Fruit lambic - when to add the fruit?

[DrakeSuperbus]

I've been doing some research, but I'm stuck on one thing: should I add the fruit (raspberry puree) when I rack to secondary and pitch a wyeast lambic yeast, or should I rack to secondary and add the fruit after a couple of months.

I have seen people do both, but I haven't seen any argument as to why one would pick one method over the other.

If it matters, I am probably just going to go extract with some light, pils, and wheat malt, and will likely do primary fermentation with something clean like a US-05.

 

[Calder]

The schedule I have is to rack onto fruit at the 8 to 9 month mark. Then leave it another 6 months or so before bottling.

Many people leave it a long time before racking onto fruit, so that most of the yeast is gone, and the bugs get to work on the fruit sugars. If there is still a lot of sacc around, it will use all the fruit sugars in a couple of days.

 

[DrakeSuperbus]

That makes sense. How does waiting for the yeast to die off and letting the bugs eat the fruit sugars impact the final flavor?

 

[BryanThompson]

The fruit flavor fades with time so I add fruit puree about two months before bottling and whole/sliced fruit I add about four or five months before bottling.

 

[DrakeSuperbus]

Awesome, that's the sort of info I was looking for but couldn't find. In that case I'll probably do something like the following:

-3lbs light dme, 2lbs pils lme, 3 lbs wheat dme with 4oz of aged hops
-pitch US-05, ferment for ~2 weeks
-rack to secondary on french oak chips, pitch either wyeast lambic or roselare
-age out for ~9 months
-rack onto raspberry puree
-age an additional 2 months
-bottle

 

[todd46]

Awesome, that's the sort of info I was looking for but couldn't find. In that case I'll probably do something like the following:

-3lbs light dme, 2lbs pils lme, 3 lbs wheat dme with 4oz of aged hops
-pitch US-05, ferment for ~2 weeks
-rack to secondary on french oak chips, pitch either wyeast lambic or roselare
-age out for ~9 months
-rack onto raspberry puree
-age an additional 2 months
-bottle

I'd skip the US-05 and just pitch one of the wyeast blends

 

[doughav]

Hi guys.. I've tried some fruit Lambic style beer brewing in the past. Love this stuff above. I have a few questions.
1. What yeast would you use for Primary instead of listing above? and what optimal fermentation temp?
2. Would an oak barrel be ok for aging instead of glass carboy with wood chips.
Any other ideas on my next batch would be appreciated.

 

[goodolarchie]

There's no magic number for when your primary/secondary beer is ready for fruit, should sample the beer regularly, take notes, and when it's done evolving (is mature), figure out what kind of fruit might complement. But I understand the "I want to make a lambic Framboise" idea, in which case there are some good fast strains/blends (I like Sour Batch from Imperial in general) you can use to get you to a good point for fruit by the 6 month mark in terms of the brett and LAB development. A lot of lambic character comes from generous aged hops being allowed to mellow over years, and the barrels slowly seeping oxygen. I see you have aged hops in your recipe so be mindful there might still be some bitter/astringent character for a young beer.

Raspberry is pretty intense early on and ages very well IMO, one of the best fruits to make and sit on. It doesn't need much contact time or even fruiting rate to make a big contribution... even 1lb/gal is enough for a few weeks. After that you can more or less forget about it for 6 months to 2 years and have a very nice beer. Don't do that with peaches or fleshy stonefruits, quite the opposite.

 

[monkeymath]

Raspberry is pretty intense early on and ages very well IMO, one of the best fruits to make and sit on. It doesn't need much contact time or even fruiting rate to make a big contribution... even 1lb/gal is enough for a few weeks. After that you can more or less forget about it for 6 months to 2 years and have a very nice beer. Don't do that with peaches or fleshy stonefruits, quite the opposite.

I'm intrigued by this comment on stonefruits. Can you share your experiences with those?

I really like "Zwetschgen", a slightly more sour variety of plum that's very popular in Bavaria and Austria (possibly elsewhere as well, not sure), and obviously I intend to add some of those bad boys to a yet-to-be-brewed sour. What should I keep in mind?

 

[goodolarchie]

Can you share your experiences with those?

Sure. In general the fleshier/juicier the fruit, and the more it relies on sugary sweetness to be the dominant flavor, the less contributive and sustaining it tends to be post fermentation. Peach and Nectarine are classic examples, they do great 3-9 months out, but they lose the bright, vivid fruit flavor that we think of when biting into a fleshy stonefruit. Plums do a bit better as do apricots and the smaller hybrids, and of course cherries tend to age pretty well.

Raspberries and other smaller, tannic fruits with a lot of skin-to-pulp ratio tend to age quite a bit better, and need a LOT less fruit per volume of beer. They can actually be quite intense, tannic/harsh out of secondary, and benefit from 6-8 months of aging. Peach beers are like dry hops - drink them as fresh as possible, ideally 12-24 weeks after bottling.