First Real Try At Hefeweizen

[RabbitHole]

Hey guys
Been brewing Hef's for a few years now, but never really really gave it a real go. Mainly because I haven't really taken the time to really learn what I needed to learn about brewing, and spent all my time and research building the best system that I could so that when I finally got serious about recipes... Equipment would NOT hold me back...

I created my own recipe based off of countless threads here and articles around about step mashing, different water profiles, and grain bill.
Im not doing a decoction mash because its a RIMS BIABasket, utilizing a Conical as a liquor tank. Because of the basket there is 4gallons of dead space. but I have it set at 3gallons due to recirculation. and to get a little more sparge.

-Mash Ph=5.61
-Added Chocolate malt to darken it up just a hair! because that's what I have on hand. unless I added dark Munich, but it would have to be allot. doesn't really fit the style...
-mashing in at 111º and immediately starting to raise to 122º for the protein rest... ( read that due to newer yeast and modified grains I don't really need this step. but I figured I would at least do a 15min rise out of it!!

Please Beat me up and tell me what I could change what you would do.
ATTACHED IS FULL BEERSMITH PDF

 

[dmtaylor]

Nicely done. I agree with the mash pH of 5.6, that's the right thing to do for this style especially. On my last one I went even higher to about 5.7. Some advocate going up to 6.0.

I would skip the protein rest or limit to no more than 5 minutes max. At 15 minutes you're likely to see degradation of the head and greater clarity, which of course is wrong for this style.

I would reduce priming sugar significantly to no more than 10 ounces. Don't worry, you'll have PLENTY of carbonation and head. At 12 oz you will probably have gushers or even explosions, not good. So avoid that. Believe me, I've bottled more than 160 batches, I know what I'm talking about.

Cheers.

 

[RabbitHole]

I would skip the protein rest or limit to no more than 5 minutes max. At 15 minutes you're likely to see degradation of the head and greater clarity, which of course is wrong for this style.

hmm maybe I hard read to much to fast. I thought that step helped with head retention hahahahah. thanks for the advice on that one!!!

I would reduce priming sugar significantly to no more than 10 ounces. Don't worry, you'll have PLENTY of carbonation and head. At 12 oz you will probably have gushers or even explosions, not good. So avoid that. Believe me, I've bottled more than 160 batches, I know what I'm talking about.

That was my mistake, should have changed to keg. I have never bottled... so hats off to you!!!!
Thanks!!!

 

[dmtaylor]

hmm maybe I hard read to much to fast. I thought that step helped with head retention hahahahah. thanks for the advice on that one!!!

There are two schools of thought on protein rests. Suffice it to say, one school is wrong.

Oh good, if you're kegging, it's pretty hard to mess that up.

Cheers and welcome to the forum! (Looks like maybe you just re-joined us pretty recently)

 

[RabbitHole]

There are two schools of thought on protein rests. Suffice it to say, one school is wrong.

I always tell my wife. “I would agree with you. But then we would both be wrong”

Cheers and welcome to the forum! (Looks like maybe you just re-joined us pretty recently)

It was actually 12-31-17. But I did have my name changed yesterday. So maybe that’s why. This forum is amazing!!!!
Thanks again!!

 

[dmtaylor]

It was actually 12-31-17. But I did have my name changed yesterday. So maybe that’s why. This forum is amazing!!!!
Thanks again!!

If you like rabbit holes so much, "enjoy" this one:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/thread...-brewers-do-not-mash-at-5-2-to-5-6-ph.671764/
Cheers.

 

[Jag75]

I'm brewing a hefe as we speak . I under pitch my hefe . Think @dmtaylor knows about under pitching a hefe

 

[RabbitHole]

I just realized I never added the water profile I picked. This is one I have used in the past. So it could use some tweaking I think!

 

[RM-MN]

Because of the basket there is 4gallons of dead space. but I have it set at 3gallons due to recirculation. and to get a little more sparge.

Since you are recirculating is that really dead space. I would expect all of that water below the basket to be exposed to the grains during the mash when you recirculate. JMHO

 

[RabbitHole]

Since you are recirculating is that really dead space. I would expect all of that water below the basket to be exposed to the grains during the mash when you recirculate. JMHO

I have given this so much thought and I would really love some input on it!! My train of thought was that if I had to have that much water below the mash basket, it would be recoverable of course but need to be added to get the grist ratio correct (which i have bumped from 1.28 to 1.5.
What I noticed the other day though. When circulating it was still like 6inches up around the basket. So I dropped it to three gallons for the next brew day.

 

[dmtaylor]

I just realized I never added the water profile I picked. This is one I have used in the past. So it could use some tweaking I think!
View attachment 709362

Water, schmater. All looks good to me. I try not to get too excited about water. As long as you have reasonable amounts of calcium, chloride, and sulfate (which you do) and the mash pH isn't way off, then it will taste good. Personally I don't use Epsom (magnesium) or chalk at all, they simply do not help, and chalk especially won't dissolve enough to matter. You can safely ignore these additions for purpose of hitting magnesium and carbonate "goals", these are unnecessary goals. Baking soda I use sometimes if needed to raise pH (alkalinity). These days more often I will use pickling lime in very dark / black beers (dark grains reduce pH) instead of baking soda to avoid too much sodium. But your sodium is so low that it could work well for you, for dark beers. I use harder water with more sodium so then pickling lime is a cleaner substitute (calcium instead of sodium).

More important is the mash pH, which I already discussed and looks good.

Bottom line, the only thing I might change is to ditch the Epsom and chalk, not helping your beer.

 

[ESBrewer]

The elevated pH is especially useful for the ferulic acid rest that should enhance the clove flavor or its precursor e.g. the first step in the hefeweizen mash schedule (around 110F). If you start at, say pH6.0, it is possible to add some acid, acidulated malt etc. for the saccharification step.

 

[RabbitHole]

I had read this as well. But I wasn’t going to get to crazy. But something worth doing is required to be done right!!

Sooooo I tweaked the water profile based on @dmtaylor, removed the 122° protein step, added 10min rest to 111° before 15min rise to 154° and my mash ph is at 5.61 without any adjustments.

so how would I safely increase that mash in ph??? and re lowering back at the sach with lactic acid I would only have to worry about removing bicarbonate?? Which I don’t have much to lose!!

 

[dmtaylor]

so how would I safely increase that mash in ph??? and re lowering back at the sach with lactic acid I would only have to worry about removing bicarbonate?? Which I don’t have much to lose!!

Very easy to do actually. Just like @ESBrewer says above, don't add any of your acid, gypsum, or calcium chloride until after the 111 F ferulic acid rest is done. Mash in with just your plain RO water. After the first rest you can mix all the rest of that stuff in. Easy peasy.

 

[RabbitHole]

Very easy to do actually. Just like @ESBrewer says above, don't add any of your acid, gypsum, or calcium chloride until after the 111 F ferulic acid rest is done. Mash in with just your plain RO water. After the first rest you can mix all the rest of that stuff in. Easy peasy.

Perfect!! You guys are amazing. I can’t wait to get to brew day. What’s your favorite yeast. I have used the yeast in a purple packet (vague I know) and then I used wlp-300 a bunch. But this time looks like I’ll have to wyeast-3068 because that’s what the local has in stock and I don’t need to order anything else to justify the shipping!

 

[Qhrumphf]

I like to use a good long ferulic acid rest (like 45 mins), decoct to protein rest and then immediately decoct to beta rest, and from there on it's hochkurz. The protein rest helps a bit with runoff. If your system doesn't need it, or if you wanna use rice hulls, then skip it. Especially if you're not decocting (where making a jump from 110 to 145ish is a big f***ing decoction).

I also mash my Hefe at 5.7-5.8 (room temp measurement). I don't acidify in the mash at all, but acidify sparge water to eliminate pH rising any further, and then acid/salts in the kettle down to 5.2 pH pre-boil.

Fermentation management is the most important thing. I full on ABUSE yeast for Hefes. Huge under pitch, no oxygen, cold fermentation. Makes for poor repitching (lucky to get a 3rd worthwhile generation) if you opt to harvest. But plenty of banana and clove. If you don't nail the fermentation it's really easy to end up with only one, the other, or worse yet neither.

 

[Jag75]

Well I screwed the pooch . First time I've had to dump . Got set up , started mash and my screen that covers the malt pipe fell off into the mash. I have a top screen (Grainfather) so i figured I'd scoop it out with a spoon . I tried multiple times with negative results so I just left it .

When I pulled up the basket to sparge I noticed my top screen was pushed way down on one end overly compacting the grain . Results of me trying to dig out the malt pipe screen.

Then I realized I had not added rice hulls. My Hefe is very basic , 6# white wheat and 4# 2 row . Sparge completed didn't get stuck but I was not sure how the mash conversion would be .

Boiled , chilled and took a gravity sample. UGH.......1.032 . It normally hits 53 to 56. I go in to grab some DME and wouldn't you know it , none to be had .

Didn't even get it transferred to the fermenter half way and said , screw it moved the hose to the sink and watched my almost hefe go down the drain.

I see you guys talking about step mashes. I won't do a decoction but I'm thinking of trying a step mash when I re brew this .

 

[RabbitHole]

Well I screwed the pooch . First time I've had to dump . Got set up , started mash and my screen that covers the malt pipe fell off into the mash. I have a top screen (Grainfather) so i figured I'd scoop it out with a spoon . I tried multiple times with negative results so I just left it .

When I pulled up the basket to sparge I noticed my top screen was pushed way down on one end overly compacting the grain . Results of me trying to dig out the malt pipe screen.

Then I realized I had not added rice hulls. My Hefe is very basic , 6# white wheat and 4# 2 row . Sparge completed didn't get stuck but I was not sure how the mash conversion would be .

Boiled , chilled and took a gravity sample. UGH.......1.032 . It normally hits 53 to 56. I go in to grab some DME and wouldn't you know it , none to be had .

Didn't even get it transferred to the fermenter half way and said , screw it moved the hose to the sink and watched my almost hefe go down the drain.

I see you guys talking about step mashes. I won't do a decoction but I'm thinking of trying a step mash when I re brew this .

Whoahhhh rough day!!! U should have let it ferment and could have been a breakfast beer. Hahahah
Some days are better then others.
my last brew day started at 4am didn’t mash in till 839 because I had to rebuild my grain mill and do all kinds of work on it to get it to crush. Then I serious subsequent issues after. Like RO water discharge freezing night before and not realizing it until 2hours in I realize I’m making 1gallon and hour instead of two haha. It didn’t stop there. But I got through it and I have a nice NEIPA ready to be kegged. I just need to get home to it!!

good luck next time. Feel free to rob my recipe. I’m going to post back next week after I brew it and update the file at the top!!!

 

[robertkerr79]

What’s your favorite yeast.

I brewed my first hefeweizen recently and got nice banana and clove aroma using the aptly named FM41 Cloves and Bananas.

 

[Buckeye_Hydro]

Anyone here tried the Hefe at the Hofbräuhaus in Newport, KY (right across the river from Cincinnati)? I've tried a million different Hefe's, but theirs is hands down the best for me.

 

[RabbitHole]

Anyone here tried the Hefe at the Hofbräuhaus in Newport, KY (right across the river from Cincinnati)? I've tried a million different Hefe's, but theirs is hands down the best for me.

I have not. But I’m adding it to my beer to try

 

[dmtaylor]

Anyone here tried the Hefe at the Hofbräuhaus in Newport, KY (right across the river from Cincinnati)? I've tried a million different Hefe's, but theirs is hands down the best for me.

Indeed, Hofbrau is a reliable source of outstanding German beers. So is Gordon Biersch. I probably haven't been to Newport KY but they're a chain and have great beer everywhere I've been.

 

[Jag75]

I've had the hefe at the Hafbrau in Morro Bay . Don't know if its the same but it is pretty dang good

 

[RabbitHole]

Merry Christmas y’all. This is hands down the absolute best Hefe I have made and maybe had!! The head retention and lacing is absolutely perfect. Great mouth feel. Spot on flavor!!! I would only change the Ferm temp profile drop it, start at 62° and end at 68°

 

[McKnuckle]

Congrats @RabbitHole ! Link to where you got those custom printed can-glasses, please?!

 

[Vale71]

That glass is of the completely wrong shape to drink a Hefe. Your Hefe is ruined. Plese send what's left of it to me for proper disposal...

 

[RabbitHole]

Hey everyone. Been a few weeks since kegged. Hands down the bed hefe I have ever brewed (so thanks for all the advice and support)

but it’s starting to clear up quit a bit. Not a big deal. Buttttt nothow the style goes!! What should I do to get more cloud and not change to much!!!

 

[Jag75]

Hey everyone. Been a few weeks since kegged. Hands down the bed hefe I have ever brewed (so thanks for all the advice and support)

but it’s starting to clear up quit a bit. Not a big deal. Buttttt nothow the style goes!! What should I do to get more cloud and not change to much!!!

Nice ! Mine taste good but it has a different color then normal .

 

[dmtaylor]

Hey everyone. Been a few weeks since kegged. Hands down the bed hefe I have ever brewed (so thanks for all the advice and support)

but it’s starting to clear up quit a bit. Not a big deal. Buttttt nothow the style goes!! What should I do to get more cloud and not change to much!!!

It's not wrong to swirl your fermenter a little bit to get the yeast back up off the bottom.

 

[Qhrumphf]

You can rouse your bottle or keg to resuspend yeast. Commercial breweries often store Hefe kegs upside down until they're tapped.

 

[Jag75]

You can rouse your bottle or keg to resuspend yeast. Commercial breweries often store Hefe kegs upside down until they're tapped.

Whoa , learn something new everyday.

 

[RabbitHole]

Nicely done. I agree with the mash pH of 5.6, that's the right thing to do for this style especially. On my last one I went even higher to about 5.7. Some advocate going up to 6.0.

I would skip the protein rest or limit to no more than 5 minutes max. At 15 minutes you're likely to see degradation of the head and greater clarity, which of course is wrong for this style.

I would reduce priming sugar significantly to no more than 10 ounces. Don't worry, you'll have PLENTY of carbonation and head. At 12 oz you will probably have gushers or even explosions, not good. So avoid that. Believe me, I've bottled more than 160 batches, I know what I'm talking about.

Cheers.

So I just reviewed this and like before left my salts out till the sach rest at 154°. And opted for no lactic acidosis this time and left the mash ph5.7

I ended with a tanked Eff of 52% and a beer of 4.1%. It’s going to be really good none the less. But Some people told me other places to only do the higher ph at the ferulic rest only and and a normal ph at sach rest.
What’s your thoughts??

 

[dmtaylor]

So I just reviewed this and like before left my salts out till the sach rest at 154°. And opted for no lactic acidosis this time and left the mash ph5.7

I ended with a tanked Eff of 52% and a beer of 4.1%. It’s going to be really good none the less. But Some people told me other places to only do the higher ph at the ferulic rest only and and a normal ph at sach rest.
What’s your thoughts??

I am not sure, I would like to experiment more with pH, but it seems to make sense to start with the higher pH then bring it down to normal pH later in the mash, so you may be right and this might be the cause of your low efficiency as well. Sorry if I misled you and messed up your efficiency.

 

[Cloud Surfer]

Has anyone tried open fermenting with their Hefe?