Espresso brewers, roasters, lovers...

[nostalgia]

Everytime I read about home roasting and expresso my wallet really begins to burn a hole in my pocket! Someday I really want to get into this.

Home roasting is easy to get into cheaply. Some folks use a stainless dog food bowl and a heat gun. Others use a $20 air popcorn popper. Green beans are $4/lb for most varieties, and you can very easily roast coffee that tastes better than $20/lb pre-roasted.

As for espresso, you really can't skimp on a grinder, so expect $250 and up there. However, you've got a ton of options for machines.

I have actually heard a ton of good things about the Aeropress. Seems crazy, but I hear it works surprisingly well. Amazon has it for $26, free shipping.

-Joe

 

[Bopper]

Home roasting is easy to get into cheaply. Some folks use a stainless dog food bowl and a heat gun. Others use a $20 air popcorn popper. Green beans are $4/lb for most varieties, and you can very easily roast coffee that tastes better than $20/lb pre-roasted.

As for espresso, you really can't skimp on a grinder, so expect $250 and up there. However, you've got a ton of options for machines.

I have actually heard a ton of good things about the Aeropress. Seems crazy, but I hear it works surprisingly well. Amazon has it for $26, free shipping.

-Joe

Thanks for the advice. I definitely want to get into this hobby eventually. I love quality coffee and the DIY aspect of home roasting is very appealing to me.

 

[dontman]

Joe, Back when I bought my Silvia I was really on the fence with the beautiful Quickmill machines. I had the Anita in my shopping cart a half dozen times with my finger hovering over the checkout button. I remember it being $999 from Chris Coffee. Now it is $1450! Am I misremembering?

If so this is a prime example of the value appreciation to which I was referring.

For me the decision between HX and single boiler came down to the number of shots pulled on any occasion. For the most part I pull two shots per day. I do not serve individual espressos at my dinner parties because of the time involved.

As far as green coffee offerings; I just purchased my December supply and in that I have a couple bags of the same Nicaragua Limoncello DP that Tom at SM has. I know it is the same because we got it from the same crop. Stunning coffee. I rate this as one of my top three offerings this year. The other two were over $20/pound wholesale. If you like fruit bomb coffees (think Ethiopia Harar or Yemen) you will love this coffee.

Tom also has Panama Las Flores. Another great WP panama. This one is undervalued in my opinion as I getting used to having to pay huge prices for COE Panamas.

Both of these will take FC nicely which is good for espresso although the Limoncello is a tad bright for espresso.

EDIT: I am not a fan of the Aeropress. I sold it to customers for a while until I had two customers who had accidents with them which left them injured. The bottom plastic piece popped off during the full press which caused a virtual explosion of hot coffee and on one occasion, glass from the broken mug.

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

I know it is like buying a Sabco, and I may be considered a loser in coffee nerd circles (maybe not???), but I LOVE my Jura.

http://www.capresso.com/automatic-coffee-centers-z5.shtml

I don't know how great my coffee tastes are, but I know what tastes good and bad and am picky about my espresso. I love the shots I make with this machine. It is also nice to have a mindless cappuccino made for me int he morning. It may not be for fiddlers, and it is pricey, but it is the best thing in my kitchen. I got it for like 75% of at Williams Sonoma...

 

[nostalgia]

You know what comes next once you get your shot down pat, right? Latte art! No one can resist trying...

-Joe

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

That is pretty awesome... any how to's or pointers for someone who has never done it?

Can I do that with my espresso crema?

It looks like you have added just a bit of carefully placed frothed milk on top of a latte, then shaped it by pulling with a knife or similar??? right track?

EDIT:

http://www.wikihow.com/Make-Latte-Art

 

[motobrewer]

nope, that's all done while pouring. just like the Guinness lucky charm pour

 

[dontman]

I've got cherries and hearts down on my pours. That's as far as I've ever tried to go.

 

[The Pol]

Okay, so I am sipping some espresso...

I do need a finer grind, I know this. I head "read" that if your grinder is not capable of stopping up your machine, then it isnt capable of grinding fine enough.

I am getting a consistent 2oz double shot in 20 seconds, Id love to extend that to 30 seconds, as I have pretty noticeable blonding at 20 seconds.

Anyhow... I took some of my new calibratable thermometers and did some testing. My water temperature at the filter basket is about 198F, so from what I have "read" that is good. Not adjustable like a sweet PID machine but good.

Am I really crazy for wanting to spend the dough on a Rancilio? Also... is it really worth paying $500 for a Silvia? I mean it is not a LOW end machine, but not HIGH end either, I wonder what I may gain?

 

[The Pol]

I saw your video Nostalgia.... that is pretty sweet. I would love to learn to do something artisitc.

So... do you guys drink your espresso shots STRAIGHT much?

 

[The Pol]

Also... Nostalgia... on your video I noticed that your filter basket is much different than mine.

Mine I guess is called a "pressure filter" where it has one tiny hole for an outlet. Apparently this helps to produce foam, so my crema, may not be crema at all!

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

I drink milk/espresso drinks in the morning, and shots after. I like a twist of lemon zest sometimes in the shot, too.

 

[The Pol]

I drink milk/espresso drinks in the morning, and shots after. I like a twist of lemon zest sometimes in the shot, too.

Your machine is crazy, and worth 3x as much as my car.

 

[nostalgia]

So... do you guys drink your espresso shots STRAIGHT much?

Generally I drink black Americanos (long black for the Aussies in the house ), adding 4-6oz of water from the boiler to my shot. If I'm drinking in the evening or tasting coffees for the first time, I'll do a straight up espresso shot.

Honestly if I were in your position, Pol, I'd upgrade the grinder and just use your machine for a while. If I found I was running out of steam (literally) when doing milk drinks or unhappy with your results, only then would I consider upgrading. If you feel you're getting inconsistent results when you do the same thing, for example, it could be the machine can't give you consistent pressure or temp pour after pour. But you can't know that without pulling oodles of delicious shots

-Joe

 

[nostalgia]

Mine I guess is called a "pressure filter" where it has one tiny hole for an outlet. Apparently this helps to produce foam, so my crema, may not be crema at all!

Ah! If you have a pressurized portafilter, that's another animal entirely. It's got a crema disc that actually whips air into the shot to make crema - like a sparkler on a beer engine.

Not considered the best mojo for getting a great shot, and will definitely mask a bad one.

-Joe

 

[dontman]

Also... Nostalgia... on your video I noticed that your filter basket is much different than mine.

Mine I guess is called a "pressure filter" where it has one tiny hole for an outlet. Apparently this helps to produce foam, so my crema, may not be crema at all!

Aw man Pol, this way lies madness. The only people crazier than Espresso Brewers are AG Brewers. Oh, too late.

One thing about those pressure filters. When using those it is not really appropriate to use the same judging criteria as with a non-pressure filter. Fact is they extend the length of the shot exponentially because they provide artificial resistance to the pump. So you don't know whether it is the grind, the portafilter, or what combo of the two that you are seeing.

As far as your question about the Silvia. Without doubt if your budget allows for it the Silvia is well worth the cash. The only thing low end about it is the price. It has a big boiler and an E61 group. It is a home workhorse. There are prettier units out there, there are higher end units out there but as far as shot quality it is excellent.

I have (well had, I sold it recently when I closed the office) a $5K GS3 at my office that I use for tasting and . . . well nevermind, it is not fair to compare the two, but I still love my Silvia.

I've also used a Gaggia Classic with excellent results.

Oh, plus 1 for Americanos for casual coffee drinking and straight shots for evaluating crops and roast levels.

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

Your machine is crazy, and worth 3x as much as my car.

Haha. Yeah, Danika and I sold our road bikes because we never used them anymore and promised to buy something fun with the proceeds. We both love coffee so this was it.

 

[nostalgia]

That Jura looks pretty badass. I don't think anyone's going to look down on you for it

That is pretty awesome... any how to's or pointers for someone who has never done it?

Can I do that with my espresso crema?

You should be able to. I'm far from an expert, but here's what I've learned so far:

- I don't like using a thermometer. It invariably doesn't react fast enough, plus different milks will need different amounts of stretching. What's stretching? Whipping air into the milk to make it fluffier.

- You want smooth microfoam. You do not want big soap bubbles, you do not want hard Starbucks-esque foam.

- Start by stretching the cold milk. Put the tip of the wand just below the surface and open the steam valve all the way. Now lower the pitcher to "surf" the tip of the wand on the milk. This part takes the second most practice. You want it to barely break the surface so you hear ch-ch-ch-ch-ch, not one long SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, which will make big fat soap bubbles.

- When you've stretched enough (I shoot for about 20-25% expansion of the milk), you submerge the wand to make a whirlpool, to whip the unfoamed milk in with the foamed and create a smooth mix.

- I stop just after the outside of the pitcher is hot enough to burn my fingers.

- Pouring takes the most practice. You want a smooth pour. The milk should start drawing on the crema when the tip of the pitcher is almost touching the crema. You want it to almost slide out onto the surface of the crema.

- Different milks will steam and pour differently. I've had the best success with 2% milk. YMMV, depending on your steam wand as well.

- Watch Youtube videos to see how fast other people pour and what designs you can make. My pours usually start out pretty fast to get some volume up, then slow down once the crema rises and gets close to the spout so I'm drawing.

Maybe I'll take a better video if I can find a few free minutes this weekend.

-Joe

 

[The Pol]

This is the problem... I mean the length of the shot and the crema will tell me a lot about my grind, beans... I mean, it will help me to qualify what I am doing.

If I have a pressure filter, which will basically langthen the shot and whip foam into the espresso, aside from taste (yah yah) how the hell do I know what is going on?

I have been oggling the Silvia and Rancilio Rocky over at SM for a couple days... literally.

I mean it is hard to qualify how good my grind is with the current filter setup.

I dont know what to do, I need to chillax... I am having a gadget moment.

 

[nostalgia]

If I have a pressure filter, which will basically langthen the shot and whip foam into the espresso, aside from taste (yah yah) how the hell do I know what is going on?

Yes, my apologies for dispensing "keep the machine for now" advice without asking

There are some machines you can turn into an unpressurized portafilter by removing all of the pressurized stuff and using a regular basket. I wonder if yous is like that?

-Joe

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

Can someone post some links to whatever SM is? I am definitely going to try some coffe fun tonight

 

[Bopper]

Can someone post some links to whatever SM is? I am definitely going to try some coffe fun tonight

http://www.sweetmarias.com/

 

[The Pol]

Yes, my apologies for dispensing "keep the machine for now" advice without asking

There are some machines you can turn into an unpressurized portafilter by removing all of the pressurized stuff and using a regular basket. I wonder if yous is like that?

-Joe

Dont know where to start.

 

[dontman]

This is the problem... I mean the length of the shot and the crema will tell me a lot about my grind, beans... I mean, it will help me to qualify what I am doing.

If I have a pressure filter, which will basically langthen the shot and whip foam into the espresso, aside from taste (yah yah) how the hell do I know what is going on?

I have been oggling the Silvia and Rancilio Rocky over at SM for a couple days... literally.

I mean it is hard to qualify how good my grind is with the current filter setup.

I dont know what to do, I need to chillax... I am having a gadget moment.

I went through the exact same thing. I bought a mid ground machine that got rid of the pressure filter and was able to pull a decent shot one out of 4 times with it and my $150 Maestro Plus grinder. But aw man, that one shot in 4 was frickin ambrosia. Sweet and chocolately, almost syrupy with no bitterness at all. Just head and shoulders above anything I could buy at any coffee shop.

Try doing ristrettos. Don't look at the pour. Do it by quantity. Use your double basket, grind as fine as possible, tamp hard, and then pull exactly 1.5 ounces, whether that takes 30 seconds or 12 seconds. This will produce the sweetest shots from your machine.

There is also something called temp surfing. This is where you time the shot based on the boiler on/off light. You can try it at the high point in the cycle - when the boiler just turns off, or at the low point in the cycle - when the boiler just turns on. See which tastes best. Obviously,per scientific method , just change one variable per test.

 

[dontman]

Dont know where to start.

Generally the manufacturer would have to produce a non pressure filter to the replace the baskets that you have. I doubt the Mr Coffee does that.

 

[The Pol]

Generally the manufacturer would have to produce a non pressure filter to the replace the baskets that you have. I doubt the Mr Coffee does that.

No... not at all

 

[Bopper]

I am now officially obsessed and scouring the internet looking at expresso machines, grinders, and roasters. Pol, I am definitely having a gadget moment as well! Look what you guys have done

Need. To. Pull. Myself. Away. From. Computer!

 

[The Pol]

Screw it $800 for a Silvia and a Rancilio, why not, might as well.

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

Pol! Pol! Pol!



Well you had that cash you didn't spend on the Therminator anyway :rockin:

 

[dontman]

Screw it $800 for a Silvia and a Rancilio, why not, might as well.

Awesome! I much prefer the doserless Rocky. If you are pulling lots of shots daily then you might want the doser model.

Auber sells a PID kit for Silvia that is much cheaper than other places I have seen. I know you'd have no problem installing it, but they were great when I had questions.