Electric HERMS Control Panel

[kal]

I would also run the bk with an ssvr and pot as there is no need for the pid.

I'd still get a PID if you want to brew anything and remain flexible. You can't do extended hop stands with the same control without a PID (think the extremely popular Alchemist's Heady Topper IPA).

So if you're at all into experimenting / not wanting to limit what your setup can do, get a PID for the boil kettle.

Kal

 

[Bensiff]

I'd still get a PID if you want to brew anything and remain flexible. You can't do extended hop stands with the same control without a PID (think the extremely popular Alchemist's Heady Topper IPA).

So if you're at all into experimenting / not wanting to limit what your setup can do, get a PID for the boil kettle.

Kal

That is a good point. What I'm really going after is controlling the element via current instead of on/off %. I'm sure there is a way to do this and still get temp control.

 

[kal]

With PIDs, no. They're on/off devices. Why do you want to control via current instead of off/on time? The end result is a boil either way.The cycle time (usually 2 seconds) is short enough that you don't have a boil that goes on/off/on/off/on/etc. It appears continuous. If a good boil wasn't possible, the tens of thousands of brewer who use them wouldn't be using them, manufacturers wouldn't use them on their electric brewing setups, etc.

Kal

 

[kal]

The other thing to keep in mind if you don't use a PID to boil is that you can't do any alarming.

I'll often set the boil PID to 208F (temp right before boil) and turn on the alarm while I'm cleaning out the MLT, doing other things.... This lets the wort heat up to just before boil and holds it at 208F, and notifies me with the alarm. Then I turn it to manual boil so that the temp keeps increasing to boil, and stir carefully to avoid boilovers.

I don't understand the point of wanting a dial because it's "easier" to control. There's really only one right % to run your boil at for any given setup/kettle size. For example, I always boil with the PID running at 85%. It never gets changed. You don't need to sit there and play with the dial (or %) while boiling. You don't need to fiddle with it. You set it as needed and leave it for the 60-120+ minute boil.

So in my case I only go between 100% (when getting up to boil) and 85% (while boiling) and never touch it again. If you fiddle with it, you won't get a consistent boil-off rate and you won't get consistent beer.

My 2 cents.

Kal

 

[stickyfinger]

I don't understand the point of wanting a dial because it's "easier" to control. There's really only one right % to run your boil at for any given setup/kettle size.

I'm just going off of nat. gas brewing, but I have to adjust the flame if it is windy or if it colder/hotter outside. If you have an electric outdoor/garage setup, you might find a rotating knob easier, though I plan to go inside into my basement and going electric is great for my goal of getting indoors!

Also, don't you have to fiddle with the PID just as you are approaching boil, even with the alarm? I guess maybe what you do is just keep the manual mode at 85% (or whatever is best for your setup, assuming that is fairly stable) and then turn off the element selector/element power switch if you need to cut the element due to an impending boilover? That would make the rotating dial a lot less useful now that I think about it.

 

[kal]

Wind doesn't affect a heating element in the wort.

If it's colder outside, you may set the duty cycle higher (say 80% in the winter instead of 70% in the summer) but you won't fiddle with it through the 60 min boil because the temperature outside isn't going to swing 40-80 degrees over that one hour period.

I don't fiddle with the PID as I'm approaching boil. I set it to 100% and then when it starts to foam up I turn it down to 85% and start stirring the foam. If I do think it'll get a boilover (rare) I simply turn the ELEMENT SELECT switch to off. Part of the trick of not having do that ever is to make sure you don't undersize your kettles. Get ketles twice as big as the volume of beer you want to package, and you won't be pushing it.

Kal

 

[Bensiff]

@Kal...you make very good points. My thought process is that I brew in a garage. I have set my PID anywhere from 65-90+% to maintain a boil depending on the ambient temp. I can adjust things much faster with a knob than pushing a button, yes that is extremely lazy; but, I'm extremely lazy. I think your best point would be on the hop stand, as one who did that would want to have exacting control on temps if they wanted repeatable results. But, I still kinda want a simple little knob that I can bump things around with the greatest of ease. I probably could create a bypass on my panel that would let me switch between the two depending on the circumstance; but, that would become more complex and laziness says too much bother.

 

[Hunky]

I've been considering starting to collect some parts, first just to get a couple elements in the BK and HLT. I've read through this thread and Kal's stuff (both very helpful) but notice on Amazon that the PIDs don't include model numbers. Pretty frustrating not knowing enough to figure out which one is which - maybe there's a trick? The Auber website has great info - but as I'm rural Alaska I like to shop where I can get free shipping or not too expensive. If I look for a SYL-2352 on Amazon I get a range of PIDs from $17 to about $35.

I'll have to read this thread again to figure out which models I need. I'm thinking rather than HERMS I may go with a RIMS (120v element), and a 5500 in each of the kettles. I can search PJs excellent diagrams for something that might work to get started with. Haven't really thought it all through yet, but thinking I could be heating sparge water in HLT while mash cooler is mashing.. with RIMS as a standby to keep temps or try other mash techniques.

Anyone got an Amazon link or know how to tell which model PID is which there? thx.. don't mean to hijack thread but maybe others might wonder after reading this great stuff. /jd

 

[chessking]

@Kal...you make very good points. My thought process is that I brew in a garage. I have set my PID anywhere from 65-90+% to maintain a boil depending on the ambient temp. I can adjust things much faster with a knob than pushing a button, yes that is extremely lazy; but, I'm extremely lazy. I think your best point would be on the hop stand, as one who did that would want to have exacting control on temps if they wanted repeatable results. But, I still kinda want a simple little knob that I can bump things around with the greatest of ease. I probably could create a bypass on my panel that would let me switch between the two depending on the circumstance; but, that would become more complex and laziness says too much bother.

This what you looking for?

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444

 

[Bensiff]

This what you looking for?



http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444

Ooh fancy!

 

[Beek]

This what you looking for?



http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444

I don't like that there isn't a current temp on it. Otherwise it would be awesome!


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