Dough-in speed. FG Thin mashes and fine-milling. Any correlation?

[pricelessbrewing]

Is it because the temperature hasn't stabilized or is it because conversion is an endothermic reaction and is lowering the temperature? If you stir well would that not get the water and grains to thoroughly mix with a stable temperature?

The grains have a thermal mass, so first it takes a little bit for it to heat up. Secondly the grains take a little bit. Fully saturate and absorb all the water. I would probably peg this mostly done around 3 minutes after dough in in my experience, but I've never really paid too much attention to it and 5 minutes could definitely be a reasonable number.

I'm not sure if conversion is endothermic or not, anyone have a citation on that one?

 

[Brew_G]

After reading this thread, I decided to go ahead and dough in all at once on my last batch - a Centennial IPA with a 12.5 lb grain bill and a 1.75 gallon sparge brewed 12 days ago. I heated my strike water to about 3 degrees shy of what Priceless Brewing indicated just to see if I'd hit my mash temps with the quick dough in.

Negative, Ghostrider.

I came in a couple degrees short on mash temp. I attribute this to having to stir pretty vigorously for a few minutes to get rid of doughballs. So I hit the burner and brought temp up to my planned temp of 150F within less than a minute.

I've been out of town for the last six days, so I checked SG the night before I left - six days post-pitch (harvested Bell's yeast) - and was down from 1.064 to 1.011. That's a little higher attenuation than expected, so perhaps having my mash temp come in a little low had something to do with that. I did pitch a really healthy starter at high kräusen, so that may have had a big role to play, as well.

I'm really curious to see what the end product is like. The issue I had with my last beer having a very high FG is still in question, and this batch was fermented with the same yeast using the same starter process with approximately the same pitch rates. I have a hard time believing that it was all to do with yeast health, but maybe I'll end up chalking up that high FG on the brown ale to an anomaly...

 

[Gavin C]

After reading this thread, I decided to go ahead and dough in all at once on my last batch - a Centennial IPA with a 12.5 lb grain bill and a 1.75 gallon sparge brewed 12 days ago. I heated my strike water to about 3 degrees shy of what Priceless Brewing indicated just to see if I'd hit my mash temps with the quick dough in.

Negative, Ghostrider.

I came in a couple degrees short on mash temp. I attribute this to having to stir pretty vigorously for a few minutes to get rid of doughballs. So I hit the burner and brought temp up to my planned temp of 150F within less than a minute.

I've been out of town for the last six days, so I checked SG the night before I left - six days post-pitch (harvested Bell's yeast) - and was down from 1.064 to 1.011. That's a little higher attenuation than expected, so perhaps having my mash temp come in a little low had something to do with that. I did pitch a really healthy starter at high kräusen, so that may have had a big role to play, as well.

I'm really curious to see what the end product is like. The issue I had with my last beer having a very high FG is still in question, and this batch was fermented with the same yeast using the same starter process with approximately the same pitch rates. I have a hard time believing that it was all to do with yeast health, but maybe I'll end up chalking up that high FG on the brown ale to an anomaly...

Sounds like a winner. Thanks for checking in on this thread with your follow-up brew.

I'm not suggesting one should lower the planned strike temperature with a fast dough-in however. Sorry if I was not clear in my OP. I'm thinking that doughing-in fast will bring the temperature down faster to the planned mash-temp. Less exposure at undesirably high temps.

But that's the great thing with a mash-tun that you can direct fire. Really easy to bring temps up. Just stir well during this to eliminate overshoot/uneven heating and kill the heat a degree or so shy of the planned target. It will coast the rest of the way there as the thermal energy in the base of the pot is conducted into the mash.

 

[pricelessbrewing]

Is it bad that I felt vindicated? Muahuahuah

Thanks for the information though.

 

[Brew_G]

Gotcha, Gavin. I was thinking that quick dough-in might mean you should strike a few degrees shy of where you might otherwise be. Glad to have it ten that misconception cleared up!

Priceless...yet another example to show that your info is quality.

 

[DurtyChemist]

On my most recent mash I heated my water to 158 and it took me about 4 minutes to add in 12 pounds of grains. To me this was a normal speed and I dropped 4 degrees when measured 10 minutes later.