First Extract brew, Did I screw up?

[cegan09]

So I made my first beer last weekend. It's Northern Brewer's Irish Red that comes with their kits. Everything seemed to go ok, though I missed my OG by a bit (1.034). I think I added too much water filling the carboy. That's not the part i'm questioning though.

Put it in the carboy, and I had fermentation within 8 hours. Looked like this the morning after I let it start (14 hours later)

It kept going like that for that day, but by morning the second day the yeast had collapsed. Yeast cake was present for no more than 36 hours. Airlock returned to unpressurized. about 12 hours after the yeast collapsed (fluid in both halves instead of being pushed all into one from CO2 pressure). I'm just looking to see if that seems too short. Maybe it's normal since the OG was so low to begin with, but I wanted to run it by some people.


Other note. I put the beer in a small fridge hoping it would act as a temperature stabilizer since my apartment fluctuates so much in temperature. I've been working on a brewpi setup, but it wasn't done in time, so i had no control. I saw the temp of the carboy drop to 62 at one point. Not sure if that was too cool. Today I got the brewpi setup working, so it's running and I'm trying to bring that up north of 65 now.


So what say you, did I screw up the first brew?


Note: tell me if the picture doesn't show up. I've had some issues on other forums with pictures hosted on pictures.google showing for some people and not others.

 

[physics911]

Nearly all brews get screwed up in one way or another. But you probably brewed beer.

When you say the yeast collapsed, I assume you are referring to the krausen. This can happen rather quickly, so I wouldn't be concerned with that. When you say the yeast cake was present for no more than 36 hours, I assume again you mean the krausen (the yeast cake is the build up at the bottom of the fermenter, not the top).

Let us know the yeast, and everything else in the kit, and the senior members can be of more service.

 

[ballsy]

Grain or extract? Stuff like this happens at first, try not to sweat it and just sit back and let it relax at room temp. Temp control is typically most important for the first 3-5 days and after that you can let it ride at the standard 70 degree room temp for the remainder. Check gravity after at least 14 days, if not 21 days. If stable 3 days after that then bottle and wait to see how it turned out. Temp control sounds like something you are now set up to do so just wait till next brew for that.
If it was an extract batch then as long as your final volume was as instructed then you hit the OG, there's no way to miss it. If grain then you may have more to look at re: low efficiency.
Edit: I agree on the "yeast cake", I didn't understand what you were referring to. Keep in mind typically ale yeasts bottom ferment meaning they form their cake on bottom while lager yeasts ferment on top and thus form the cake on top. I guess you meant krausen here?

 

[Dirt_McGirt]

That's pretty quick for high krausen, but not unheard of by any means. Sounds like you're fine.

Also seems like you're gonna sucessfully make beer - congrats! Your first attempt sounds better so far than many folks.

 

[kev211]

Sounds pretty normal. On a beer with an O.G. that low 36 hours seems like a good turn around for the krausen to drop (but the yeasties are still working so just let it be). As you will learn on this site, airlock activity (while a good indication of fermentation) is not a definite sign of fermentation. Small leaks can occur and air can escape by other means. And, even after high krausen subsides, the yeast will still be working.

And, a few other things to help you along... As Physics911 pointed out the white foamy stuff on top is krausen, the yeast cake is the layer of yeast that will settle out at the bottom of your carboy.

Also, you said that the FG was low to begin with. FG stands for final gravity, or the gravity after fermentation was completely done. Your OG or SG was the one that was "low".

One last thing to note, theres quite a bit of headspace in that carboy, so I would suggest a slightly larger batch next time to take up that extra space (not completely full though).

Looks like everything went to plan though (more or less) so congrats!

 

[cegan09]

Sorry, meant krausen, not yeast cake. Still getting my terms straight.

Kit was this one from northern brewer
http://www.northernbrewer.com/brewing/recipe-kits/extract-kits/irish-red-ale-extract-kit

they shipped it with the Danstar Nottingham Ale Dry Yeast.


Temp control will be needed for the rest of it's time in the fermenter. My apartment swings a good 15 degrees during the day, not even closets stay level. The beer is still coming back up, will probably take a few hours to get it to ~68 and then i'll set it to hold the fridge at 70.

 

[cegan09]

Sounds pretty normal. On a beer with an O.G. that low 36 hours seems like a good turn around for the krausen to drop (but the yeasties are still working so just let it be). As you will learn on this site, airlock activity (while a good indication of fermentation) is not a definite sign of fermentation. Small leaks can occur and air can escape by other means. And, even after high krausen subsides, the yeast will still be working.

And, a few other things to help you along... As Physics911 pointed out the white foamy stuff on top is krausen, the yeast cake is the layer of yeast that will settle out at the bottom of your carboy.

Also, you said that the FG was low to begin with. FG stands for final gravity, or the gravity after fermentation was completely done. Your OG or SG was the one that was "low".

One last thing to note, theres quite a bit of headspace in that carboy, so I would suggest a slightly larger batch next time to take up that extra space (not completely full though).

Looks like everything went to plan though (more or less) so congrats!

The carboy is a 6.5gallon, it's what northern brewer included as a primary. Plan was to move it to the 5 gallon secondary in a week.

Got me second guessing myself with FG and OG, but I had it right. Listed my OG (1.034) in the first post.

 

[kev211]

Sorry, meant krausen, not yeast cake. Still getting my terms straight.

Kit was this one from northern brewer
http://www.northernbrewer.com/brewing/recipe-kits/extract-kits/irish-red-ale-extract-kit

they shipped it with the Danstar Nottingham Ale Dry Yeast.


Temp control will be needed for the rest of it's time in the fermenter. My apartment swings a good 15 degrees during the day, not even closets stay level. The beer is still coming back up, will probably take a few hours to get it to ~68 and then i'll set it to hold the fridge at 70.

All part of the learning process . Having temp control after only one batch in pus you way ahead of the game IMO

 

[kev211]

The carboy is a 6.5gallon, it's what northern brewer included as a primary. Plan was to move it to the 5 gallon secondary in a week.

Got me second guessing myself with FG and OG, but I had it right. Listed my OG (1.034) in the first post.

This is what threw me "Maybe it's normal since the FG was so low to begin with, but I wanted to run it by some people."

But its all good.

I would skip the secondary. Unless you're planning on aging or racking over fruit, etc. its generally excepted that secondary isnt really necessary and only adds for potential infection. Just a thought

 

[MrVix]

With the exception of messing up the terminologies and brew jargin, you did fine. I'm sure that you made beer. Congratulations. I would wait another week then draw a hydrometer sample...note the gravity...wait 2 more days to take another sample. If there isn't any change in the gravity then bottle it. Brew and learn!!!

 

[cegan09]

This is what threw me "Maybe it's normal since the FG was so low to begin with, but I wanted to run it by some people."

But its all good.

I would skip the secondary. Unless you're planning on aging or racking over fruit, etc. its generally excepted that secondary isnt really necessary and only adds for potential infection. Just a thought

Whomp Whomp. You're right. I'll go fix it, little dyslexia getting the best of me.

 

[kev211]

Whomp Whomp. You're right. I'll go fix it, little dyslexia getting the best of me.

Haha its all good. Just figured you may want to learn all the terminologies

 

[MFWINZLOW]

Yes. That beer is screwed up and should be shipped out to me for immediate disposal in my unique beer disposal process - don'y worry about the fees since it will be your first shipment for disposal.

Never play games with a potentially screwed up beer - ship it someone who can drink...I mean process it in a safe yet environmentally friendly way.

 

[cegan09]

Yes. That beer is screwed up and should be shipped out to me for immediate disposal in my unique beer disposal process - don'y worry about the fees since it will be your first shipment for disposal.

Never play games with a potentially screwed up beer - ship it someone who can drink...I mean process it in a safe way.

lol, well played.

What bike is in your avatar? Obviously a kawi, but 2 stroke? what year? I've got two '75 KZ400s in my garage.

 

[MFWINZLOW]

Off topic:

74 H1 500 Triple...find the bike page here..

Used to have a KZ as well...loved the twin thumper!

Welcome to the abuse...it is usually pretty good natured.

 

[cegan09]

Very cool. Someday I'll get around to finding myself a 2-stroke.

I can take abuse, looks like it's all in good fun.

 

[Horseshoot]

Keep in mind typically ale yeasts bottom ferment meaning they form their cake on bottom while lager yeasts ferment on top and thus form the cake on top. I guess you meant krausen here?

Ummm... No. Ale yeast are top croppers (fermentors) and lager yeasts are bottom fermentors. Pretty basic brewing idea. No offense.


Mike

 

[physics911]

Ummm... No. Ale yeast are top croppers (fermentors) and lager yeasts are bottom fermentors. Pretty basic brewing idea. No offense.


Mike

So how about saying it in a way which doesn't require you to say, "no offense". We all make mistakes.

 

[ballsy]

Ummm... No. Ale yeast are top croppers (fermentors) and lager yeasts are bottom fermentors. Pretty basic brewing idea. No offense.


Mike

You're right, my bust for responding in middle of a work day! OP I got flipped around. Ale yeast ferment on top (hence the Krausen on top) and once Krausen drops, the yeast steadily fall out of suspension to form the yeast cake on the bottom. See, even after 30+ batches one can still screw up their terminology! Hahahaha. Re: "basic brewing idea", it's not an idea but rather a fact. I have strived for three years to make awesome beer and being able to define a top fermenter from a bottom fermenter was not something that affected the taste of my beer and therefore leading to this false assumption which was an oversight on my part. Thanks for clarifying though, I don't like inaccurate info being presented on this forum so glad it was pointed out!

 

[Horseshoot]

You're right, my bust for responding in middle of a work day! OP I got flipped around. Ale yeast ferment on top (hence the Krausen on top) and once Krausen drops, the yeast steadily fall out of suspension to form the yeast cake on the bottom. See, even after 30+ batches one can still screw up their terminology! Hahahaha. Re: "basic brewing idea", it's not an idea but rather a fact. I have strived for three years to make awesome beer and being able to define a top fermenter from a bottom fermenter was not something that affected the taste of my beer and therefore leading to this false assumption which was an oversight on my part. Thanks for clarifying though, I don't like inaccurate info being presented on this forum so glad it was pointed out!

I've been there, and done that, Bub! More times than I can count!! And, as apposed to while working, my odds of doing it goes up, the more home-brew I consume,

And you are correct. It isn't an idea. It is a fact. Thanks for pointing that out.



Mike

 

[Horseshoot]

So how about saying it in a way which doesn't require you to say, "no offense". We all make mistakes.

I only meant to point out the mistake, so the OP wouldn't get confused. The "no offense" was added to show the one I quoted that I meant no offense. Because I truly meant no offense. it is easy to make mistakes, while trying to help others. It is really that simple. But, thank you for pointing out that I may have come across harshly. That was certainly not my intent.



Mike

 

[blackbeer]

skip the secondary and leave it in the primary for 3 weeks in the mid-low 60's. then carefully rack it off the trub and into a bottling bucket, prime it and bottle. unless you have a super high gravity beer that will ferment for months, you really don't need secondary. as a brewer for almost 30 years, this was hard for me to accept, but now thats SOP for me.

 

[cegan09]

My main reason for going to secondary is I want to try my hand at a second beer before the 3 weeks are up. So throwing it in the secondary gives me the primary back for that beer, otherwise I'd be right with you on not moving it.

 

[kev211]

My main reason for going to secondary is I want to try my hand at a second beer before the 3 weeks are up. So throwing it in the secondary gives me the primary back for that beer, otherwise I'd be right with you on not moving it.

Are you "primary" and "secondary" vessels different? Why not just ferment the new beer in the "secondary" vessel.

"3 weeks are up"-A point of debate among the homebrewing community but you really dont need to wait 3 weeks unless you are aging or the beer hasnt finished fermenting yet. Letting it sit after fermentation ends lets stuff fall out of suspension, but doesnt REALLY do a whole lot for your beer other than that. Just a thought

Edit: Just saw our post from earlier in the thread... What size batch were you going to do for your next one? If your other fermenter is 5 gallon you can easily do a 4.5 gal batch

 

[cegan09]

Are you "primary" and "secondary" vessels different? Why not just ferment the new beer in the "secondary" vessel.

"3 weeks are up"-A point of debate among the homebrewing community but you really dont need to wait 3 weeks unless you are aging or the beer hasnt finished fermenting yet. Letting it sit after fermentation ends lets stuff fall out of suspension, but doesnt REALLY do a whole lot for your beer other than that. Just a thought

Edit: Just saw our post from earlier in the thread... What size batch were you going to do for your next one? If your other fermenter is 5 gallon you can easily do a 4.5 gal batch

I have a 6.5 gallon "primary" and a 5 gallon "secondary".

I'm going back and forth on batch size. I want to keep doing 5 gallon batches (which need the larger primary), but if I do all grain BIAB my 8.5 gallon kettle isn't big enough for a 5 gallon batch. So maybe you're right and I'll leave this one be, then do a 3-3.5 gallon BIAB that goes right in the 5 gallon.