Getting plate chiller, some questions.

[Yesfan]

I'm buying a plate chiller from a home brewing friend and thought I would ask plate chiller owners some advice on getting the best use out of one. The chiller is a Duda Diesel B3-12A (20 plate) and it will be mounted on my Top Tier if that helps. Some questions....

1) Like with pumps, is there an ideal way to mount these to a brew stand? Should it be above, below, the pump? Do you use a pump or is gravity best?

2) Would this chiller work with Blichmann's Therminator mounting bracket? I've been eyeing this as it's a "quick release" bracket.

3) Any "don't do this" things I might need to know (cleaning, sanitizing, etc.)

4) What are the best cleaning procedures for plate chillers?

Thanks in advance!

 

[ancientmariner52]

I don't know anything about plate chillers, but I know about pumps. Centrifugal pumps, the type we commonly use, should be the lowest point on any system. They are great for pushing liquid uphill, useless for pulling from below. Also, they are not self priming, so being at the low point helps avoid being air bound. Hope this helps.

 

[Dcpcooks]

1) I don’t really mount mine except for storage. I put it on the floor between the kettle and the fermentor when in use.

2) I do have that mount but couldn’t tell you if your chiller will fit it. You could drill a new hole or two if needed.

3) don’t slack off with cleaning after a brew day. I like to run water on full blast and dial in the wort flow to hit temps. Ground water temp has a lot to do with how fast you can chill.

4)Back flush ASAP with hot water. Then forward flush. I run hot PBW through the unit followed by a hot rinse. You can bake it a few times a year to keep it clean and free of hop debris. I run a sump pump in a bucket and circulate during all three stages of cleaning. PBW, rinse, sanitizer.

 

[stz]

If it is a brazed copper construction don't hit it with peracetic acid or anything which eats copper!

 

[Yesfan]

Thanks guys for the suggestions!

 

[augiedoggy]

If you use #300 mesh stainless hop spider /s you wont have to worry about debris getting in the chiller to begin with... at least that been my experience over the last 4 years witrh my duda chiller... I simply rinse with water directly after each use and every few brews I run a pbw mix through my whole system... I never have anything come out of my platechiller.

 

[Yesfan]

If you use #300 mesh stainless hop spider /s you wont have to worry about debris getting in the chiller to begin with... at least that been my experience over the last 4 years witrh my duda chiller... I simply rinse with water directly after each use and every few brews I run a pbw mix through my whole system... I never have anything come out of my platechiller.

I don't know the mesh # of the hop spider, but it is the ones that Stainless Brewing sells.

I picked it up last night. Pretty beefy looking for a small plate chiller.

 

[day_trippr]

Stainless Brewing uses 400 micron SS mesh. I have their 6" spider...

Cheers!

 

[Gadjobrinus]

If you use #300 mesh stainless hop spider /s you wont have to worry about debris getting in the chiller to begin with... at least that been my experience over the last 4 years witrh my duda chiller... I simply rinse with water directly after each use and every few brews I run a pbw mix through my whole system... I never have anything come out of my platechiller.

Augie, I thought of the PC, and spider, just as you have. One reservation I had was with the spider limiting utilization. That's totally a hunch and nothing more. Did you notice anything in this way once you went to spider (maybe you've always done this)? Do you make a change in utilization assumptions at all? (Might be zero effect, for all I know).

 

[mongoose33]

Would someone explain how you're using the hop spider in this application? I'm going to be getting a pump soon, and if using a hop spider is a way to eliminate at least some of the trub....

 

[day_trippr]

Spiders retain the bulk of hops, particularly pellets, but really have no beneficial effect wrt reducing break material to the fermentor - or intervening chiller. The break is outside the spider, after all. Indeed, heavy hot break can clog up the spider, so on some recipes I'll get the boil going and skim the break before dropping in the spider.

If you run a PC some kind of hop barrier is paramount to maintaining sanity (no, not a typo - I didn't mean sanitation )
I use the aforementioned Stainless Brewing 6"x18" 400 micron spider in a 20g BK in front of a pumped DudaDiesel 12" x 30 plate PC. While there is some variability between pellets (some are milled much finer than others) I'd guesstimate the spider retains 80% of the original hop mass on average, and what gets through is essentially the good stuff plus hop dust.

But I still hook the PC to a 60psi back-flush immediately after putting the fermentors in the chamber and then recirculate hot PBW through it with the rest of the rig. I think you need to have a healthy level of obsession with these chillers

 

[augiedoggy]

Spiders retain the bulk of hops, particularly pellets, but really have no beneficial effect wrt reducing break material to the fermentor - or intervening chiller. The break is outside the spider, after all. Indeed, heavy hot break can clog up the spider, so on some recipes I'll get the boil going and skim the break before dropping in the spider.

If you run a PC some kind of hop barrier is paramount to maintaining sanity (no, not a typo - I didn't mean sanitation )
I use the aforementioned Stainless Brewing 6"x18" 400 micron spider in a 20g BK in front of a pumped DudaDiesel 12" x 30 plate PC. While there is some variability between pellets (some are milled much finer than others) I'd guesstimate the spider retains 80% of the original hop mass on average, and what gets through is essentially the good stuff plus hop dust.

But I still hook the PC to a 60psi back-flush immediately after putting the fermentors in the chamber and then recirculate hot PBW through it with the rest of the rig. I think you need to have a healthy level of obsession with these chillers

Yes thats true. I have an extremely small amount of hot break to deal with. I recirculate for the mash so I think the fact that the wort is completely clear going into the boil kettle accounts for a lot of this, then I have an 8" piece of stainless braid attached to the end of my dip tub in my boil kettle.... when I chill I do it in one pass from the BK to conical and When I use a jaybird canning jar yeast catcher the trub that does find its way into my conical is only enough to fill between the 25% and 50% of the one quart jar in many cases.. (I do still get a fair amount of hop/trub resembling pea soup left in the BK)
For some reason I do not have an issue with any of this staying in the chiller even though I use a small 24v pump to pump from the bk through the chiller up about 3ft into the tiop of my conicals.

When I do flush out my rims manifold and chiller directly after brewing and when I do the pbw recirc I check for any solid particulates and I usually find none sometimes I find maybe a 1/4 teaspoon worth which I think usually comes from the stainless braid in the bk if anything.

the #400 hop spiders were not recommended for hop pellets when I bought mine because the holes are too big to stop the dissolved hops from escaping. they were made for leaf hops according to arborfab.

I do use 2 6x14 hop spiders for beers with more than a couple oz of hops and I have a stirrer that I will sometimes use which basically whirlpools the hops in the spider and keeps them suspended and from blocking the mesh walls.

I do not need to edit any recipes ive brewed and they come out correctly balanced or hoppy depending on the style so no dont think its an issue as far as utilization.

 

[day_trippr]

Arbor Fab should duke it out with Stainless Brewing wrt optimal mesh size for pellets.
The latter explains on their web site why they went with 400 micron...

Cheers!

 

[SleepyCreekBrews]

I've never used a hop spider, let your hops fly! I simply whirlpool when I use my plate chiller... my dip tube is angled over to the edge of the kettle so that helps keep hot break and hops out of the dip tube. When you get down toward the last bit of wort, you can watch the wort flow inside the kettle and see the material starting to get sucked up, at that point you have to make a judgement call when to turn off the pump.
...and as always, immediately flush with tap water fwd and rev several times right after you're done using it .

 

[augiedoggy]

Arbor Fab should duke it out with Stainless Brewing wrt optimal mesh size for pellets.
The latter explains on their web site why they went with 400 micron...

Cheers!

I guess but when I bought mine arbor was the only ones on the market so I figure they would know since they appear to have invented them....
Now there are a lot of "clones" or knock offs being made and sold by many
The second one I purchased I bought directly from china for about $30 compared to the $75 I paid for the first one and they are both 300 mesh. They both work fine for me and I dont have to worry about stuff in my chiller so? Maybe some of the folks who claim the hop spiders dont work and they still get clogged chillers are using the 400 spiders? Either that of they chill and recirc back into the kettle causing the hotbreak to form there instead of as it passes through the chiller where its such a small amount its not an issue?

 

[Yesfan]

I went ahead and fashioned a bracket for the chiller to mount to my top tier using some free scrap aluminum from work. Figured I would have had to do the same if I bought the Blichmann quick release mount, so money saved.

Will it matter where on my stand it will be mounted? As mentioned before, my pump is the lowest point on my stand, so I was going to put the chiller between the mash tun and boil kettle. The chiller's wort output is about the same as the valve on my boil kettle, so that would be just high enough to clear the top of my carboys. Pic posted.

 

[JasonWB]

Shouldn’t really matter where you mount the chiller in the setup height wise. However, it shouldn’t be any lower than your pump as that should be the lowest point on the system. I have my Therminator mounted on a platform right next to my pump which currently sits on the ground. I’ve got legs coming for my burner so the pump and chiller will move up onto a shelf on the table once they arrive, but will still be the lowest point in the plumbing. More important is where you put it in your plumbing. Your flow should go from the boil kettle to the pump then to the chiller. I use a hop spider and whirlpool with a side pickup dip tube, back flush my chiller several times and clean with pbw. Only recently got the chiller so no long term experience but so far it is awesome. With low 50s water hose temps I’m able to take my wert down to mid 50s straight after whirlpool.

 

[JasonWB]

Shouldn’t really matter where you mount the chiller in the setup height wise. However, it shouldn’t be any lower than your pump as that should be the lowest point on the system. I have my Therminator mounted on a platform right next to my pump which currently sits on the ground. I’ve got legs coming for my burner so the pump and chiller will move up onto a shelf on the table once they arrive, but will still be the lowest point in the plumbing. More important is where you put it in your plumbing. Your flow should go from the boil kettle to the pump then to the chiller. I use a hop spider and whirlpool with a side pickup dip tube, back flush my chiller several times and clean with pbw. Only recently got the chiller so no long term experience but so far it is awesome. With low 50s water hose temps I’m able to take my wert down to mid 50s straight after whirlpool.

Pic of my setup and pump/chiller location.

 

[govner1]

I received a Therminator & Riptide pump for Christmas. My current setup uses a March pump & CFC for chilling and whirlpooling.
Has anyone used something like a Hop Rocket (w/rice hulls) as a filter to keep trub out of their pump and plate chiller?

 

[augiedoggy]

I received a Therminator & Riptide pump for Christmas. My current setup uses a March pump & CFC for chilling and whirlpooling.
Has anyone used something like a Hop Rocket (w/rice hulls) as a filter to keep trub out of their pump and plate chiller?

I bought this a while back and am going to test it today without using the hop spiders I normally do
Long 1.5 inch Tri Clamp Inline Strainer with 102mm Body 304 Stainless Steel
http://s.aliexpress.com/rUfuMNjQ?fromSns=Copy to Clipboard
(from AliExpress Android)
A larger diameter filter with more surface area will obviously be less likely to plug up.

 

[govner1]

Looks like a knock off of the Brew Hardware trub filter. I had thought of that but it introduces the need for triclamp connections on both ends.
I’m trying to use the KISS method since I’m essentially one handed but I look forward to your feedback. I’ll give my setup a try, BK to Hop Rocket to plate chiller back to BK via a whirlpool port and report back, too.

 

[augiedoggy]

Looks like a knock off of the Brew Hardware trub filter. I had thought of that but it introduces the need for triclamp connections on both ends.
I’m trying to use the KISS method since I’m essentially one handed but I look forward to your feedback. I’ll give my setup a try, BK to Hop Rocket to plate chiller back to BK via a whirlpool port and report back, too.

Why do you think its a knock of? There are a lot of resellers selling these including glacier brewing and the like. I dont think brew hardware invented them at all. (may even be the same manufacturer) Brew hardware are just the ones that apparently made them popular for home brewing use.

I just got done brewing a pale ale with it and I have to say I MUCH prefer my hop spiders to this... It was a royal pain in the ass and there was more wasted beer... even after blowing all the remaining beer through the filter.

Still managed to squeeze out 92.7% efficiency on this one and 91.6 efficiency on a cream ale I did yesterday with the hop spider.

 

[Yesfan]

Shouldn’t really matter where you mount the chiller in the setup height wise. However, it shouldn’t be any lower than your pump as that should be the lowest point on the system. I have my Therminator mounted on a platform right next to my pump which currently sits on the ground. I’ve got legs coming for my burner so the pump and chiller will move up onto a shelf on the table once they arrive, but will still be the lowest point in the plumbing. More important is where you put it in your plumbing. Your flow should go from the boil kettle to the pump then to the chiller. I use a hop spider and whirlpool with a side pickup dip tube, back flush my chiller several times and clean with pbw. Only recently got the chiller so no long term experience but so far it is awesome. With low 50s water hose temps I’m able to take my wert down to mid 50s straight after whirlpool.

Thanks. Was hoping to do a trial run today to see how it goes and also check for any leaks since I did some cleaning in the brewery today. Looking to also add a whirlpool port to my kettle, but until then I'll just wing it with some extra tubing I have laying around.

 

[govner1]

Why do you think its a knock of? There are a lot of resellers selling these including glacier brewing and the like. I dont think brew hardware invented them at all. (may even be the same manufacturer) Brew hardware are just the ones that apparently made them popular for home brewing use.

I just got done brewing a pale ale with it and I have to say I MUCH prefer my hop spiders to this... It was a royal pain in the ass and there was more wasted beer... even after blowing all the remaining beer through the filter.

Still managed to squeeze out 92.7% efficiency on this one and 91.6 efficiency on a cream ale I did yesterday with the hop spider.

No offense intended but I doubt the Chinese make these for their burgeoning home brew market!
I haven’t seen sellers other than Brew Hardware.
Thanks for the report on your use VS hop spiders. I have a couple from Arbor Fabricating that I routinely use. I also whirlpool/chill and wanted to minimize True in a Therminator.
I think I’ll use my Hop Rocket w/ricehulls as a filter before the chiller.

 

[augiedoggy]

No offense intended but I doubt the Chinese make these for their burgeoning home brew market!
I haven’t seen sellers other than Brew Hardware.
Thanks for the report on your use VS hop spiders. I have a couple from Arbor Fabricating that I routinely use. I also whirlpool/chill and wanted to minimize True in a Therminator.
I think I’ll use my Hop Rocket w/ricehulls as a filter before the chiller.

Exactly, these werent invented for brewing. These are used for other things too and the chinese like anyone sell them for whatever use sells, just like the 80%or so of all the other home brewing products sold here that are made there. I would guess they are all are just chinese made inline filters as well and are of the same quality just like these,
https://www.glaciertanks.com/tri-clamp-fittings-filters.html I looked quite a bit before buying mine and found no reason to spend an extra 35% or so...
Similiar to the situation with my 2 hop spiders. I paid $80 for the arbor one and $30 for the other and they work equally as well.. Yes the $30 one is a knock off of the arbor made one but they brought arbors prices down to be more competitive since they are no longer able to sell for whatever they want and remain competitive either...