a beer and every time I have a non-brewing guest drink my beer and hear them exclaim "It looks like it comes from a professional brewery!". I brew my beer to be enjoyed by all five senses (well, maybe not so much for hearing :D ) and I would be remiss if I didn't make the effort to make the beer visually appealing.
 
You mention that gravity would introduce oxygen. How would a pump not but gravity would? Basically the same thing only one uses a pump? Would the churning of the pump create turbulence/oxygen? I would hold everything below the primary to prime and push out the air before running the pump

You mention along with others the filters are non reusable. Theres a YouTube video of a guy simply washing the water filter out in the sink. Looks like it would work. I "think" I saw someone say they use the filter over 200 times and that's whats it rated for...I would need to find that for conformation..It seems like you should be able to get more than 15 minutes out of a filter??

A peristaltic pump does not introduce oxygen, all others will.
I do not (and would not recommend) reusing the filters. The filter matrix will capture live yeast which cannot be washed out. The yeast and the sediment deposited in the matrix will degrade. Any off flavors and sub-micron nasties held in the matrix will be flushed through into the next beer. At a cost of ~$0.03 / beer for a filter (for a 10 gallon batch), throwing them away after using them once is not expensive.
 
I've been brewing for over 25 years and filtering for more than 20. Not so fond memories of depth filtration with DE under vacuum, but very happy with my current setup of a peristaltic pump to push beer from my conical to corny through a 1 micron spun polypropylene filter in a standard 10" housing. .
Looking up that pump
 
Interesting!
I have never filtered (do not have suiutable gear) and I dislike the inclusion of any avoidable chemical suchas "finings".
I always remember the "German Standard" malt, hops & water ONLY.
That said I would like to try using finings but very unsure about the type & the how.
 
Oh, and one more thing to add: Filtering also filters out flavor.
That's not just hyperbole, it's fact. Lab-measured IBUs, for instancewill be less on a filtered beer vs the same beer unfiltered.
 
@cwringer I'm with you. Filtering gives a polished, finished product, beyond all the normal clearing and fining that we do anyway.

Oh, and one more thing to add: Filtering also filters out flavor.
That's not just hyperbole, it's fact. Lab-measured IBUs, for instancewill be less on a filtered beer vs the same beer unfiltered.
Source? I've heard this stated anecdotally, but never seen it empirically proven or quantified.
 
Heading to HD to pick up a water filter and mess around with getting this going. The non reusable filters kinda blows. Looking online it looks like about 4 or 5 bucks a filter. Between the 1 and 5 micron filter it will tack on near $10 per batch...not a ton but not cheap either.

Anyone know where to get cheap filters?
 
Also If I cold crash for a couple days and use a hop bag for brewing and dryhopping do I even need the 5 micron. My main issue is yeast ( I think)
 
I use to use a filter and used joeinbend's method of pushing the beer with CO2 and it does work pretty well but then a fellow HB shared with me the best method is getting that good hot break and cold crash with a good dose of irish moss and then just being patient for the first fermentation to be complete. I always go 3 weeks now on first fermentation and then transfer right to the keg and dry hop in the keg if I'm doing an IPA or if it's a kolsch or stout I just go straight in. I purge any oxygen that might be introduced with CO2 and give it 1 week at 65-68 degrees before going into serve temp 37 degrees. My beers are always crystal clear and tasty as hell! the filter works but it adds a step to your process and a possible chance of contamination.
 
Source? I've heard this stated anecdotally, but never seen it empirically proven or quantified.

You can (I haven't, but know someone who has) take a commercial beer that has been filtered, look at their claimed IBU's (doubtless calculated from software based on their ingredients) and send it to test.
For example, the guy I know who did this sent a Bitburger (filtered German Pils, claiming around 40 IBU) in for testing, and IIRC it came out to less than 30 (around 24, I think).

This information has not been published anywhere to my knowledge, but anecdotally from experiments like the one above, it bears out the logic that filtering equates to removing components from beer, and those filtered components are not flavorless, hence you are removing flavor from beer.
 
The only time I'd want a clear beer would be like a nice crisp saison or pilsner.

Seems like two fine reasons to filter a beer right there if you had the desire to process quickly.

"Give it time" is a perfectly good response if you've got space and time but not everyone has that. Gelatin is amazing at knocking suspended yeast down, which will fix the "bite" that Johnny was talking about, but it is an issue with our friends who keep kosher.

At the end of the day all of this brew hardware is just about making your process easier. To some easy means leave it in the basement for a month, to others it means get it out of my ferm chamber as fast as possible. Everyone has different needs.
 
Heading to HD to pick up a water filter and mess around with getting this going. The non reusable filters kinda blows. Looking online it looks like about 4 or 5 bucks a filter. Between the 1 and 5 micron filter it will tack on near $10 per batch...not a ton but not cheap either.

Anyone know where to get cheap filters?

I would use this:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00TP029VO/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
$1.14 / filter (for 10 gallon batch).
~100 (12 oz) beers / 10 gallon batch.
So, ~ $0.014 per beer.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
You can (I haven't, but know someone who has) take a commercial beer that has been filtered, look at their claimed IBU's (doubtless calculated from software based on their ingredients) and send it to test.
For example, the guy I know who did this sent a Bitburger (filtered German Pils, claiming around 40 IBU) in for testing, and IIRC it came out to less than 30 (around 24, I think).

This information has not been published anywhere to my knowledge, but anecdotally from experiments like the one above, it bears out the logic that filtering equates to removing components from beer, and those filtered components are not flavorless, hence you are removing flavor from beer.

Assuming hop flavor (humulone, cohumulone, adhumulone, posthumulone, prehumulone, lupulone, colupulone and adlupulone) is a class of flavonoids (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flavonoid), it would require ultrafiltration to remove flavonoids from solution.

Ultrafiltration is typically between 0.005 and 0.1 micron. Microfiltration is typically between 0.1 and 10 micron. Although filtration is nominal and not absolute, it is unlikely that a commercially available 1 micron polypropylene filter will capture flavonoids, and it certainly won't capture sufficient flavonoids to account for a 25% drop in detectable IBUs.

Microfiltration will remove almost all yeast. So if your palate expects some residual yeast character, then I wouldn't be surprised if the absence is detectable. I don't brew beers which require suspended yeast as part of their style, so I wouldn't notice the difference.

Microfiltration is unlikely to remove residual sugars (e.g., maltose) due to their relatively low molecular weights. I don't know the types or sizes of the complex carbohydrates which give beer its body, so I cannot comment about whether any of those components are removed.

While I cannot be certain that filtration doesn't remove some flavor, I have never brewed and filtered a beer which has caused me to question whether flavor had been lost due to the process. It's just not detectable to my palate.
 
Assuming hop flavor (humulone, cohumulone, adhumulone, posthumulone, prehumulone, lupulone, colupulone and adlupulone) is a class of flavonoids (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flavonoid), it would require ultrafiltration to remove flavonoids from solution.

Ultrafiltration is typically between 0.005 and 0.1 micron. Microfiltration is typically between 0.1 and 10 micron. Although filtration is nominal and not absolute, it is unlikely that a commercially available 1 micron polypropylene filter will capture flavonoids, and it certainly won't capture sufficient flavonoids to account for a 25% drop in detectable IBUs.

Microfiltration will remove almost all yeast. So if your palate expects some residual yeast character, then I wouldn't be surprised if the absence is detectable. I don't brew beers which require suspended yeast as part of their style, so I wouldn't notice the difference.

Microfiltration is unlikely to remove residual sugars (e.g., maltose) due to their relatively low molecular weights. I don't know the types or sizes of the complex carbohydrates which give beer its body, so I cannot comment about whether any of those components are removed.

While I cannot be certain that filtration doesn't remove some flavor, I have never brewed and filtered a beer which has caused me to question whether flavor had been lost due to the process. It's just not detectable to my palate.

It is true that you or I or maybe even most people may not be able to taste the flavor difference (I've never done a side-by-side, so I can't say).

That said, I'm not sure if it is hops flavinoids being removed or what specific component, just that lab-measured bitterness, as indicated by IBU will be lower.

Also, as you said, maybe yeast character isn't something you're looking for in beer (nor in mine, most of the time), but yeast character will settle out over time anyway as they floc.

But there is more being filtered out than hops flavor (perhaps questionable, as you stated), yeast, and (possibly?) carbohydrates. I don't think anybody would say that filtering only filters out yeast. It takes out proteins (the kind that can cause chill haze, among others) and who-knows what else (I won't claim that I do).

All I can say definitively is that
a) filtering removes more than just yeast
b) the material removed by filtering is not flavorless

I have no science to back it up, but I think it is a reasonable leap of logic to say that if the stuff you remove is not flavorless*, then you have removed some degree of flavor. The degree of flavor that is removed, and the impact or perceptibility may be up for debate (like I said, I've never done a side-by-side, though I welcome anyone with a filtering system to give it a try in the name of science), but the fact that flavor is removed really isn't.

*it's not - taste the residue on the upstream side of your filter next time - it will probably taste primarily of yeast, but there is other stuff in there like the aforementioned proteins)

***edit: In all fairness, it is possible that some of the additional material filtered out could, in fact, be detrimental to beer, especially shelf-stability (various staling compounds like lipids), so it is possible that there are benefits to filtering. However, I think from a shelf stability standpoint, at the homebrew level (it is different on the commercial/industrial level due to available technology and processes) you will do more stability harm than good due to the inevitable oxygen exposure during filtering.

*****Final addendum: But to each his own. If any brewer finds benefit to filtering, more power to him or her. That's the beauty of homebrewing. You can give the same set of ingredients to ten brewers and you will end up with ten different beers brewed by ten entirely different processes. And at the end of the day, most of you, like me, brew to our own palates. I hope my friends like what I brew, but make no mistake, I brew for my own pleasure, and I hope you do too.
 
Back
Top