First AG BIAB - Bosco IPA

[seehuusen]

Hey fellow brewers

I've been getting into brewing beer quite recently, and after a few kit brews, I tried partial mash. I loved the process and decided I might as well go full blown AG.

This is my first recipe, it started out as a SMaSH, but you know how it goes... haha I restrained myself from making it too complex, maybe I can call it DMaDS

I'm making a 12 litre batch (3.17 US gallon), so if the measures seem a bit odd, that's because I live in Australia and I know the metric system better.
I've added the weight in there for all of my US friends

Bosco IPA
2.5 Kg Cracked Pale Malt (91%) (5.5lbs)
0.25 Kg Cracked Crystal Malt (9%) (.55lbs)

10 g Amarillo @ 60min (0.4 oz)
25 g Amarillo @ 30min (0.9 oz)
24 g Citra @ 5min (0.8 oz)

1 packet US-05 Yeast
1/2 a tablet of whirfloc will go into the boil 15 minutes before flameout.

I put it into the BrewersFriend.com recipe calculator and got the following

Stats
Original Gravity 1.053
Final Gravity 1.013
ABV 5.19%
IBU 52.73
SRM 10.21

I'm very keen to hear thoughts on the recipe. I love American IPA/ Pale Ales, with its smack in the mouth hop flavours.


Cheers
Martin

PS. Bosco is my first born son's nickname

 

[mdabbles]

I love the amarillo hops. good luck.

 

[RM-MN]

I'd do your second addition of Amarillo to 5 minutes or even to flame out to preserve more flavor/aroma and use the Citra for dry hopping when the fermentation is over. I think you'll like the intense aroma you get from dry hopping. I might even use a different hop for bittering (I often use Nugget or Magnum) and save the Amarillo for late in the boil and might even save part of the Amarillo for dry hopping along with the Citra. Can I come have a sample when it's ready?

 

[seehuusen]

Thanks guys
RM-MN, you're more than welcome to drop in for a beer and a barbie mate

My brew day has started, I definitely need a bigger cooler to do the mashing in... The one I'm using is just over 2 gallons, which means I have to do two mashes before I can do any boil... I've halved the grain, so I should end up with similar results (fingers crossed)... It'll take two and a half hours to do the mashing, then onto the rest. Will report back when I'm further down the track haha

Cheers
Martin

 

[RM-MN]

Thanks guys
RM-MN, you're more than welcome to drop in for a beer and a barbie mate

My brew day has started, I definitely need a bigger cooler to do the mashing in... The one I'm using is just over 2 gallons, which means I have to do two mashes before I can do any boil... I've halved the grain, so I should end up with similar results (fingers crossed)... It'll take two and a half hours to do the mashing, then onto the rest. Will report back when I'm further down the track haha

Cheers
Martin

It's a little late for this batch but if your boil pot is big enough you can use the BIAB method and mash right in the pot. No need for a bigger cooler, no cooler to clean afterward either. For a 12 liter batch you would need at least a 22 liter pot and 30 would be better as you wouldn't have to watch it so closely at hot break to avoid a boil over.

 

[seehuusen]

Brew day is over, and it all went well until I made a poor decision... I may end up with a light beer because of it...

So I ended up with 2.4 gallons after the boil, starting out with 3.4. All good, but somehow I thought I needed to add water to the originally intended amount, which was 3.2 gallons... Well OG is now 1030... Bummer... I may add some light dry malt to it, what do you guys recommend? Flavour is nice for a first go next batch won't be diluted silly newb mistake haha

 

[RM-MN]

Wait! You were planning for a 12 liter batch and ended up with about 10 liters of beer with an OG of 1.030? That isn't from dilution, that's from not extracting enough sugars from your grains which usually means that the crush wasn't very good. Don't take the blame for someone else's error. If you plan to continue doing all grain batches you might want to look at getting your own mill so you can control that variable.

I use a Corona style mill and since I BIAB I can work with my grains milled very fine. With that amount of grain I would expect to have an OG of about 1.070, not the 1.053 that was predicted nor the 1.030 you measured. Those kind of mills aren't as easy to work with when you use a conventional tun because they crack or grind the grains rather than just crushing which can cause you problems when you go to empty the tun but with BIAB they work out great.

I'm sorry, but it is too early for me to do the math but you need to add enough malt extract to raise you OG by 20 points. I know that there is a formula for it but I don't remember just how to find it.

 

[seehuusen]

I had 13 liters pre-boil. Ended up with about 9.5 post boil. Then I added it and 2.5 liters of water to the fermenter... I took the OG just before pitching the yeast.

I think I'm to blame for the low OG... Though the grain crush perspective is an angle I never thought of! I will have to look into a mill.
I bought two batches of grain, so I may have another go in a week or so...

So you reckon ldm is ok?
If you find the formula, please let me know - Found the formula below

Cheers mate!

EDIT:
I've tried to do some calculations. If I got x amount of sugars out of the grains, it doesn't matter if there's 10L of water or 12L of water, it's still x amount of sugar. Obviously, with less water the OG reading is going to be higher.

I entered these numbers into BrewMate, and by lowering the efficiency, and using 12L as the batch size, it does seem that I may only have had 44% efficiency from my grains.
You could very well be right that the grains weren't milled very well.

EDIT 2: A bit more research would suggest that I should do 90minutes of mashing, not 60. So that could be a contributing factor too

 

[seehuusen]

http://www.brewgeeks.com/calculate-stuff.html

Does that sound right?
If so its 1kg, or 2.2lbs

Original og is 1030
Desired og is 1060

((60*3.2)-(30*3.2))/44

Do I just throw it straight into the fermenter or do I need to do something else before adding it?
I Read some threads on this, and it appears I just dilute in minimal amount of water and add to the fermenter, does that sound right?

Appreciate your assistance

 

[seehuusen]

Hey guys,

So I added 1Kg of DME to the fermenter with minimal use of water. Damn it took a while to get it all dissolved, but I got there in the end.
Of course, I sterilized all the bits I needed to use first, then added it at 20 Celsius to the ferment.

I just did a gravity check, my o my! This is going to be a nice little drop! Lychee flavours are coming through already in the test I took, the next batch is going to be even better I hope (without having to add the dme)

If an admin could move this thread to the all grain section and change the title to not be BIAB, but AG, that'd be great...
I've figured out (in my inexperience) that what I'm doing isn't really BIAB, but more a 2 vessel brew, using a BIAB bag, rather than a false bottom... I'll probably just look into building that up to a proper 2 vessel setup, then add the HLT soon after

Thanks for the help and advise I've been getting so far, I'll report back when I get a better taste of the beer

Cheers
Martin

 

[seehuusen]

I bottled my beer two days ago, and obviously had a taste of the fine nectar It's definitely the best beer I've brewed to date!

I'm getting ready for my next brew session, but wanted to ask a couple if questions.

I've been reading up on the mashing process to get a better efficiency.
What percentage of water is used for mash in? I need about 11.25l for the strike and 6l for the sparge.
Is there any major advantage of doing a mash-in?

I'm trying no- chill, which obviously would include to sterilize the cube. Can I be a cheap-skate, and reuse the sanitizer in the fermenter and leave it there for a day or two? How long could I leave it for?
Only reason I ask is I'm running low on no-rinse...

Thanks in advance,
Marti

 

[RM-MN]

I bottled my beer two days ago, and obviously had a taste of the fine nectar It's definitely the best beer I've brewed to date!

I'm getting ready for my next brew session, but wanted to ask a couple if questions.

I've been reading up on the mashing process to get a better efficiency.
What percentage of water is used for mash in? I need about 11.25l for the strike and 6l for the sparge.
Is there any major advantage of doing a mash-in?

I'm trying no- chill, which obviously would include to sterilize the cube. Can I be a cheap-skate, and reuse the sanitizer in the fermenter and leave it there for a day or two? How long could I leave it for?
Only reason I ask is I'm running low on no-rinse...

Thanks in advance,
Marti

Of course you have to do a mash in. That's when you add the water to the grains. Dry grains won't convert or make beer.

I think you really meant mash out where you add heat to the grain bed to bring its temperature to about 170. It won't hurt but it probably won't help much either.

There isn't a set amount of water to mash in. There are some loose guidelines though. It's hard to mix if you don't have enough water. Sorry for the Americanized English measurements but you need a minimum of about 1 qt. per pound of grain and a maximum of the total amount of water for your brew which probably comes out to about 2.3 to 2.5 qts per pound. The first would leave you with a large amount to sparge with but can leave dry "dough balls" if you don't stir very well. The last would leave you with almost nothing to sparge with so it would be a no-sparge brew. You want somewhere in the middle, like 1.2 to 1.5 qts per pound, thin enough to stir but enough left to sparge with.

How long do you intend to leave your wort in the cube? Overnight, you can leave it in the pot you boiled it in with the lid on or you could dump it right into an HDPE plastic bucket and put the lid on. If you intend to store it longer then you need to read a bunch about no chill, more than I can help you with.

 

[RM-MN]

A bit more research would suggest that I should do 90minutes of mashing, not 60. So that could be a contributing factor too

In my mind mashing for 90 minutes is simply a way of coping with a very poor crush. I get full conversion with a 10 minute mash. If you aren't getting full conversion in an hour, find another LHBS or get your own mill because that crush is poor.

 

[seehuusen]

Thanks for your explanation mate, really appreciated!

haha, I may have gotten the terminology wrong re: mash in

What I meant was, I've read about people mashing in 3 steps:

1. Add ?? amount of water, at 130F
2. Add remainder of pitch water at 150F (in my case, a total of ~12 quarts)
3. Remove the hot liquor and sparge with x amount of water (in my case ~6 quarts)

Quarts and litres are pretty much the same, and I've got google to assist with Fahrenheit Appreciate your help very much

The wort in the cube should only be overnight - 24 hours... What I was more concerned about was the time I could leave the sanitizer in the fermenter? (I'll pick up a bottle today anyway, just curious)

In my mind mashing for 90 minutes is simply a way of coping with a very poor crush. I get full conversion with a 10 minute mash. If you aren't getting full conversion in an hour, find another LHBS or get your own mill because that crush is poor.

The more I think about it, I suspect this being the case! It's quite possible that the grain was milled poorly and even might have been old to be honest... I only have 8.3lbs left anyway, so I'll use it for this session.
I'm going to check out another LHBS after work today (it's on my way home from the city, where I work once a week, so no biggie )

Cheers
Martin

 

[RM-MN]

You didn't mention what sanitizer you were using and I didn't see what kind of fermenter so I was hesitant to say anything. Something like Starsan in a carboy, indefinite. Other sanitizers might vary, I just can't be sure.

Since you are mashing in a bag, you can use grains that are milled very fine. You could ask to have the grains double milled (run through the mill twice) or you could get a mill of your own. I don't know how available these mills are "down under" but mills like this one are pretty cheap and work well with the BIAB system. http://www.discounttommy.com/p-189-...er-for-wheat-grains-or-use-as-a-nut-mill.aspx Amazon list them too and sometimes their price is pretty good too.

 

[seehuusen]

Thanks once again I'd have to double check, starsan could be it. It's a no rinse type product...
It's a food grade plastic polymer type fermenter, specifically designed for the purpose

Wow, those grinders are about au$90 down here!!

 

[seehuusen]

I just finished a brew with the remaining grain from the previous LHBS, my efficiency problem has got to be his grain
With a 90 minute mash + 10 minute batch sparge, I got an efficiency of about 51%

Some of my notes from the brew day:
12.1 quarts of strike water @ 160F
After stirring and putting the lid on the cooler, 152F
Swirl & stir at 65min left - temp @ 150F

After 90 minutes, I poured the mash into my boil pot, and took the gravity. It was 1049 @ 89.6F = 1052 corrected for 68F
Added 6.3 quarts of sparge at 167F. Let that sit for 10 minutes and took a gravity of everything combined.
It came up at 1034 @ 88.7F = 1037 corrected for 68F

My total pre-boil volume was 15.3 quarts

After 60 minutes of boil, I got 12.7 quarts of wort.
I was a bit keen to see what was going on with my efficiency, so I will double check it again tomorrow.
I measured it to 1042 @ 113F = 1049 corrected for 68F

Recipe was intended to account to dilute with 2 quarts of water... but at this stage, that's not going to happen...

I'm keen to hear if anything regarding my method used, needs to change?
I did the following:

1. Heat the required strike water to the BrewMate suggested temperature (on the stove)
2. Poured that into my cooler/mashtun (5 gallon)
3. put a large BIAB bag into the mashtun
4. Added all the grain and stirred that well
5. Put the lid on and let it sit for 30 minutes, where I just swirled the whole cooler around on the the table.
6. I did that every 30 minutes.
7. After 90 minutes, I hoisted the bag up and out of the wort. I did let it drip into the bottom of the mashtun while I poured the wort
8. I then poured all the wort out of the mash tun into my boiling pot
9. Added the calculated (by BrewMate) sparge water and added the entire amount to the mash tun and stirred that well. Lid back on.
10. Let it sit for 10 minutes and hoisted the bag out of the sparge
11. Poured all of the sparge water into my boiling pot
12. Added heat to the pot and got it to a rolling boil.
13. Added 60, 30 and 5 minute hops when required (as well as whirfloc at 15 minutes)
14. Took it off the heat and it's now cooling (no chill)

Keen to hear if it is me, or if these grains I've bought are just ridiculously terrible

Cheers
Martin

PS. I bought another batch of grain from the LHBS in Brisbane, these grains will definitely not be bad! Looking forward to giving them a bash and see what efficiency I can hit then...

 

[seehuusen]

Hey fellow brewers

The OG I measured this morning was 1050, but the wort only measured in at just under 2.9 gallons, bringing my efficiency further down by the looks of things 46%, according to BrewMate. I got 44% with the same grain on my first batch.

I also conclude that although no-chill is a water saving thing, I'm not convinced I like it 100%
Next time I try it out, I'll be sure to use much less hops during the boil, probably only bittering hops. Then at second fermentation, dry hop with all the hops that I would normally use during the boil when I chill the wort.

I'm really enjoying this hobby. It's technical, yet not hard. It's by-product is generally delicious and I learn new things all the time
I can't wait to try the other grains from the other LHBS and hopefully prove to myself that I'm mashing correctly...

Anyone with comments on the above procedure, please post them here, I'm keen to know if I'm on the right path or not

Cheers
Martin

 

[seehuusen]

I'm brewing again today, this time using grain from the Brisbane HBS, who's grain is guaranteed fresh (judging by how much they go through a month).

I've adjusted my recipe to use a bit less hops during the boil, and then dry hop it once in the second fermenter.
I'm using Magnum this time as a bittering hops. The flavour of what I brewed yesterday is quite bitter, with most of the floral/ fruity flavour lost... Will be an interesting beer once bottled and stored for a little bit.

I'll report back once my brew day is over

 

[seehuusen]

Brew day is over, I've cleaned up and just waiting on the wort to cool down slightly before I put it into the cube.

I did an 80 minute @ 149F mash (because I got distracted) with a 15 minute @ 172F sparge (slightly higher than I wanted, the grain retained more heat than I anticipated within the cooler mashtun)
In total, I got 4 gallons of wort preboil, with a gravity of 1.060. After an hours boil, I had 3 gallons @ 1.074

According to BrewMate, that's a 70% efficiency FINALLY!
So happy that my method was right, though disappointed that the closest HBS doesn't have good enough grain to brew AG with...

This attempt was:

87.5% Maris Otter Pale Malt
12.5% Crystal 60 (I do think this is a bit too much, but I just wanted to get rid of all the grain from the old HBS)

60 min boil
20% Magnum @ 45min
30% Magnum @ 20min
Whirfloc @ 15min

50% Citra @ second fermentation

Will let you know how this one goes, still trying to figure out the best way to achieve my Bosco IPA recipe, enjoying coming up with my own
BTW, Bosco my new born son's nick name, so want to do the recipe justice.

I purchased a 5 gallon Stainless pot at the shop this morning (Boil pot), that together with the 4 gallon pot (HLT) and my 19L cooler mashtun makes it a 3 vessel I guess
I ran the boil on a camping stove this time, because I could get it running on two burners. I wanted to try it out, as it could potentially form part of my setup...
It wasn't quite powerful enough, I had to run it on max during the entire boil. I'll get a more powerful one instead and build a stand for all of it now I think!
This hobby is too addictive

cheers
Martin

 

[RM-MN]

Thanks once again I'd have to double check, starsan could be it. It's a no rinse type product...
It's a food grade plastic polymer type fermenter, specifically designed for the purpose

Wow, those grinders are about au$90 down here!!

Keep looking. I'm sure the Chinese have discovered the Australian market and have them cheaper somewhere near you. Discount Tommy can't be their only market.