Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider)

[alchemedes]

I added more yeast because I thought mine might have died, and that's why it wasn't bubbling any more. Also I didn't think adding more yeast would hurt, if anything it would just sit in the bottom.

And no, I never took any gravity readings, I don't usually find any need for them— but now I wish I had.

I had the same experience (especially because of summer heat), but mine still came out great in the end - keep reading. I tasted mine after about 10 days even though there seemed to be little if no action for 5 days, and it tasted like vinegar at first. HOWEVER, I just let it go for the time stated in the original recipe, and you know what? It tastes pretty darn good after all that worrying about it. Now it's kegged. A bit tart, but still a good drink.

 

[dward]

Just bottled last night and it tasted really good. FG was 1.010 and SG was 1.062. I just wanted to see what FG readings people are getting. I know I should of checked a few times to make sure it stabilized, but i really needed my carboy. Hopefully I won't get any bottle bombs.

 

[Carbonellsa]

Temperature is pretty important, and four days at 74° is enough for some batches to finish. 74° isn't usually an ideal environment for fermentation, partially because the process will be so aggressive (and therefore quick).

You can calculate your OG and take a FG reading to see how things are coming along. Hopville.com has a nice recipe builder you can use to find the OG.

Hahahaha

Take a look at this. Maybe that's why my yeast is dead.

 

[hopbrad]

i did a 2.5 gallon of this yesterday and was thinking of slicing up and caramelizing an apple with sugar and adding it into the primary to get a little more apple/caramel flavor. has anyone ever tried this? i also have some lactose sitting around, i could use half sugar, half lactose when i caramelize.

 

[PortlandPatrick]

Take a look at this. Maybe that's why my yeast is dead.

I'm pretty sure that the calculator doesn't want the value of apple juice in pounds, even though that's how it appears. Apple juice is about 50 points per pound per gallon, so if you're adding 4 gallons, you're adding 200 points, not 950.

The idea of 15%abv Graff is equally interesting and nauseating.

 

[hebbs]

kegged batch #1, smells a bit hooch-y! Will have to let this one cool off a bit before serving, and maybe add a little blackcurrant syrup in the glass for a graff+black?

 

[PattyM]

I'm getting ready to brew this today as was wondering if anyone has back sweetened, bottled and then BOTTLE PASTERIZED this? I tend to like things around 1.012-1.020 and it looks like this will likely finish lower than that. I would probably use frozen apple juice concentrate to back sweeten Would bottle pasterizatiion ruin the taste? I need to stabile it in the bottle because I don't have the frig space and I don't want to use Sorbate or sulfite.

 

[onipar]

Quick question:

Do you think the graff would be good with Wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Weizen? Has anyone fermented it with that strain? I have an extra pack of it and was trying to figure out what to do with it.

 

[CA-LT1]

I've done straight cider with the White Labs version of that (WLP300), and it turned out great, better then the other yeasts I've used

 

[onipar]

I've done straight cider with the White Labs version of that (WLP300), and it turned out great, better then the other yeasts I've used

Right on. I may have to try this.

 

[29thfloor]

Quick question:

Do you think the graff would be good with Wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Weizen? Has anyone fermented it with that strain? I have an extra pack of it and was trying to figure out what to do with it.

I did a batch of graff using 1 gallon of hefeweizen as the beer base and fermented with 3068. I thought it turned out pretty well. I would imagine using that yeast with the original recipe would be good to but I haven't tried that.

 

[onipar]

I did a batch of graff using 1 gallon of hefeweizen as the beer base and fermented with 3068. I thought it turned out pretty well. I would imagine using that yeast with the original recipe would be good to but I haven't tried that.

Great, thanks for the input. Yeah, I was thinking the banana and clove would go pretty well with the apple/tart, but I don't know. I guess there's only one way to find out!

 

[TyTanium]

Just finished a batch with 3068. I don't love it. Just tastes like apple-y hefeweizen. The 3068 character bullies out everything else. If I brew this again, I'll won't use that yeast.

 

[onipar]

Just finished a batch with 3068. I don't love it. Just tastes like apple-y hefeweizen. The 3068 character bullies out everything else. If I brew this again, I'll won't use that yeast.

Well crap, now I have to rethink this I guess. Some seem to like it, some not. Bah! :=p Suppose I should just make a hefe with it and do the graff with S-05

 

[TyTanium]

Well crap, now I have to rethink this I guess. Some seem to like it, some not. Bah! :=p Suppose I should just make a hefe with it and do the graff with S-05

It's not bad by any means, it just screams hefe yeast. I love hefes, but I was thinking it'd be muted with only 2 lbs of malt. But it tastes like a hefe blended with cider. Still good, just not what I was hoping for.

 

[onipar]

It's not bad by any means, it just screams hefe yeast. I love hefes, but I was thinking it'd be muted with only 2 lbs of malt. But it tastes like a hefe blended with cider. Still good, just not what I was hoping for.

Hmmm...interesting. Yeah, I'm not sure. Actually, i was thinking of adding a tiny bit of chocolate malt and maybe up the caramel a little bit to make a darker graff. Not a "black graff" but maybe dark brown. I wonder if that would hold up to the 3068 a little better?

Also, I was thinking maybe if I slightly overpitched the yeast, it'd ferment a little cleaner and not be as strong... I dunno...just spitballing. Thanks for the tips!

 

[MacrosNZ]

I've tried making this with both Nottingham and s-05, DME and LME, and the best tasting I've found is with Nottingham (Chicks like it too). S-05 seemed to ferment more and gave a dryer, higher ABV cider (Higher attenuation rate perhaps?). Need more data points in my analysis though haha.

 

[slumslum]

I am going to make a variation of this on Saturday.

I am going to follow the original recipe for the most part, but instead of Apple Juice I am going to use some fresh squeezed Apple Cider.

I have 2 questions:

1. Using Nottingham Yeast. Is 1 packet of Nottingham enough or should I use 2?

2. Should this be filtered or unfiltered? I will be force carbonating it, so the yeast part of it is not important. Has anyone filtered theirs? What was your result?

Thanks.

 

[PattyM]

I too would like a slighly sweeter finished Graff. I made the original recipe using 120L and notty, hoping it would finish a bit sweeter. It tasted ok, but not what I was hoping for. The guys think it tastes amazing! So maybe it's a gender thing. The original is more of a HE-Graf and what I would like is more of a SHE-Graf. I tend to like things around 1.020-1.028. So, how to I accomplish this best without losing the balance? Watch the ferment and bottle it at 1.030, let it carb a bit (losing a few points as it goes) and then bottle pasturize...or just let it finish and back sweeten with ??? honey, frozen apple juice concentrate, (again to approx 1.030, so it can lose a few points to carbintion)...then again, bottle pasturize. I'm new at this and usually do mead, but started doing cider becasue it's drinkable sooner than most mead. I've tried Apfelwein, but it's way too dry! Also can't stand the taste left by the Montrechet yeast (it has an after taste just like the nasty smell it has a few days into the ferment).

 

[S3NTYN3L]

I apologize if this has been asked and answered already but I'm not willing to sift through 170+ pages, lol.

I'm about to pitch a packet of Nottingham into my 5gal batch of this recipe.

Should I rig up a 1" hose and let it blow off into a 1gal handle or am I good to go with just the 3pc airlock and a 6gal carboy?

 

[PattyM]

I used a 6 gallon carboy with Notty and a 3 piece airlock with no issues.

 

[S3NTYN3L]

Thanks for that PattyM, I'll leave it in place then.

 

[Clifton]

I too would like a slighly sweeter finished Graff. I made the original recipe using 120L and notty, hoping it would finish a bit sweeter. It tasted ok, but not what I was hoping for. The guys think it tastes amazing! So maybe it's a gender thing. The original is more of a HE-Graf and what I would like is more of a SHE-Graf. I tend to like things around 1.020-1.028. So, how to I accomplish this best without losing the balance? Watch the ferment and bottle it at 1.030, let it carb a bit (losing a few points as it goes) and then bottle pasturize...or just let it finish and back sweeten with ??? honey, frozen apple juice concentrate, (again to approx 1.030, so it can lose a few points to carbintion)...then again, bottle pasturize. I'm new at this and usually do mead, but started doing cider becasue it's drinkable sooner than most mead. I've tried Apfelwein, but it's way too dry! Also can't stand the taste left by the Montrechet yeast (it has an after taste just like the nasty smell it has a few days into the ferment).

I like this it is a little sweeter and more beer like. The longer it ages the more the apple comes out. I keg mine at 5 psi. If you are afraid of the hops just cut the amount in half.

I haven't made it but you could try this.

 

[PattyM]

Thanks for the link Clifton. Your recipe sounds interesting but it takes me in the opposite direction of where I want to go. I want more of a cider, less of a beer. Just sweeter than the OP of Brandon's Graf. I'm going to bottle today after back sweetening with enough frozen apple juice concentrate to get this up to 1.016-1.028 or so. I'll taste as I go. It finished at 1.010 and is a little too hoppy as well. Hoping the extra sweetness will help balance this. I will keep an eye on this to see how fast it carbs up with the added sugars. I will fill a 12 oz soda bottle as a gage and bottle pasterize if needed to prevent bottle bombs. Thanks also for the link to the 5 day sweet cider. That's one I intend to try as well.

 

[urbanmyth]

Be careful. If you add more sugar before bottling, it will ferment out, unless you are sulfiting and bottling still.

 

[S3NTYN3L]

OK, now I'm a little concerned...

I just took a reading and I'm getting 1.003-1.006 after pitching my Notty Saturday night!?
Is this normal?
I was under the impression this was to go about a month!?

Am I to prime this stuff if I'm planning on bottle carbing?

Any idea's?
Should I get to bottling, carbing and fridge conditioning or what?

 

[29thfloor]

For me this usually finishes within the first week so I don't think 4 days is out of the ordinary. I don't think anyone was saying this would take a month to ferment. It will probably turn out better if you leave it in primary for a few more weeks but it's not absolutely necessary. As long as the gravity is stable you can bottle but it still might take a month for it to mellow out a bit.

 

[S3NTYN3L]

Yeah, I meant a month from start to swallow.
I took another reading and it's right where it was. (1.003 & 1.006).
I'm currently on the fence about backsweetening and bottle conditioning this weekend if I get the same reading tomorrow...

 

[S3NTYN3L]

OK, same readings today, so I'm assuming it's ready to bottle?
I'm thinking of lightly backsweetening with straight cider, bottling and then baby sitting it so I can avoid bombs by pasteurizing when my plastic test bottle gets hard.
Then, I'll just give them about three weeks to condition in the bottle?

Yay or nay?

 

[scottsaxman]

I did not backsweeten my Graff. I think it is a nice sweet/tart balance with caramel notes from the malt. My wife likes it s well. If you haven't had it before, maybe try it per the recipe first, then decide whether or not to do it next time. You could always add juice or sweetener when you pour it in a glass.