Does anyone quickly cool to 140F to minimize DMS?

[ndinh]

After reading several articles about quickly cooling your wort down to 140F to minimize DMS, I decided to do it for my last couple of brews. I had to use an IC to get the wort down fast then whirlpool then hook my hoses up to a CFC to cool it the rest of the way. I can't tell if there have been any noticeable differences compared to my past brews but then I'm also not that keen on the taste of DMS. I'm just curious to see if most of you guys/gals are doing this or do you just straight chill into your fermenter after whirlpooling. I'd like to know if I'm just wasting time with another piece of equipment that has to be cleaned and disconnected. Thanks.

 

[jbaysurfer]

This is what I do when I'm hopstanding. I chill to 150 and then continue to run my pump and hopstand/whirlpool for an hour then chill to the rest of the way. I only use an IC and a pump (whirlpooling in opposite direction of the H20 flow through the IC creates a counterflow effect) so with non hop stand beers, I just chill it as fast as possible.

 

[Auger]

I chill as quickly as possible, mostly because at that point in the brew day I want to pitch yeast and be done, not really for flavor profile reasons. I use an immersion chiller with a pre-cooler coil in a bucket of ice, so I run the chilling water through while stirring. Once cool, I whirlpool the crap out of it then let it stand, then drain or siphon off to the fermenter.

 

[RM-MN]

I've dumped boiling wort into the fermenter bucket and put a lid on. It took it about 30 hours to get to pitching temperature. I didn't notice any DMS from that. YMMV

 

[Brettomomyces]

If you have a strong, uncovered boil for 60-90 minutes (90 is better for pilsner malt) you won't have much to worry about and should get rid of almost all of the DMS during the boil. Here's a pretty good read on it

http://beersmith.com/blog/2012/04/10/dimethyl-sulfides-dms-in-home-brewed-beer/

 

[m00ps]

I've never experienced the elusive DMS issue, even with doing 60-min boils with +80% pilsner malt. I just do hop stands at right below boiling and let it naturally cool. Are you actually getting the problem?

 

[jbaysurfer]

If you have a strong, uncovered boil for 60-90 minutes (90 is better for pilsner malt) you won't have much to worry about and should get rid of almost all of the DMS during the boil. Here's a pretty good read on it

http://beersmith.com/blog/2012/04/10/dimethyl-sulfides-dms-in-home-brewed-beer/

DMS reforms at hopstand temps though, and doesn't slow formation until below 170 or stop completely until low 150. I think the ability to taste DMS (from my judging experience) is one of those genetic things. Some folks can, and others can't. I think there's a correlation between judges I've known who think it's a non-issue and those who can't taste it. (that's just my own conjecture of course)

Final edit, from the linked article:

Rapidly cooling your wort after boiling is also important. The SMM to DMS conversion continues at temperatures well below boiling, so DMS is produced even while the wort is cooling after the boil. However, unlike the mash, DMS produced while cooling cannot be boiled off. This conversion continues even if the hot wort is vented. For every hour you have hot wort sitting around, you will produce approximately a 30% increase in DMS.

 

[kanzimonson]

When I do hopstands, I do not lower the temp. In fact, sometimes I will add heat to ensure it stays in the isomerization range, so we're talking at least 180ish but usually around 200. I hopstand for 30 minutes.

No DMS, but it is worth noting that I use a lot of Maris Otter in my hoppy beers so less precursor as well.

 

[jbaysurfer]

^ My purpose for hopstanding is to add aroma without isomerization. If I wanted isomerization I'd just add the hops the to boil for whatever length necessary.

But everyone's got their own process/purposes...that's just mine.

 

[kanzimonson]

^ My purpose for hopstanding is to add aroma without isomerization. If I wanted isomerization I'd just add the hops the to boil for whatever length necessary.

But everyone's got their own process/purposes...that's just mine.

Yeah, I just kinda developed my method and here we are! I suppose I have this belief that the hotter temps will extract more flavor and aroma but I also can't say I've done too much experimenting with simple variables - seems I'm always doing different hop varieties, quantities, temps, and times.

 

[Brettomomyces]

DMS reforms at hopstand temps though, and doesn't slow formation until below 170 or stop completely until low 150. I think the ability to taste DMS (from my judging experience) is one of those genetic things. Some folks can, and others can't. I think there's a correlation between judges I've known who think it's a non-issue and those who can't taste it. (that's just my own conjecture of course)

I wondered a lot about that when I read that, but I do know a lot of forum members who do no-chill brewing and that should be the biggest DMS producing technique you could potentially do, especially larger batches that have a higher thermal mass.

I've also done a 2 hour covered hop stand at 170 (probably wouldn't do again, don't feel the extra time helped that much) and can't pick out any DMS from the beer. I can pick up DMS pretty well (diacetyl is one I'm working on). It's a big IPA so not the best candidate for detecting DMS flavors, but nice and clean to my pallete. I might feel a little uncomfortable doing a long hop stand with a really light pilsner...but hey, that sounds like a good experiment to me.

 

[kanzimonson]

A pro-brewer friend of mine once said "psht, the vigor of a homebrew boil is so high that DMS doesn't stand a chance, except for maybe with pils malt but even then..."

 

[sandyeggoxj]

I used to worry about it but anymore I don't care. I have good, uncovered boils for a long enough time that when I'm whirl pooling I don't mind. I just brewed a session IPA the other day that had a 45 minute whirlpool starting at flameout with no attempt to change the temperature. The temp dropped during the whirlpool from natural heat loss but it was covered the whole time. I use a plate heat exchanger and chill on the way to the fermenter. If I don't hit my pitch temp I'll just turn on the glycol for a little bit to drop it down to pitching.

There are far more important things to stress about on brew day such as mash temp or pitching rate or even fermentation temperatures!

 

[jbaysurfer]

I used to worry about it but anymore I don't care. I have good, uncovered boils for a long enough time that when I'm whirl pooling I don't mind. I just brewed a session IPA the other day that had a 45 minute whirlpool starting at flameout with no attempt to change the temperature. The temp dropped during the whirlpool from natural heat loss but it was covered the whole time. I use a plate heat exchanger and chill on the way to the fermenter. If I don't hit my pitch temp I'll just turn on the glycol for a little bit to drop it down to pitching.

There are far more important things to stress about on brew day such as mash temp or pitching rate or even fermentation temperatures!

I have no problem that our processes are different, but I would like to say that turning on a water hose and turning it off when the thermometer reads 150 isn't all that stressful. One of the benefits of an IC vs. a Plate Chiller, although when I've used a plate chiller I just recirc it back into the kettle until I reach my target temp. Still no stress.

Glad your way works for you!

 

[sandyeggoxj]

I am glad too!

I see a lot people get stressed about following a particular method or time constraint. There are quite a few ways to do thing and end up with great beer.

 

[RM-MN]

DMS reforms at hopstand temps though, and doesn't slow formation until below 170 or stop completely until low 150. I think the ability to taste DMS (from my judging experience) is one of those genetic things. Some folks can, and others can't. I think there's a correlation between judges I've known who think it's a non-issue and those who can't taste it. (that's just my own conjecture of course)

Final edit, from the linked article:

Did I develop the inability to taste DMS from my 2 times going through survival school and the times I have eaten road kill or am I just lucky enough to never get it. The no chill brews I have done have only had 45 minutes of boil and that as low as I can and still have it rolling.

 

[jbaysurfer]

^ Uh...I suppose that's a question for a Dr. LOL. Don't know why folks want to always turn stuff into a fecesfling, but you can go noboil, nochill, noferment, noworries; and as long as you like your results I'm stoked for you.