Estimating OG

[Mikeman]

So on Feb 18, I mixed up a cyser using

4.5 gal hippie market unfiltered, pasteurized apple juice
13# local raw honey
a couple oranges
a few handfuls of raisins

I had a starter of some washed sweet mead yeast going, but it never took off. Because of that, I got one going with some Nottingham I had sitting around and pitched about 24 hrs later. I knew this wasn't the ideal yeast, but it is what I had. I was going out of town for a while and I needed to get this bubbling. I won't get into the gory details, but I ended up not getting a gravity reading of my must.

I put it in the fermentation chamber, and turned it down to 60 deg. I was hoping low and slow might help my poor ale yeast work thru the must. I measured out some nutrient and energizer, and instructed the misses to add it 3 and 5 days later. I don't have a refractometer, so I figured the timing of nutrients would be close enough.

Week before last, I made it out to the LHBS. I told them what I had done, and we agreed to pitch some wine yeast in there to help it finish. I came home with some 1118 and D47. I was planning on using the D47. March 18, the airlock was still going. I pulled a sample to get a gravity and see where I was at. 1.054. With gravity that low, and continued airlock activity I just topped it off with a little bit more juice and nutrient, and let it ride.

I did take a gravity of some of the left over apple juice, and by itself that is 1.060. Beersmith's OG for 5 gal water and 13# of honey is 1.090. I haven't found a calculator to estimate gravity using anything but water, but it should be valid to take 1.060*1.090 = 1.155 as my starting gravity, correct?

If that is the case, then 2 weeks ago I hit just over 13% ABV using Nottingham yeast. Does this sound possible?

 

[ACbrewer]

Nottingham is beer yeast right? Problem is that the yeast companies describe Attenuation with beer yeast and Tollerance with Wine (since those are the most commonly needed aspects of the relative yeast)... but they don't tell you the tollerance of Beer yeast or Attenuation of wine.

As for your apple juice, I have found and others who've tested theirs that juice runs between 1.040 and 1.050, not 1.060, although with some oranges, I can see another point or 2 in 5 gallons. You basically add the numbers so if 1.090 and 1.040 your OG shoudl have been in the 1.130 range. If you have the juice nutrition info (common if commercial/not bought at orchard) you can find the sugar countent and work it from there. Anyhow if my number of 1.130 is right, then your abv is in the 10% range, not 13%.

 

[Mikeman]

Nottingham is beer yeast, and its alcohol tolerance is not very well advertised.

I can't wrap my head around why you would add the SGs rather than multiply, but on this scale I guess it doesn't really matter. Provided I ignore the 1 to the left of the decimal

1.090*1.040= 1.133
1.090+0.040= 1.130

10% is still pretty good for an ale yeast chewing on honey.

I don't know what to tell you about the juice SG, I measured it.

If I do end up pitching a wine yeast to help this finish, is there any trick to it? Just mix up a starter and let 'er rip?

 

[ACbrewer]

Really you had some similar juice to measure the SG of? cool, that is best.

Ok, now for the math lesson.

OG =1+sugar points/1000
Sugar points = total sugar points / must size (must = wine, wort=beer)

sugar points per pound gallon of honey is about 35 pppg meaning if you put 1 pound in 1 gallon of must you will have an og of 35. I'll do the work below to show you where this is going almost forgot that you had beersmith figure your OG in water for you.

In your case you said beer smith said 1.090 for 5 gallons with your 13# honey - this means it has 450 points of sugar. you said your juice is 1.060 (measured) so with 4.5 gallons you have 4.5*60= 270 points.

Total known points is 720 points. Amount from oranges is unknown, and while probably close to 40 points/gallon, a 'couple of oranges' is probably like 16 oz or less of juice, dito with the raisons.

thus 720/5.5 = 130.9 or about 131. (13lb of honey is about 1 gallon+ the 4.5 gallons of juice)

REason I added the .09 and .04 is simple. if the juice making most of teh volume is .04 and the calculated for water is .09 I just added them .130 But the above method is basically what beersmith is doing under the hood.

Oh if the beersmith has 5.5 as the start volume, then the OG goes up to 1.139 because there is another .5 gallon of 1.090 that I don't have in that 450. (it goes up to 495).

 

[Mikeman]

It looks like you may have had this conversation a time or 2 before. I was all prepared to pull out Palmers when I got home. Thanks for laying that out for me. I see it now.

And yeah, there was nowhere near 16oz of juice in the oranges I added.

 

[huesmann]

I estimate your OG at 1.122 or thereabouts.

 

[ACbrewer]

It looks like you may have had this conversation a time or 2 before. I was all prepared to pull out Palmers when I got home. Thanks for laying that out for me. I see it now.

And yeah, there was nowhere near 16oz of juice in the oranges I added.

I think you could use beer smith, just create a custom malt 'hippie juice' and list it's PPPG as '60' and then put in the number of gallons you use instead of 'pounds'. I ment to try this last night, but forgot.