Experimenting with what I got.

[Fox]

Hey guys, I've been brewing for about 6-7 months now and I'm now getting around to experimenting with my beer now and I have a few questions I need a little bit of help with.

A little background first...
I've got a Coopers Brewing kit so I'm pretty limited as to how I have to brew(mainly stuck using pre-hopped no boil kits) so don't shoot me for what I'm using for now as I plan on upgrading to a much better much more versatile kit sometime this fall.

Anyway I'm trying to make an Orange Blossom Honey Pilsner and I'm stuck a few things.

1)Using Honey...
How exactly do I need to prepare this honey before I use it in my brew, most of my google searching turns up that I need to pasteurize my honey to help reduce the amount bacteria and what not that may be residing in it. I understand that I need to heat the honey to 176 degrees and keep it in the oven for two and half hours at same temperature.

My problem with this exactly is how am I supposed to keep the oven at 176 degrees as well as my oven only adjusts by five degrees at a time, so could I just set the oven to 175 or 180 and be fine or will this some how ruin the honey?

Also from the same searching it says dilute the honey to match my wort's gravity, why can't I just add it directly to the wort to add to the gravity?

2)How much of what...
First of all I want the brew to be about 12% ABV and I want to use 30% honey, 35% DME, and 35% corn sugar in this batch but I don't know how much of that I need.

The yeast I plan on using has a attenution between 70 and 75% and the brewing kit can brew about 6 gallons. I don't know how much of the honey is fermentable so I'm a little lost and can't even seem to explain it the way I want. Perhaps someone can ask the right question here...

3) Perils of using no-boil kits...
As I said before I'm using a Coopers Brewing Kit and I don't have a whole lot of versatility in this area so basically I don't want to overwhelm the taste of the Pilsner with the honey I plan on using. I guess it's another question of which kit no-boil kit would be better to be used in this and how much should I be using.

Kit options I can get a hold of...
-Coopers Pilsner
-Muntons Connoisseurs Range Pilsner
-Muntons Connoisseurs Range Export Pilsner
-Muntons Premium Pilsner
-Muntons Continental Pilsner
-Edme Classic Pilsner

Normally would would only need 1 can of each unless directions explain otherwise, but In this case would 1 can still be enough or would I need more because of the honey?

Anyway thanks for your time for reading this.

Quick Edit:
Forgot to mention I plan on using White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale yeast.

 

[devilishprune]

If you're going to be brewing such a large beer you will definitely need a blowoff tube, first of all.

As for pasteurizing the honey, I would just set it at 175 and let it go. Your oven doesn't maintain a constant temperature anyway; it ramps up and cools down to maintain 175 as an average temp, so you should be okay with that. I would just add the honey to your wort and measure the gravity to see if it's around what you want. Be warned though, honey can be pretty overpowering in beer, especially with a light beer like a pilsner. You might want to cut it back to like 10-15% instead and maybe up the DME if you have more.

As for the fermentability of honey, I have read on these forums anywhere from 75-100%, so take that into account also.

As for the kits, I'm not too sure. I would suggest using 1 kit and the rest of the ingredients you specified. It seems like, since these are prehopped, that if you added 2 of them, you would get double the bitterness that you were expecting.

 

[bja]

First of all I want the brew to be about 12% ABV and I want to use 30% honey, 35% DME, and 35% corn sugar in this batch

Forgot to mention I plan on using White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale yeast.

I'm imagining this tasting quite horrible, probably undrinkable.

 

[bootney]

I just brewed up a IIPA that called for 12# of Pilsner Extract and I added 1.5# of orange blossom and plan to transfer to 5 gallon carboy for clearing this Sunday. I checked the gravity and and tasted the sample and I will say the honey flavor was very noticeable. I would suggest backing off on your honey amount as your currently recipe may not taste to good. I'd suggest using your basic recipe and add 0.5-1.0# of honey.

I added my honey to the wort at the end of boil and steeped for 5 minutes. I know you don't have that option but for future reference.

 

[DavidHawman]

Walmart has a 32 quart stainless kettle for ~$35 last time I checked. Get one of those and you can start doing actual boils with LME and DME. I've boiled 4 gallons in it without a problem.

 

[Fox]

If you're going to be brewing such a large beer you will definitely need a blowoff tube, first of all.

As for pasteurizing the honey, I would just set it at 175 and let it go. Your oven doesn't maintain a constant temperature anyway; it ramps up and cools down to maintain 175 as an average temp, so you should be okay with that. I would just add the honey to your wort and measure the gravity to see if it's around what you want. Be warned though, honey can be pretty overpowering in beer, especially with a light beer like a pilsner. You might want to cut it back to like 10-15% instead and maybe up the DME if you have more.

As for the fermentability of honey, I have read on these forums anywhere from 75-100%, so take that into account also.

As for the kits, I'm not too sure. I would suggest using 1 kit and the rest of the ingredients you specified. It seems like, since these are prehopped, that if you added 2 of them, you would get double the bitterness that you were expecting.

I just brewed up a IIPA that called for 12# of Pilsner Extract and I added 1.5# of orange blossom and plan to transfer to 5 gallon carboy for clearing this Sunday. I checked the gravity and and tasted the sample and I will say the honey flavor was very noticeable. I would suggest backing off on your honey amount as your currently recipe may not taste to good. I'd suggest using your basic recipe and add 0.5-1.0# of honey.

I added my honey to the wort at the end of boil and steeped for 5 minutes. I know you don't have that option but for future reference.

Thanks guys for your advice. I'll cut back on the honey so it'll be about 10%.

Anyway for the curious I think this is pretty much what I think I'm going to go with...

1 Can of Muntons Gold Continental Pilsner
White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale Yeast
1 oz to 2 oz of Sweet Orange Peel
1.5# of Orange Blossom Honey
2 oz of Maltodextrin
10# Briess DME
3.5# Corn Sugar

 

[devilishprune]

Thanks guys for your advice. I'll cut back on the honey so it'll be about 10%.

Anyway for the curious I think this is pretty much what I think I'm going to go with...

1 Can of Muntons Gold Continental Pilsner
White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale Yeast
1 oz to 2 oz of Sweet Orange Peel
1.5# of Orange Blossom Honey
2 oz of Maltodextrin
10# Briess DME
3.5# Corn Sugar

When I input this recipe into beersmith (if you don't have beersmith I would highly recommend checking out the free trial), I got an OG of 1.157 and an estimated FG of 1.039. It also output the ABV to be 15.66%.

Obviously this is extremely high since you said that you wanted about 12 ABV, so if you were to do anything to your recipe I would remove the corn sugar, which gets you an ABV of about 12.17% instead. It also lowers the FG to 1.031 so it will be a little less sweet. From what I have learned about corn sugar using that much might make it taste pretty cidery.

If nothing else, you are going to have some seriously strong brew there.

 

[bootney]

I got an OG of 1.157 and an estimated FG of 1.039. It also output the ABV to be 15.66%.

if you were to do anything to your recipe I would remove the corn sugar

I agree with Devil, and I got 1.129 with just using honey, DME, and sugar as fermentable. Is the Muntons 4#? I'd kick the corn sugar down or completely out of that recipe but that's just my taste. Make sure you use a yeast pitch calculator to see how much you need. You're at roughly 30 degrees Plato with just DME, honey, and corn sugar, and need 24 grams of dry yeast for this batch.

In my opinion I'd primary this for 3 weeks, and clear in secondary for a couple of months with this high an ABV. Make sure you have steady temps within the yeast fermentation temp range.

 

[Fox]

When I input this recipe into beersmith (if you don't have beersmith I would highly recommend checking out the free trial), I got an OG of 1.157 and an estimated FG of 1.039. It also output the ABV to be 15.66%.

Obviously this is extremely high since you said that you wanted about 12 ABV, so if you were to do anything to your recipe I would remove the corn sugar, which gets you an ABV of about 12.17% instead. It also lowers the FG to 1.031 so it will be a little less sweet. From what I have learned about corn sugar using that much might make it taste pretty cidery.

If nothing else, you are going to have some seriously strong brew there.

Hmmm...

I used this thing...
http://www.brewersfriend.com/extract-ogfg/

I have to use at least 1# of corn sugar as I already have it.

I agree with Devil, and I got 1.129 with just using honey, DME, and sugar as fermentable. Is the Muntons 4#? I'd kick the corn sugar down or completely out of that recipe but that's just my taste. Make sure you use a yeast pitch calculator to see how much you need. You're at roughly 30 degrees Plato with just DME, honey, and corn sugar, and need 24 grams of dry yeast for this batch.

In my opinion I'd primary this for 3 weeks, and clear in secondary for a couple of months with this high an ABV. Make sure you have steady temps within the yeast fermentation temp range.

The Muntons kit comes with 2x 3.3# cans which makes 6 gallons.
You can see it here...
http://www.highgravitybrew.com/productcart/pc/Muntons-Continental-Pilsner-192p744.htm

Temps are around 22C.

 

[TD1001]

how did this turn out i am very curious! i hope this batch didn't turn you right off of the hobby.