Garage home brewery

[Nwcw2001]

It would cost just about as much to dig trench for gas if you are digging for electrical. This also gives you a chance to plumb H2O and waste lines. All my life being around construction, it never made sense to me that projects dig trenches more than ones. DIg all at once and bury it all at once. If you aren't sure about he NG yet, leave it unhooked. And fianlly, drop more conduit than you think you will need, because 6 months down the road you may think, "Damn I could use a cable/sattelite line in here," or "damn I wish I would of ran 220V in here" or "damn I bet it would be dope if we had an intercomm system out here so I could get SWMBO to bring me some chips"


Just my $.02

John

 

[BrewBeemer]

It would cost just about as much to dig trench for gas if you are digging for electrical. This also gives you a chance to plumb H2O and waste lines. All my life being around construction, it never made sense to me that projects dig trenches more than ones. DIg all at once and bury it all at once. If you aren't sure about he NG yet, leave it unhooked. And fianlly, drop more conduit than you think you will need, because 6 months down the road you may think, "Damn I could use a cable/sattelite line in here," or "damn I wish I would of ran 220V in here" or "damn I bet it would be dope if we had an intercomm system out here so I could get SWMBO to bring me some chips"


Just my $.02

John

You don't have to tell me being a 27 year electrician, seen more than my share of stupid jobs over the years.

 

[blackheart]

I heard from someone that water line needs to go 4 feet down. NG at least 18". I also heard that I cant run NG and electrical in the same ditch. Is this true? I may be running an entire sub box out to the garage. I havent decided. Digging the ditch and running everything is kinda the last step to some degree.

I just tore down the cross beam the garage doors were tied to. And took down the garage doors and hardware so that the new ones can be installed. I think I will need to replace the cross beam with another one. Now I have to figure out where I can get a 20 foot 8" beam and how I can get it home! I was thinking of attaching two 12' together.

Going to be hanging most of the dry wall today I hope. Some friends are stopping over in a few hours to help. Making a run to lowes now to grab some more things.

 

[illin8]

You could always fabricate your own, either by doubling or trippling up on 2x6s or 2x8s, or even better, take a sandwhich an 7 1/2" (to match your 2x8s) strip of 5/8 or 3/4 plywood in between your 2x8's and nail them together. Will be strong as hell.

 

[blackheart]

Did a bit more dry wall in the garage. Most of the time was spent framing the windows. I am happy to report that we have both windows in an sealed up nicely. I also ran some new electrical lines for the lighting. I need an electrician to show up and actually make the connections, but the lighting wiring is ready to go.

Here is the 8" beam thats missing now. Building a replacement + an additional one. Each are 4' on center apart.

Here is a sketchup mock up of what I want to do to the ceiling. Basically create a ceiling thats at two different heights. This will allow the garage doors to go below the ceiling.

This will be done with furring stripts to hold the insulation up and a drop ceiling attached to the 8" beams.


So what do you guys think?

 

[blackheart]

We replaced the beam in the ceiling with a new one.

We used 3" screws instead of nails like the rest of the garage is built with. Is this a bad idea? should we replace the screws with nails?

Anyway, a second beam is going up next the the new one that will allow us to finish the ceiling etc. The garage doors are being installed right now and should be done shortly!

 

[illin8]

I would put the 'second' beam up against the first one and use lag bolts to lag (screw) them into each other. Without seeing what the beam actually functions as, its hard to say just how to engineer it. But thats what I would do anyway, cheap and strong. If the beam is bearing any significant load you could also put a steel plate on either side of the beam, drill out and bolt through with some large bolts...but thats pretty heavy duty and not sure if you require it.

 

[Wingnutj]

I agree with illin8
Screws tend to be a little more brittle (MHO) nails would function better in a more stress environment. Far as load on such. Cool project! keep us updated
Also I see a fan going outside by the door. if you plan to use the brew pots where you have them it might be better to move that fan closer and be able to open the door for a cross breeze if needed. just a thought!

Cheers!

 

[blackheart]

The garage doors were installed successfully! The guy did a great job on them too. Very clean. Here are some pictures of the new doors.

Here is the reinforced supports for the beam they added

and here is a updated 3d picture of the drop ceiling with where the lights will go!

Now I think its about time to start digging a ditch in my back yard. I found out that I can run NG + electrical in the same ditch. I cant do water because its a bit to difficult right now and hard to justify going from 18" -> 48" for one thing. I need to run the electrical line before I can finish up the wiring and finish up the drywall etc. Going to see what I can do with the ceiling tonight.

 

[Bobby_M]

I think it's really difficult to justify this as a brewhouse without running a water line. I understand not wanting to get the ditch to 4 feet, but you're already digging. Do it! Also, on the electrical, I'd run a 4" conduit for that and leave both end accessible for other pulls. If you're not planning to run a point of use water heater in there, I'd run an insulated hot water line out there too!

 

[Liquidicem]

Another option (maybe not a very good one) for the water would be to plumb the garage for water but make the connection with a hose run from the hose that you only pull out when you need it. You could even add a point of use heater to get hot water.

But agree with Bobby, just dig the trench all the way down and do it right once. You will regret not doing.

 

[IrregularPulse]

Ditto to water. Why build a specific brewing garage, but still have to run to the house for water? If you're doing all this, do it all.

 

[ajwillys]

I think the hose idea is a great one! You could actually leave it connected all the time except for when it drops below freezing in the winter.

 

[blackheart]

I couldn't swing renting a back hoe and digging 4' down for a water line. Too expensive, too many questions from the neighbors etc. I would love to have a water line in there, and I can always add one in the future, but in reality I cant justify the cost and work involved right now. (

Good news is that I was able to dig the 18" trench for the natural gas and electric lines. I went with 2 gauge aluminum rated to 100A because it was cheaper than copper. It fit fine in a 1 1/4" pvc tube. I also got 1/2" tubing for 2 cat6 cables. A 1" gas line (yellow) was put in there as well. Unfortunately it rained all weekend making it very difficult for me to finish digging the trench and get things wired up. After digging for a while in the rain I eventually had to quit and call it a day. I do have everything in the ground though ready for the electrician and gas guy to come connect both ends up.

If all goes according to plan then I will have the garage setup with gas and electric this week and can finish up the drywall this weekend! Then all that is left is the ceiling and floor.

Anyone have a suggestion for what to do with the floor?

 

[wilserbrewer]

As others have already said, put a 3 or 4" empty conduit in the trench before you backfill w/ a pull cord installed for any future installations. This could also be used for a temporary water connection during mild weather. I might also put in a plastic PEX water pipe even at eighteen inches...I believe they are freeze resistant and at least would allow three seasons of convenient access to water.

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

As others have already said, put a 3 or 4" empty conduit in the trench before you backfill w/ a pull cord installed for any future installations. This could also be used for a temporary water connection during mild weather. I might also put in a plastic PEX water pipe even at eighteen inches...I believe they are freeze resistant and at least would allow three seasons of convenient access to water.

That is an awesome idea!

You could just run a hose through the conduit and even in the heart of winter the hose wouldn't freeze in a brewday like it may outside. That would be a great solution!!!

 

[slimer]

They also sell heater wraps for copper that could keep the temps above freezing.

How To Install Heat Tape

 

[blackheart]

Its easier and shorter for me to run a hose from the side of the house to inside the garage. The water for the hose is on the opposite side of the house that I am running the other lines from. Its only ~20 feet from the front of the garage to the water faucet.

I could also mount a water connection on the front of the garage and then simply leave it always connected inside and just connect and disconnect a short 20ft hose from the house to the garage when I need water, and disconnect in the winter.

 

[eschatz]

I'm thinking this is what I'm doing this year too. I just moved into a new place and using a hose is where it's at. Now I need to find a utility sink to hook it too.

 

[ClaudiusB]

Good news is that I was able to dig the 18" trench for the natural gas and electric lines. I went with 2 gauge aluminum rated to 100A because it was cheaper than copper

Looks good.
Just make sure the electrical enclosures on both ends are rated for aluminum wire.



Cheers,
ClaudiusB

 

[PhlyanPan]

I might also put in a plastic PEX water pipe even at eighteen inches...I believe they are freeze resistant and at least would allow three seasons of convenient access to water.

PEX is awesome stuff. Put one in, and blow the line out with a compressor before winter. Even if you forget or don't get the water out there's a chance the PEX won't burst.

 

[blackheart]

More updates on the progress...

Electrical connection on the outside of the garage

Natural Gas connection from the house to the garage

The electrical is all but connected to the box in the house. As soon as I can get my electrician back in there to connect a few wires the garage will once again have power.

We did manage to finish up all of the dry wall finally. Here are some pictures of the progress...

Now all thats left is to finish the ceiling (and wait for the plaster guy to plaster the walls) then finish the floor.

We took some 3" furring strips to create a ceiling on the tops of the beams. We will then staple R-30 insulation to the top to insulate the ceiling. Hang halogen lights between the rafters, and install a drop ceiling. As soon as the walls are plastered we can finish up the ceiling.

Still trying to figure out what to do with the floor. ~480sq.f to cover

 

[Simphoto02]

Question: The yellow pipe in the trench, That is your Natural Gas Line, Correct? Is it the all plastic gas line or is it the plastic wrapped metal flex pipe?

IF it is the metal flex plastic covered pipe I would look into replacing that and not using it. That pipe was outlawed (Kentucky) in my area. It is good, but it apparently has some conductivity issues with lightning or some crap like that. Look and see if it is legal in your area. Are you pulling permits for this electrical and gas stuff?

Also where is your frost line? Is that stuff deep enough? 24 inches here. Used to be 18"

Be safe. but have fun and it looks GREAT. I am so green here.

 

[bendavanza]

The epoxy floor paints are durable and cheap enough, easy to roll on and you can get the fleck chips if you're into that. Bare concrete is impossible to clean. You need to at least seal it. How about a concrete stain and seal? You can do that yourself, too, and it will have a nice color check out Kemiko Concrete Stains: Kemiko Stone Tone Concrete Floor Stain or Kemiko - Do It Yourself I'm a fan of the stain and seal. The stain will stay, the seal you may need to reapply every several years, depending on the traffic you get.

 

[blackheart]

I finally got the plaster guy in and he started doing his thing. Here are some pictures of the base coat of mud. On top of this is going a lime stone coat with a pattern to make it look nice. We ran into a problem with the right side where the roof meets the wall at an angle. It took about 2 hours of messing around until we had the wall board up and it wasnt hitting the top of the garage door when it was open. I dont know what I am going to use to fill in the gap but it will have to be something thin like plexiglass or plastic.

The plaster guy is in my garage right now as I am posting this. Hopefully he will be done today and I can paint this weekend


The Yellow pipe is a special continuous gas pipe with a compression fitting done by the gas company. Its all plastic 1".

Thanks for the info about the concrete sealing. I will look into that as well as the epoxy for the floor.

Hopefully we will be finishing up the ceiling by next weekend and then the floor. Another week or two and this should be wrapped up and we can start building the brewing system!!

 

[s1080]

Sometimes words cant describe the amount of jelousy one can feel Keep up the good work! Its gonna rock!

 

[blackheart]

We finished up the dry wall on friday. By we I of course mean the drywall guy. I helped him with the one board on the ceiling and thats about it. Here are pictures of the results. A base mud coat was done followed by a top coat of limestone. $400 for labor & materials. We are all pretty happy that we did not have to do this part ourselves.

Unfortunately, its going to take 1-2 weeks to dry all of the way. We just spent sunday cleaning everything up. The garage is now completely empty and cleaned up all of the plaster from the floors etc while it was still easy to remove. Here is the plan for this week.

- Clean and seal the cement floor inside and out on the patio.
- Paint on a epoxy floor outside and put in an epoxy or wood floor inside
- Buy materials for the drop ceiling + insulation
- Buy paint to paint walls with
- Screen in the outdoor patio

Then this weekend we hope the plaster is dry enough to put up the edges we need for the drop ceiling into the walls. After that only a few minor things like window trim and baseboards remain.

One big decision we have left to make is wether to go with an epoxy floor inside or to make a slightly raised floor from wood.

Wood floor would be nicer to stand on and look nicer. Also it could be insulated underneath. On the other hand it will most likely cost alot more than epoxy, not be as tough on beer spills, and the biggest issue, the ceiling height is currently ~7ft. Reducing it by ~4" to put in insulation/supports for a floor then the wood floor itself would really make the inside start to feel small.

Any thoughts?

 

[Simphoto02]

The wood floor would be so sweet and really dress it up. Can you do an epoxy in the "Work" area that has a higher risk of water and beer spillage and a wood floor in the other parts? Why do you need to raise it so much? the engineered wood floors are tough as nails, stable in temp changes and will sit right on the concrete after you add a vapor and thin insulation layer, maybe 3/4" to an inch higher, Some really good looking thresholds could take care of the transition from epoxy to wood.

Do you have any floor drains? I would look into cutting one in before you seal up the floor. A floor drain in the brewing area and then the epoxy or even better a terra cotta tile in that area could be just the ticket, not to mention cleaner and less chance of mold under the wood floor.

Looking VERY good.

 

[RedRory]

Be sure to read the diresctions of your epoxy before you seal your concrete, it may not adhere to the sealer. Believe me, removing sealer is not fun. I would consider staining your concrete. There are now water based stains that look awesome. Check out Butterfield's website for ideas. I did my back patio and it was easy and pretty inexpensive.

Good luck and your Brew Haus looks great!

Mike

 

[Bobby_M]

I did the two part epoxy on my garage floor before I moved all my crap in and the one thing I regret is being too anxious and not applying a second coat. In the areas where I put it on a bit thicker created a nice smooth cleanable surface. The thinner spots are still too porous. I think the flecks make it look goofy, but that's just me. I sprinkled pumice into the still wet epoxy just for mild traction help. If you go two coats, only do it on the surface coat.