Flameout vs. 5 minute hop additions

[JBrady]

I understand that the 5 min. additions actually increase IBUs and Flameouts don't, although a brewery stated in a recent issue of BYO that their lab test results proved that they do increase IBUs, is there really a significant difference in the flavor, bitterness, and aroma of these two additions? I haven't had enough brews under my belt to know what the flavor differences are, but it seems to me that flameout additions would be better spent as dry hops. I know I'm more than likely wrong here, I just need someone to help me understand the pros and cons of each method, and when one should be used instead of the other. Thanks for any info.

 

[donjonson]

Wondering this myself

 

[jbrookeiv]

Interested as well.

 

[JBrady]

Somebody with a little knowledge on the subject will chime in sooner or later to clear it up, lol. It just seems to me that if you stack up 5min hops, 0min hops, and dry hops all on top of each other, that your not gonna be able to tell the difference in 1oz of each vs 3oz of one. I'm sure theres a method to the madness, I just need to find out what it is, lol.

 

[VTBrewer]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Beer_math

I'm not sure which IBU calculation that uses, but as you can see it doesn't differentiate between 0 and 5 mins....though it does between 0 and 6, but anything added under 15 minutes or so is generally considered and aroma hop and not bittering. You'd have to chuck in a ton to really make that much of a difference to IBU's at that point in the boil. Dry hopping adds 0. Just aroma. Keep in mind, well trained judges generally cannot distinguish IBU"s that are within 5 points or so of each other.

The different IBU calculations are: Garetz Rager Tinseth Daniels. I *THINK* that one is Garetz. You can find calculators online and play around to see the differences. Theres one on the link in my signature.

Cheers

 

[ajf]

I'm dammed if I can tell the difference between a 5 min and a flameout hop addition, but there's a big difference between a flameout addition and dry hopping. Try both, and you will see what I mean.

-a.

 

[Hermit]

It takes me a while to cool down with an IC chiller so my hops will be in contact a bit longer than someone using a plate chiller. Since they are aroma hops, I'd think flame out is a tad better. Don't really know.

 

[JBrady]

I'm dammed if I can tell the difference between a 5 min and a flameout hop addition, but there's a big difference between a flameout addition and dry hopping. Try both, and you will see what I mean.

-a.

Thats just what I mean, if you were thinking about 2oz of flameout additions, why not just use 1oz of the more effective dry hop addition? It would save money and achieve the same thing more less.

 

[thisjrp4]

Hops need to be boiled to extract bitterness. Boiling for five minutes does extract some bitterness, but not as much as 60 minutes. At flameout the bitterness is negligible, unless you really load up. I think some brewers do late hops only, but you need a lot. 2 oz at flameout is not the same as 1 oz of dry. I find late boil hops to have a nicer aroma that is part of the beer, where dry hops are "fresher" and really jump out at you.

 

[JBrady]

Hops need to be boiled to extract bitterness. Boiling for five minutes does extract some bitterness, but not as much as 60 minutes. At flameout the bitterness is negligible, unless you really load up. I think some brewers do late hops only, but you need a lot. 2 oz at flameout is not the same as 1 oz of dry. I find late boil hops to have a nicer aroma that is part of the beer, where dry hops are "fresher" and really jump out at you.

Awesome, now I'm starting to get a grasp on the different methods. Thanks

 

[Scooby_Brew]

It all depends on your brewing method.
For instance, I brew 10 gal AG batches and my 0 min. addition hops sit in a hot wort for ~20 min, waiting for me to cool it down.
My buddy on the other hand does 5 gal extract brewing, and at flamout he pours hot wort on top of ice in the fermentor and then tops it of with cold water. I go from boil to room temp in half hour, he does that in 30 seconds.
So I recommended for him to move all his flamout additions to 5 min, so he can get some more flavor out of those hops.
Brewing is more of an art than a science if you ask me.

 

[VTBrewer]

Brewing is more of an art than a science if you ask me.

Or a science with an incredible amount of artistic license granted to all who apply.

 

[ajf]

Thats just what I mean, if you were thinking about 2oz of flameout additions, why not just use 1oz of the more effective dry hop addition? It would save money and achieve the same thing more less.

As I tried to say, there is a profound difference between a flame out addition and dry hopping.

Dry hopping is not more effective than a flameout addition, it is completely different.

As I suggested before, try comparing a flameout addition with a dry hop addition. I think you will notice a considerable difference in flavor and aroma, and then you can decide which you prefer.

-a.

 

[v2comp]

I suggest you also try cooling the wort down to just below 170F and then add them, stir to create a whirlpool for about 20 minutes and then go back to chilling. at this temp they wont isomerize and will leave a wonderful aroma without adding bitterness.

 

[JBrady]

I suggest you also try cooling the wort down to just below 170F and then add them, stir to create a whirlpool for about 20 minutes and then go back to chilling. at this temp they wont isomerize and will leave a wonderful aroma without adding bitterness.

Thats the first that I've heard of that technique, I'll definitely give that a try