Good yeast for the style?

[Ridenour64]

5 gallon batch

7 lbs pale ale
2 lbs Vienna
1 lb Munich
1 lb cara Vienne 20L
.5 lb biscuit
.25 special B

1 oz centennial @ 30 min
1 oz Aramis steeped for 15 min

WLP 500

I am making a Belgian pale ale recipe from “how to brew”. I swapped centennial for a hop I couldn’t find “French triskel” and I chose WLP 500 for a Belgian yeast.

Was WLP 500 a good selection for this brew? When I searched I found 550 which was defined as more spicy, then 500 as more fruity. Anyone have experience with the 2 for this style?

 

[Lefou]

WLP500, WLP530, WLP550, WLP575 ... looks OK to me. Almost any Belgian yeast will do for a pale ale of this sort.
T-58 dry, too.
https://learn.kegerator.com/belgian-pale-ale/

 

[IslandLizard]

That yeast should work fine. The biggest difference will be in using Centennial, which screams American Pale Ale. I would probably pick a more Belgian beer type of hop there, such as Styrian Goldings (or Saaz) so your Aramis can shine. Perhaps double up on the Aramis? Or instead use the extra 1 oz as a dry hop for 3-5 days.

Definitely make a good size starter with the yeast. 2 liters should be fine, and it allows you to save some out for next time. For more pronounced yeast character underpitch a little.

 

[Ridenour64]

Ok. I’ll probably make a quick trip to my lhbs to pick up Styrian Goldings. I just went with centennial because a website mentioned that as a sub, but I do want it to come out authentic to the style.

As far as a starter. My flask is only is a 2L. I may ferment over. A 5L is in my near future

As far as dry hoping, is there any downside to dry hopping right at the start of fermentation? Other than the lack of being able to harvest? (Hop free anyways) I do use a conical, but have not dry hopped or harvested yet.

 

[IslandLizard]

I just read up on Triskel:
http://www.hopslist.com/hops/aroma-hops/triskel/

I does mention Centennial as a substitute. If you already have Centennial on hand, maybe use a somewhat smaller amount (say 70%) to get the same IBUs. After 30' in the boil not a real lot of its citrusy / grapefruity flavor will be left, anyway. I just like Styrian Goldings in Belgians.

A 2 liter flask is plenty. Do you have a stir plate? Or intermittent swirling?
If swirling, 1.5 liters is really the max for a 2 liter flask, or better 1.2 liters to reduce the chance of foam-overs.
Use one drop of Fermcap-S in you starter wort to reduce or prevent foaming when boiling, it also helps against overnight foam-overs too.

Use a yeast calculator to see what it yields:
http://www.brewunited.com/yeast_calculator.php

Although there are a few exceptions such as in NEIPAs, dry hopping should be done after fermentation is over. It may coincide with the beer's conditioning phase, if you're in a hurry, but is best done after the yeast has settled out.
We try to time dry hopping with packaging, typically dry hop 5-7 days before packaging. You can drop them in through the blow off port in the lid.
With your conical you can then harvest the yeast before adding the dry hops.

 

[RPh_Guy]

I don't recommend large starters, especially for flavorful yeast.
A 500mL vitality starter (spun 48 hours 4 hours only) is perfect in my opinion.

but is best done after the yeast has settled out.

Why?

 

[IslandLizard]

I don't recommend large starters, especially for flavorful yeast.
A 500mL vitality starter (spun 48 hours only) is perfect in my opinion.

I agree, make a healthy traditional or vitality starter, estimate cell count, and underpitch slightly for those yeasts. Save the rest for another starter and brew.
I've been getting White Labs yeast from my LHBS that's at least 3 months old, which is really not a big deterrent with the PurePitch packs, they allegedly keep 90% vitality over the first 3 months, but who knows what her story is?

[dry hopping] is best done after the yeast has settled out.

Why?

To reduce hop oil clinging to the yeast cells and dropping out with it, ending up in the trub.

 

[Soulshine2]

5 gallon batch

7 lbs pale ale
2 lbs Vienna
1 lb Munich
1 lb cara Vienne 20L
.5 lb biscuit
.25 special B

1 oz centennial @ 30 min
1 oz Aramis steeped for 15 min

WLP 500

I am making a Belgian pale ale recipe from “how to brew”. I swapped centennial for a hop I couldn’t find “French triskel” and I chose WLP 500 for a Belgian yeast.

Was WLP 500 a good selection for this brew? When I searched I found 550 which was defined as more spicy, then 500 as more fruity. Anyone have experience with the 2 for this style?

K97 would probably work very well for you.

 

[IslandLizard]

K97 would probably work very well for you.

It's not a Belgian yeast, though...

 

[RPh_Guy]

A 500mL vitality starter (spun 48 hours 4 hours only) is perfect in my opinion.

Corrected typo.

 

[Ridenour64]

Hey guys. My WLP500 stopped a little early on this. 1.020. It was supposed to be 1.011. I didn’t take great notes this brew day because it was a little hectic. I think I mashed too high because my analog thermometer I found was not too accurate. OG was around 1.048 when it should have been around 1.052. Soo I’m not sure if I have a yeast issue, or if maybe I fermented too high and have unfermentable sugars. It tastes good, and I guess that’s the most important thing, but is really weak compared to what I was hoping for. This upcoming Sunday will be 3 weeks that it would be in the fermenter. Would you guys pitch a different yeast at this point or cut your losses and need several beers to get a buzz lol.

I did make a starter, it never formed a Krausen but it did have bubbles crawling up the side to confirm activity.

My gravity checking is with a hydrometer.

The yeast came from morebeer.com. Was well within it’s dates and shipped with an ice pack. It was cooler weather when it shipped as well.

I crush my own grains and I crush very fine.

 

[IslandLizard]

From 1.048 to 1.020 didn't attenuate very well, it's [EDIT] a hair under 42% of OG, making for 58% apparent attenuation.

Could well be from mashing at higher temps, or a combination of factors.

Did you shake/swirl the starter manually/intermittently, or was it on a stir plate? How long? Did it change color? Did you pitch the whole starter? Did you aerate the main batch?

 

[RPh_Guy]

Could well be from mashing at higher temps

+1
What was the mash temp? Any idea?

 

[snarf7]

@Ridenour64 Not sure if relevant or not but I recently did a Saison with wpl590 and it was really, really good...good enough that I'd enter it...it took a LONG time to complete though...it just chugged and chugged away slowly for over 2 weeks:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/wlp590-saison.663971/#post-8571170

possibly a similar 'slow burn' type scenario?

 

[Ridenour64]

I swirled the yeast starter several times per day. No stir plate. When I pitched the yeast it started fermenting really fast and for the first few days it fermented very hard. (At least it appeared so based on the bubbles coming from the blow off tube). I did not aerate too well for the main batch, so maybe that was an issue? All I did really was rock my unitank back and forth. I actually transfer the hot wort into my unitank and trickle water through the cooling coils to do an initial crash, then finish off with a cooler and ice. My point being that I didn’t even get the aerating benefit of transferring. This is my first time ever using a liquid yeast. I’ve never had issues with dry yeast at all. I have heard aerating is more important with liquid yeast.

 

[snarf7]

I have heard aerating is more important with liquid yeast.

I simply dump from one vessel to another from a height of about 2 ft, works perfeclty

 

[Ridenour64]

My spike analog thermometer read 160 strike but after dumping and stirring grain, it still said 160. So I stirred like crazy until it was mid 150’s then let it rest, looked back like 10 min later and it was like mid 140’s. Sooo that thermometer is worthless and I’ve since ordered a thermoworks DOT.

 

[Ridenour64]

This Sunday will be 3 weeks. I tested about a week ago and it was 1.020. I tested again yesterday and it was 1.020. When I first tested I was hopeful it would finish. But I think it’s done.

 

[dpeters]

From 1.048 to 1.020 didn't attenuate very well, it's [EDIT] a hair under 42% of OG, making for 58% apparent attenuation.

Could well be from mashing at higher temps, or a combination of factors.

Did you shake/swirl the starter manually/intermittently, or was it on a stir plate? How long? Did it change color? Did you pitch the whole starter? Did you aerate the main batch?

Bump your ferment temp up 5 to 10 degrees you could also put your dry hops in now which will also get the yeast moving again (there is some info on why dry hopping restarts it but don't recall where).

 

[snarf7]

This Sunday will be 3 weeks. I tested about a week ago and it was 1.020. I tested again yesterday and it was 1.020. When I first tested I was hopeful it would finish. But I think it’s done.

Yep, I should say so...was your temp constant the entire 3 weeks or was it up and down?

 

[Ridenour64]

I pitched at 68* and raised it 2* a day until it was at like 74 (maybe even 76 - I have to take better notes.) and then after a week or so I set it back to 73 because my brew belt was struggling to keep it that high.

 

[Ridenour64]

And yes, I pitched the entire starter. 1 packet into 1 liter starter. 1.040

 

[snarf7]

I pitched at 68* and raised it 2* a day until it was at like 74 (maybe even 76 - I have to take better notes.) and then after a week or so I set it back to 73 because my brew belt was struggling to keep it that high.

That seems fine to me...some folks like to run these yeasts hotter but i think slow and steady wins the race

 

[Ridenour64]

Poor aeration or poor mash temp seems like the only 2 places I could have gone wrong here. Idk.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Lack of aeration is not an issue.

 

[Ridenour64]

I thought about a possibility today. I am fermenting in a unitank and I closed the ball valve after the blow off stopped bubbling for the most part. It built up to like 6-8 psi. I filled my test tube and have been shaking to degas. I’ll test tomorrow to see if I get a different result.

 

[Vale71]

This Sunday will be 3 weeks. I tested about a week ago and it was 1.020. I tested again yesterday and it was 1.020. When I first tested I was hopeful it would finish. But I think it’s done.

You can't be done at 52% apparent attenuation, at least not with this kind of yeast. The yeast just stopped working prematurely. Underpitching combined with no aeration are your most likely culprits.

 

[Soulshine2]

It's not a Belgian yeast, though...

I must have missed that part.

 

[IslandLizard]

I thought about a possibility today. I am fermenting in a unitank and I closed the ball valve after the blow off stopped bubbling for the most part. It built up to like 6-8 psi. I filled my test tube and have been shaking to degas. I’ll test tomorrow to see if I get a different result.

There you go...

 

[Ridenour64]

Made no difference. Still 1.020. I figured the aeration issue might cause an off flavor, but didn’t anticipate that it would prematurely stop a fermentation. Same thing with under pitching. But I made a 1L starter with a new pack and it sat for 3 days. Maybe a viability issue with the yeast from the start. Or back the the mash temp.

But back to the original question. Would you guys just keg and drink or pitch something new and see what happens.