Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider)

[graycobra]

Its a really bitter off taste at the end. My IBU is only at 9, so I figured it couldn't be that, but I could be wrong. I am still pretty green, but my flavors went up with my extract kits doing full boils and late extract addition. I was wondering if the same would be true for graff. I am currently doing no nutrient additions, I will definitely add that to this next brew.

I would hope that the AJ didn't cause it! I spent $8 a bottle lol

I took Munton's on the recommendation of the LHBS. I will try US-05 next brew.

 

[brewski09]

If it's the apple juice then it should age out. I did a cider recently and it took a little bit for it to come together, sort of like a Mead just takes time. I think there is just so much flavor in beer that you can't really taste it but suspect it's there in beer too.

 

[Texconsinite]

Just bottled my Wheat graff last night.

I did wheat LME, Crystal 20L and some Hersbrucker hops. 2 gallons regular, 1 gallon with a few additional pellets dryhopped in at 7 days. I let it sit for 3 weeks.
2 Gallon- 1.044 to 1.004
1 Gallon- 1.048 to 1.004
Both are clear
I gotta admit, I was surprised at the flavor of this. The hydrometer sample was very mild and drinkable . Doesnt have the rocket-fuel taste or puckery dryness of previous cider batches. Hops were not

Im curious how the flavor will change once its carbed and chilled. I've heard some say ciders dont get "good" until they've had months to age, is that the case here too?
My concern is i let it go for 3 weeks vs the 2 it calls for. Also, I forgot to sparge my specialty grains after steeping them. How will these things affect it?

After using mild hersbrucker and getting little to no hop flavor in this batch, I am wondering if anyone has tried this recipe using some of the new hop varieties coming out with unusual fruit flavors like Hull Melon, Mandarina, Hallertau Blanc, Calypso, or Nelson Sauvin?

On a related note, has anyone been able to ferment with juices other than plain apple and gotten a stronger fruit flavor at the end? the hydro sample, while smooth, was "kinda bland" for SWMBO. Would berry juice in place of some apple work here?

 

[hunter_le five]

I've heard some say ciders dont get "good" until they've had months to age, is that the case here too?

All of my batches of Graff have been "good" fresh from the fermenter, but they certainly got a lot better after aging for a couple months.

My concern is i let it go for 3 weeks vs the 2 it calls for.

Shouldn't be an issue. I had a batch sit in the primary for ~2 months, came out great.

Also, I forgot to sparge my specialty grains after steeping them. How will these things affect it?

I wouldn't worry about it. I think any taste difference as a result will be negligible.

After using mild hersbrucker and getting little to no hop flavor in this batch....

The hops are really used more for balancing than any kind of noticeable flavor contribution.

 

[jekeane]

What is a good FG range for Graff? I followed Brandon's original recipe and used us-05 at 63-65. OG was 1.060, I am currently at 1.009 after 16 days. the cider is very cloudy still like can't see the hydrometer in the sample cloudy.

I used whitehouse fresh pressed juice and added some nutrient to the wort would be my other variables.

 

[hunter_le five]

What is a good FG range for Graff? I followed Brandon's original recipe and used us-05 at 63-65. OG was 1.060, I am currently at 1.009 after 16 days. the cider is very cloudy still like can't see the hydrometer in the sample cloudy.

I used whitehouse fresh pressed juice and added some nutrient to the wort would be my other variables.

My first batch finished out at 1.007. Can't remember the FG of my second batch, but I believe it was somewhere in that ballpark as well.

Fresh pressed cider tends to take much longer to clear-up than store-bought juice, in my experience. I would continue to let it sit until the gravity stops dropping, and then if it doesn't clear up shortly after that point, you might consider speeding things along by cold crashing or using gelatin.

Either way, this recipe doesn't really start to shine until it's had some time to age, so you might just do well to let it sit for a few months.

 

[Ilan34]

Fifteen days in the primary, and it's sitting at 1.003! Down from an OG of 1.057. I used cider and US-05.

It's cloudy, a little tart, very dry, some apple flavor, but a little dull. No signs of infection, but that's a hell of an attenuation.

Should I be worried?

 

[hunter_le five]

No.

 

[brewman551]

I'm a bit buzzed to go reading through 2500 posts... Has anyone used Brandon O's original recipe and primed with a can of FAJC instead of priming sugar? I'm trying to add some apple flavor back in for SWMBO...or will the apple come back with age? Mine is 13 days fermenting and is at 1.010 but not that sweet and not that apple-flavored. Other than that the hydro sample tasted really clean.


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[brewski09]

I think frozen juice concentrate is too unpredictable for priming purposes. I took the route of back sweetening with juice (do this with the FAJC) and then using sugar to prime to 1.5 volumes. This got me the juice characteristics and predictable carbonation levels.


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[brewman551]

Would a can of FAJC and priming sugar be too much, causing bottle bombs?


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[brewski09]

Sorry, I did not mention that you will have to pasteurize to do this. Great catch on that one.


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[ZombieBrew83]

Results from oak aging:

Starting with my variation on this recipe, I aged this in a carboy with 3 oz medium toast American oak cubes for 5 months. The results are delicious. It tastes like an apple cider Chardonnay. Light, woody, toffee, slight tannin flavor, butterscotch, tart, slightly sour, very smooth. I highly recommend oak aging the stuff if you've got the patients.

OG 1.062
FG 1.006
Fermented at 68 for three weeks before racking and adding the oak cubes.

4 gallons Trader Joe's McIntosh Apple Juice
3 lbs XLDME
1 lb Crystal 40L
8oz CaraPils
1 oz Styrian Golding 3.8%AA @30min
Ferment with Wyeast 1968 London ESB

 

[graycobra]

It looks like my flavor issues were contamination. I used a whole bunch of stubby bottles and they didn't seal correctly when capped. Damn.

Going to try a rebrew around apple harvesting season with some fresh stuff.

 

[BigBry]

Materials needed for a 5 Gallon Batch

Clean fermenting yeast I have used Nottinham and Safale-05, both are good
.5 lbs of Crystal 60L If you use cheap store brand juice, I reccomend 120L. Cheap juice tends to turn out a tad tart and this will balance it.
1 oz of torrified wheat ( head retention, I've never used more than 2oz)
4 Gallons of apple juice.
1 gallon of water
2 lbs of DME ( I use 1 lb. amber and 1 lb. light DME)
0.5 oz of you favorite hops ( right around 6% AA, I have used 18.5% AA summit hops before and it took a month after kegging for strong bitterness to blend nicely)
WARNING! IF YOU ARE GOING TO CHANGE THE AMOUNT OF HOPS USED, MAKE IT LESS NOT MORE, it's really just too bitter with any more.

Directions for brewing

Steep the 60L and torrified wheat in .75 gallons of water @ 155 degrees for 30 mins.
Sparge with .25 gallons 170 degree water and throw away grains.
Add DME and bring to a boil.
Add hops when boiling starts and boil for 30 mins.

Cool down the wort (if you choose not to cool the wort and just let the AJ do the cooling then your cider won't be as clear). I don't care about clarity so I just let the AJ do the cooling, but if you stick your pot in the freezer and let this get down to 70 degrees or so your cider will clear fairly easy. Pour the wort and apple juice into your carboy and pitch yeast.

Ferment 2 weeks at 64-68 degrees then keg or bottle.

I keg, and this stuff is VERY drinkable as soon as it is carbonated.
SUPERB taste and drinkability after 2-3 weeks of aging.

People bottling, it will have SUPERB taste and drinkability after the standard 3 week bottling period for carbonating.

I didn't know if you knew you were famous. http://www.northernbrewer.com/connect/episode/brewing-tv-episode-68-how-to-make-graf/

 

[GenIke]

Looks like new Belgium is coming out with a commercial version of Graff. http://thebeerspy.com/2014/01/06/what-is-this-new-grafft-from-new-belgium/

 

[jekeane]

Tapped my keg a few nights ago. I followed OP using Whitehouse Fresh Pressed apple juice (not cider) C120 and .5 oz of Cascade 6.4% AA OG .060 FG .008 ABV 6.8%. Due to a keezer problem this aged at room temp about a month and then sat for a few days on gelatin finings before first pull. It is very good, very drinkable probably dangerously so, great for lawn mowing (just watch your toes if you got a big yard and can get a few down). My wife who loves woodchuck said it's not as cidery as she thought it would be but she really liked it, which is nice because the extra 2% abv over woodchuck may yield promising results for me. Looking to get some more feedback as the 4th of July approaches.

Thanks Brandon for the recipe!

Here is the first pour

 

[Antitoxidote]

I'll be brewing this pretty soon. If my OG hits 1060, should I use 2 packs of dry yeast?

 

[brewski09]

You can but I don't think you need to.


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[mgonbrewlab]

I started a batch of this on Sunday. I decided to mix up the grain bill a bit and used a quarter pound each of caramel 60 and Marris Otter and eighth of red wheat with a little less than a half ounce of Galena for my hops.

I used S-33 for my yeast before reading all of the horror stories. Fortunately, the airlock was bubbling happily and vigorously for the last four days and just slowed down this morning. I am planning on letting this stay at 64 for another few days and then bringing it back upstairs to warm up for a week before bottling.

Now to decide what I want to repitch on this cake...

 

[jekeane]

I had a BJCP judge at homebrew club ask for a second serving of this tonight after an evening of judging. I wound up serving all that I brought and shared the recipe with a handful of people.

 

[Aarong2008]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I was wondering what is the easiest way to sparge the grains. I read that if I put the bag in a collider and pour the 170 degree water over them, that would be fine. Will this work?

 

[jekeane]

I did it just like specialty grains from an extract kit. I put all the grain into a grain bag and then steeped that like a tea bag in my pot. I then emptied that smaller pot into my old extract stove top pot. Put the grains in a colander set on top of the small pot and ran the "sparge" water over top of the grain bag trying to get as much coverage as you can with that little water. Then I let the grain bag/ colander set up drip for awhile to get all I could. When that was finished I dumped the second running into my boil pot. With the amount of grain being so small I didn't even think to use my mash tun... I feel like my graf turned out excellent and would do the same method again.

 

[mgonbrewlab]

With this small amount of grain I don't know if it is beneficial but I have started sparging, and then pouring my runnings back through the bag (requires 2 pots).

I used to have a very fine mesh strainer that was super long, where I could empty my whole grain bag onto it for max surface area coverage. I am really starting to miss that thing.

 

[Aarong2008]

Ok thanks jekeane and mrgonbrewlab. I will probably steep it and then put it in my fine mesh strainer and pour the 170 degree water over it and let it drain. I plan on brewing this Saturday (hopefully).

 

[Gj317]

Good recipe

 

[Ifixjetz1]

Ive been through about 60 pages and haven't gotten a definite answer on what to prime the bottles with on a 5 Gal batch. Ive seen anything from 4 cans of frozen juice, to just simple syrup. What has been working best.

 

[Aarong2008]

I thought I saw something about priming it with as much sugar as you would an ale.

 

[Helly]

I've never bottled but I keg primed at the same level as I have with beer.


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[mwbrewer]

I really cannot wait to start a batch of this. I have been so obsessed with cider lately, and all variations thereof. I may even let starting a batch of this distract me from bottling a couple batches tomorrow...