First Cyser. What is this going on?

[Caliper]

Ok, so I've made a few ciders that have been decent (mostly still aging, but drinkable for now). So, I decided to try a cyser. Unfortunately, the cider mill I had bought from before is closed from the seson, so I ended up changed more than one variable at once and got something strange...

I took 1 gal cider and added 2.75# pure honey with some Red Star dry wine yeast. OG was measuring about 1.12

Things didn't start fermenting as soon as I have been used to so I double checked the cider and found I had overlooked K-sorbate on the ingredients label... To counteract this, I pitched in more yeast.

At this point, I do have some fermentation taking place, but very slowly (the airlock is burping once every 20 min or so?) But there is a thick, sticky brown "foam" that develops at the top. I have some of the must saved in the fridge and there is nothing settling out of that, so this seems to be a byproduct of the fermentation.






If I give the carboy a strong swirl, this will break up but not really dissolve and I get floating chunks like this:




What the heck is that? I'm thinking about adding some more yeast since I seem to have overcome the K-sorbate but want to know if something is wrong with this batch...

 

[ThatChefGuy]

let it settle then rack to another carboy, it shouldnt be a problem once it has been filtered out.

 

[Mr_fleabite]

I've had ferments that look like this before and nothing has been off.
How does it smell/ taste?

With a lot of K-meta already in there your yeast are struggling and they may start to make off flavors, did you add any DAP before starting?

If your brix is above 8-10 (1.032 sg) you can add DAP to help.

Making a small starter would do more to push it along than adding more dry yeast. Also aerating some during fermentation can help.

 

[Caliper]

let it settle then rack to another carboy, it shouldnt be a problem once it has been filtered out.

By settle, do you mean after primary? The chunks in the second pic return to the top and it goes back to looking like the first pic overnight.

I've had ferments that look like this before and nothing has been off.
How does it smell/ taste?

With a lot of K-meta already in there your yeast are struggling and they may start to make off flavors, did you add any DAP before starting?

If your brix is above 8-10 (1.032 sg) you can add DAP to help.

Making a small starter would do more to push it along than adding more dry yeast. Also aerating some during fermentation can help.

Smell is still good, rather like at the start. Haven't tasted.

I did forget to mention that I added yeast nutrient at the beginning.

I'll pitch in a starter (had started one recently when I noticed the K-sorb) How much fermentation activity should I expect given the amount of honey? It seems I read that honey slows fermentation?

 

[jsiddall]

I had some cider from a local orchard that I suspect was treated with sorbate despite not listing it on the label. It also had a thick sticky krausen and would not ferment. I eventually made a big starter from EC-1118 (a powerful yeast) and it finished fermenting but had plenty of funky flavors. I will let it set for a year before dumping it in case it improves but at 6 months in it is still not good.

Hopefully yours turns out better.

 

[DaMonkey]

What the heck is that? I'm thinking about adding some more yeast since I seem to have overcome the K-sorbate but want to know if something is wrong with this batch...

The foam is normal, I have seen it plenty of times. Some yeast is low foaming so you don't see the foam or the foam gets broken by CO2 quickly. My guess is you are using a yeast that you aren't used to. Or due to the sorbate the yeast isn't creating enough CO2 to break the foam.

The difference between cider and mead is that mead has no nutrients for the yeast so you need to add nutrients. Other then that the fermentation time is roughly the same, the honey certainly doesn't slow the fermentation. With a cyser the cider may contain enough nutrients to compensate for the honey but I would add them anyways especially since you have sorbate in your cider.

 

[Caliper]

Nope, same yeast I've used before and have never gotten much foam. It really doesn't act like foam though. After breaking it up, the chunks float around in the carboy, either settling to the bottom or floating back to the top. They don't seem to dissolve like I'd expect a foam to.

I did add 0.5g of Wyeast brand cider/mead/wine nutrient, just a touch more than called for on the directions.

There are some bubbles coming up now but SG really hasn't moved, maybe 1.11 now. I think I'll muster the patience to leave it alone till the weekend and see how it goes.

 

[Yooper]

Nope, same yeast I've used before and have never gotten much foam. It really doesn't act like foam though. After breaking it up, the chunks float around in the carboy, either settling to the bottom or floating back to the top. They don't seem to dissolve like I'd expect a foam to.

I did add 0.5g of Wyeast brand cider/mead/wine nutrient, just a touch more than called for on the directions.

There are some bubbles coming up now but SG really hasn't moved, maybe 1.11 now. I think I'll muster the patience to leave it alone till the weekend and see how it goes.

It looks like pectin from the cider. When you rack to the next vessel, just leave it behind.

 

[Caliper]

Well, the fermentation seems to be clearing a bit and the whatever it is (pectin?) is settling, mostly. Wow, there is a lot at the bottom... The airlock is burping more often now, so it seems I'm past the K-sorb.

So, it's been in the carboy for a week now and I'm thinking there is a lot of stressed/dead yeast in with everything. Is racking this and pitching some fresh yeast a bad idea? Or are all those floating bits providing nutrient for the yeast?

 

[DaMonkey]

Well, the fermentation seems to be clearing a bit and the whatever it is (pectin?) is settling, mostly. Wow, there is a lot at the bottom... The airlock is burping more often now, so it seems I'm past the K-sorb.

So, it's been in the carboy for a week now and I'm thinking there is a lot of stressed/dead yeast in with everything. Is racking this and pitching some fresh yeast a bad idea? Or are all those floating bits providing nutrient for the yeast?

I have noticed there is kind of a pre-fermentation settlement phase. I wouldn't rack because there is likely sugar at the bottom of the carboy (if you added sugar) and tasty apple bits (if you used unfiltered juice). There is no disadvantage at this point for waiting. Just don't wait longer then a month to rack.

 

[Caliper]

No added sugar (aside from the honey!), juice was unfiltered though.

It has cleared to where I can see light through the fermentation. Has a great color The little chunks make it like a fermenting lava light. Bubbles going up, taking little bits of sediment with them and other bits of sediment falling. Still several minutes between burps from the airlock, but the time seems to be decreasing.

Guess I'll work on my patience and just watch it develop. This is really hard when one doesn't have a stock of nicely aged brews to drink while watching things ferment and age!

 

[abrewnoob]

I did a cranberry and added a yeast nutrient and i got the exact same paste like chunks on the top as in your pic. I dunno if thats the cause but it looked exacly the same. After about 12 days it broke up and started to drop.