First Water Adjustment Attempt (Porter)

[JoppaFarms]

Hey folks, so water is the next thing on my list of processes to improve my beer. This is a new recipe, so I won't have anything to compare the results to. I plan on using distilled water and adding salts to achieve the profile I need. Here is my recipe and attempt.


Recipe: AHBS W.W. Porter
Brewer:
Style: Robust Porter
TYPE: All Grain
Taste:

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 6.77 gal
Post Boil Volume: 5.67 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.25 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.21 gal
Estimated OG: 1.052 SG
Estimated Color: 39.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 33.0 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
7 lbs 12.0 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 10 71.3 %
1 lbs Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 11 9.2 %
12.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 12 6.9 %
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 13 4.6 %
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (80.0 SRM) Grain 14 4.6 %
6.0 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 15 3.4 %
0.75 oz Northdown [7.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 16 19.6 IBUs
1.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [7.20 %] - Boil 15.0 Hop 17 13.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Willamette [4.70 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 mi Hop 18 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Greenbelt (Wyeast #5609) Yeast 19 -
2.00 oz Coffee (Bottling 0.0 mins) Flavor 20 -


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 10 lbs 14.0 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 5.00 gal of water at 164.3 F 156.0 F 60 min

Sparge: Batch sparge with 1 steps (2.50gal) of 168.0 F water

I used Bru'n Water spreadsheet and chose the "Brown Malty" water profile and made adjustments using Distilled water (i.e. zero for all minerals and 7.8 for pH). Does this look appropriate? According to the spreadsheet it appears that my estimated mash pH will be 5.3 which is a bit low, but it is in the range (5.2-5.5). Any help would be GREATLY appreciated!

 

[Yooper]

I'd probably get rid of the epsom salts, and lower the sulfate further by lowering the gypsum as well. I don't think I'd like much sulfate in a porter.

Do you need the baking soda in there to guestimate the mash pH at 5.3? I'm guessing yes, and if so it's ok.

 

[mabrungard]

Don't worry about the sulfate content, its already nice and low. If anything, it may need to be higher in a robust porter to help accentuate the bittering that is characteristic of the style. I wouldn't use the Brown Malty and would aim more for Brown Balanced to get the sulfate up. The teeny bit of magnesium is of no concern. You can include it or delete it with only minor taste impact. The baking soda addition is no big deal and the resulting sodium is OK. Assuming this is the free version of Bru'n Water, you can actually afford to boost the sodium content much higher in this calculation since it will ultimately be diluted by the sodium-free sparging water. I would target a pH of at least 5.4 and 5.5 is OK.

 

[JoppaFarms]

Thanks for the input. Yes, this is the free version of Bru'n Water. I used Brown Malty because (and it's hard to see in the ingredients) but I am adding coffee at bottling and I want the maltiness to balance the bitter flavor of the coffee and hops. The Baking Soda is in there to get the mash pH up to 5.3 (add the bicarbonates). You're saying I should go to 5.4-5.5? What is the major difference between Brown Malty and Brown Balanced? It looks like it just increases the baking soda that I would add to the mash.

P.S. I don't have a pH meter at this point but it's in the long line of things I need to buy (refractometer, pH meter, etc).

 

[Yooper]

Don't worry about the sulfate content, its already nice and low. If anything, it may need to be higher in a robust porter to help accentuate the bittering that is characteristic of the style. I wouldn't use the Brown Malty and would aim more for Brown Balanced to get the sulfate up. The teeny bit of magnesium is of no concern. You can include it or delete it with only minor taste impact. The baking soda addition is no big deal and the resulting sodium is OK. Assuming this is the free version of Bru'n Water, you can actually afford to boost the sodium content much higher in this calculation since it will ultimately be diluted by the sodium-free sparging water. I would target a pH of at least 5.4 and 5.5 is OK.

I defer to Martin- after all, it's his program! And I totally respect his judgement on water additions.

Still, to me, 80 ppm of sulfate isn't exactly "nice and low" and I do prefer a lower level of sulfate to my taste. That's only my tastebuds, though!

 

[ajdelange]

Don't be in a hurry to push up the sulfate. Hops shouldn't be aggressive in a Porter. Brew with low sulfate and then taste test with additions of some gypsum to see if you find the flavor improved. If you do, then have at it next time. I had a great Porter at Flying Dog the other night. The hops were quite muted and the beer was richly delicious (and dangerous as the ABV was pretty respectable). I did see a bag of anhydrous calcium sulfate lying on the brewery floor, however.

 

[mabrungard]

Actually, in a robust porter they can be notable and the bitter can be moderate. This is not a sweet, malty beer. Sulfate is welcome for its drying effect.

 

[vinpaysdoc]

Send Martin a donation and get the upgraded version that calculates the pH to the hundredths on the Mash Acidification sheet and has the pH listed (to the tenths) on the Water Adjustment page.

I shoot for 5.45 with darker beers as per Martin's recommendation.

 

[ajdelange]

Actually, in a robust porter they can be notable and the bitter can be moderate. This is not a sweet, malty beer. Sulfate is welcome for its drying effect.

Here are (parts of) the BJCP specs for the three porters:

Brown: Medium-low to medium hop
bitterness will vary the balance from slightly malty to slightly bitter.
Usually fairly well attenuated, although somewhat sweet versions exist.

Robust:Moderately strong malt flavor usually features a lightly burnt,
black malt character (and sometimes chocolate and/or coffee flavors)
with a bit of roasty dryness in the finish. Overall flavor may finish
from dry to medium-sweet, depending on grist composition, hop
bittering level, and attenuation. May have a sharp character from dark
roasted grains, although should not be overly acrid, burnt or harsh.
Medium to high bitterness (25 - 50+), which can be accentuated by the roasted
malt.

Baltic:As with aroma, has a rich malty sweetness with a complex
blend of deep malt, dried fruit esters, and alcohol. Has a prominent yet
smooth schwarzbier-like roasted flavor that stops short of burnt.
Mouth-filling and very smooth. Clean lager character; no diacetyl.
Starts sweet but darker malt flavors quickly dominates and persists
through finish. Just a touch dry with a hint of roast coffee or licorice in
the finish. Malt can have a caramel, toffee, nutty, molasses and/or
licorice complexity. Light hints of black currant and dark fruits.
Medium-low to medium bitterness from malt and hops, just to provide
balance. Perhaps a hint of hop flavor.

So yes, they can be dry and bitter but do not have to be. Certainly the example I was drinking (the Baltic description fit is best) the other night was not. The Robusts can run from 25 IBU's (which is hardly very bitter) to 50+ which clearly is. I think you do the OP a disservice in trying to push OP to go the dry/bitter route when medium-sweet/moderately hopped is equally acceptable. Assuming that we are style Nazi's. In fact OP should brew the beer so it tastes good to him unless his goal is to win a ribbon. In any case OP has now been presented with two views and I encourage him to read the guidelines and anything else he can find on Porter, make his own decision and brew.

Disclosure: My tastes are similar to Yooper's. The less sulfate the better. OP needs to discover whether he is a sulfate lover or sulfate hater or neutral.

 

[JoppaFarms]

Wow, thank for the insight and the perspective. This is one of the things that I absolutely love about this website. You guys are fantastic.

So, going back and rereading the mineral effects on beer, I think I would like a maltier/sweeter beer because I'm going to be using coffee in the bottling and it may add some bitterness/dryness. Thus, I've used the Brown Malty water adjustments and gotten it a bit more accurate (it takes a few iterations to figure out how to best add salts). I also had to increase the mash volume by 0.5 gallons to get the pH to come up to 5.4 which means I've decreased my sparge by 0.5 gallons. This isn't an issue since I'm a BIAB brewer and can do a pour-through-sparge or a tea-bag dunking sparge that I've done before. How do think this one looks?

Targets were:
Calcium - 60
Magnesium - 5
Sodium - 15
Sulfate - 50
Chloride - 60
Bicarbonate - 85