Dreg's from JK's Wytchmaker Rye IPA

[TravelingLight]

Does anyone know what's in the house farmhouse yeast used in Jester King's Wytchmaker Rye IPA? I saved dregs from a bottle last night but was curious if anyone knows if it's just brett and sacc or anything else. I can't find a definitive answer on their site and this beer is not listed on Tonsmiere's dregs lists.

 

[WeirdBrew]

They use the same house culture in all their beers. When they first started they were using specific strains in specific beers. They have since moved to a mixed culture of some of those original sacc strains and various wild yeast and bacteria that they cultured up from around their brewery. So it's definitely got sacc, Brett, and various bacteria in there. I recall from an interview that they said they have so many various organisms in their culture that they haven't even identified them all so far. The good news is that it's nothing more than their house culture in the bottle and they don't pasteurize so you can grow it up.

 

[TravelingLight]

They use the same house culture in all their beers. When they first started they were using specific strains in specific beers. They have since moved to a mixed culture of some of those original sacc strains and various wild yeast and bacteria that they cultured up from around their brewery. So it's definitely got sacc, Brett, and various bacteria in there. I recall from an interview that they said they have so many various organisms in their culture that they haven't even identified them all so far. The good news is that it's nothing more than their house culture in the bottle and they don't pasteurize so you can grow it up.

Thanks for the heads up. I think I read something similar. I guess I was thrown off as I thought, "Is there really lacto and pedio in this, an IPA??" I'm definitely going to step it up and harvest some jars.

 

[WeirdBrew]

Yep, they can kinda control the bacteria in their different beers by the level of ibu's in the beer. With it being an IPA the bacteria don't really get a chance to have much impact. Potentially though, if given enough time, as those ibu's start to fade the bacteria could start to go to work and sour the beer.

 

[TravelingLight]

Yep, they can kinda control the bacteria in their different beers by the level of ibu's in the beer. With it being an IPA the bacteria don't really get a chance to have much impact. Potentially though, if given enough time, as those ibu's start to fade the bacteria could start to go to work and sour the beer.

That is an EXCELLENT point that I had not even thought of. I guess ultimately what I am getting at is, I want to know what I am in for if I pitch this in one of my beers, i.e., I didn't want to pitch it thinking it would be a standard turnaround and the next thing I know I've got a pellicle and a fermenter that's tied up for a year plus.

 

[WeirdBrew]

It's hard to say and probably depends a lot on what you're trying to achieve. If you were to pitch just the dregs straight from the bottle that would be very different from building them up into a good sized starter first. Even then your starter may take awhile before it acquires much acidity as those bacteria will likely be slower to take hold especially coming from a beer where they were held back by the ibu's. So if your goal was to get something like the Witchmaker it may not take too long but if you're going for something strongly sour that would be very different. Some of Jester King's beer are done relatively quick as referenced here. http://jesterkingbrewery.com/blog/?pg=2
I haven't had this years version of dichotomous but past versions that I've tried have also been brewed, bottled, and served within 3-4 months and they have all been lightly sour. That being said they're pitching from their very strong house culture as opposed to dregs or even building up a quick starter.

 

[TravelingLight]

It's hard to say and probably depends a lot on what you're trying to achieve. If you were to pitch just the dregs straight from the bottle that would be very different from building them up into a good sized starter first. Even then your starter may take awhile before it acquires much acidity as those bacteria will likely be slower to take hold especially coming from a beer where they were held back by the ibu's. So if your goal was to get something like the Witchmaker it may not take too long but if you're going for something strongly sour that would be very different. Some of Jester King's beer are done relatively quick as referenced here. http://jesterkingbrewery.com/blog/?pg=2
I haven't had this years version of dichotomous but past versions that I've tried have also been brewed, bottled, and served within 3-4 months and they have all been lightly sour. That being said they're pitching from their very strong house culture as opposed to dregs or even building up a quick starter.

Thanks for the heads up. Honestly not sure what I want to do with it. I just always save dregs now and (usually) step them up to save for later. But I've pitched straight JK dregs before in a one gallon saison and it's currently got a great pellicle. Their dregs are certainly hardy as hell.

 

[NickersonC]

Definitely some of the best dregs out there. I like what WeirdBrew said about their "very strong house culture": at this point their brewery is probably so infested with micro-organism goodness that they would likely have a tough time brewing a beer WITHOUT them. Just recently stepped up dregs from their Funk Metal to make a batch inspired by that beer (recipe here: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=494510 not my own). When I saved some of my starter in a mason jar with some unfermented wort to keep it going and the top was bulging and nearly blew off when I unscrewed it only a few days later. Very potent stuff.

I guess to answer your problem, though, I'd say you'd likely end up with some brett/funky/ all kinds of wild characteristics in your beer if you stepped up the dregs and used them.

 

[TravelingLight]

Definitely some of the best dregs out there. I like what WeirdBrew said about their "very strong house culture": at this point their brewery is probably so infested with micro-organism goodness that they would likely have a tough time brewing a beer WITHOUT them. Just recently stepped up dregs from their Funk Metal to make a batch inspired by that beer (recipe here: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=494510 not my own). When I saved some of my starter in a mason jar with some unfermented wort to keep it going and the top was bulging and nearly blew off when I unscrewed it only a few days later. Very potent stuff.

I guess to answer your problem, though, I'd say you'd likely end up with some brett/funky/ all kinds of wild characteristics in your beer if you stepped up the dregs and used them.

Excellent. I do love JK dregs. I pitched dregs from JK Provenance and RU55 in a one gallon saison pull and it had a pellicle within a week I believe. Also, that recipe you linked looks phenomenal. I may do that for my first full size batch sour. I need more fermenters!!