Hophead138
Active Member
Whats the purpose of using a starter and can i use it with a "smack pack"? Also what is th epitching rate and how can i figure out my yeast's pitching rate?
Ales & Lagers
The general consensus on pitching rates is that you want to pitch around 1 million cells of viable yeast, for every milliliter of wort, for every degree plato. A little less for an ale, a little more for a lager. George Fix states about 1.5 million for a lager and 0.75 million for an ale in his book, An Analysis of Brewing Techniques. Other literature cites a slightly higher amount. I'm going with Fix's numbers and that is what the pitching calculator uses.
The Math
If you're curious, here is the simple math to calculate the number of cells needed. For an ale, you want to pitch around 0.75 million cells of viable yeast (0.75 million for an ale, 1.5 million for a lager), for every milliliter of wort, for every degree plato.
(0.75 million) X (milliliters of wort) X (degrees Plato of the wort)
* There is about 3785 milliliters in a gallon. There are about 20,000 milliliters in 5.25 gallons.
* A degree Plato is about 1.004 of original gravity. Just divide the OG by 4 to get Plato (e.g., 1.048 is 12 degrees Plato).
So, for a 1.048 wort pitching into 5.25 gallons you need about 180 billion cells.
(750,000) X (20,000) X (12) = 180,000,000,000
As an easy to remember rough estimate, you need about 15 billion cells for each degree Plato or about 4 billion cells for each point of OG when pitching into a little over 5 gallons of wort. If you want a quick way of doing a back of the envelope estimate, that is really close to 0.75 billion cells for each point of gravity per gallon of wort. Double that to 1.5 billion for a lager.
Pitching From Tubes, Packs, or Dry Yeast
Both White Labs and Wyeast make fantastic products and you can't go wrong with either one. There are differences between their strains and each brand has pluses and minuses yet neither is better than the other across the board. Use the brand your local homebrew shop carries, if you need a way to decide.
A White Labs tube has between 70 and 120 billion cells of 100% viable yeast, depending on the yeast strain. Some cells are much larger than others and there are more or less per ml based on size. (The information on the White Labs web site stating 30 to 50 billion cells is out of date.) We can just assume there are around 100 billion very healthy yeast. You would need 2 tubes if you were pitching directly into 5.5 gallons of 1.048 wort to get the proper cell counts.
A Wyeast Activator pack (the really big ones) and the pitchable tubes have an average of 100 billion cells of 100% viable yeast. The smaller packs are around 15-18 billion cells. You would need 2 of the large packs if you were pitching directly into 5.5 gallons of 1.048 wort to get the proper cell counts. For the small packs, you'd need eleven of them!
There's not even concern for peace-of-mind since if a smack-pack swells up it's a pretty good indication your yeast is viable.
Don't get me wrong, if you like spending the time and energy (and money buying a stir-plate, etc) then yeah, by all means, make a starter for every batch you brew (or if you start washing and reusing yeast). But if not, a smack-pack alone will suffice in most situations.
From the Wyeast FAQ website:
3. Does the package need to be fully swollen before pitching?
No, The package can be pitched before activating, or at anytime during the activation process. The activation process "jump starts" the culture's metabolism, minimizing the lag phase.
So in you're "logic" then if the pac doesn't swell then you should throw the yeast away because OBVIOUSLY it's not working?
*Ahem*
....
I wouldn't be surprised by our reaction on here, most of us believe in brewing properly.....
But if you've only brewed a couple times or you're still trying to conquer other beginner skills, then **** it, use a smack pack and skip the starter
As for the lame excuse oc someone only having made a few batches as a reason to not use a starter. It is lame. IMO you'll be well served learning how to make a starter eay on. I did it for my third batch, ever. Since then there have only been a few times I've not made a starter. One of those times I regretted it. Even with washed yeast its a sound idea to make a starter.
Revvy said:Yeah sure you can dump your yeast in or throw a bunch of ingredients willy nilly into a fermenter without understanding about what goes into a recipe, or letting your ambient temp creep to the 80's, and your beer may be adequate. But I think most folks, from day one, don't want mediocre.
+1,000
I think most folks want to make great beer from day one. And if they knew about things like making starters, or using a hydrometer, or proper temp control, they would do it from day one. And many do, they come here first where the most recent info is, and start doing it right with their first batch.
But most folks don't come here until they've tasted their too young, too hot and too underpitched beer and post that their beer tastes like crap, THEN we teach them about all those little things that improve their beer.
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