DIY Grain Mill. I was excited until....

[AnOldUR]

If you came on with a finished working design, they'd be patting you on your back.

Yeah, ask the guy who was putting boiling wort into his glass fermenter how that worked out.

 

[Suicided1954]

I had no idea this was such a sensitive subject. I apologize if I touched a nerve. I will post some pictures after I get it mocked up. I should have some time on Wednesday evening to get it done. I won't be able to crush any grain with it until after this weekend. I have prior engagements.

I plan on setting up static ( no gap adjustment) Can anyone give me a ballpark gap? .039"?

 

[jpalarchio]

I had no idea this was such a sensitive subject. I apologize if I touched a nerve.

Best of luck to you, hopefully you come up with something despite all the negative comments. At the end of the day, this is the DIY forum; if everything was about overall costs versus the feeling of accomplishment and knowing you "did it yourself", I think we'd all have to rethink our hobby.

Given the amount of money I have invested in equipment, the time I spend brewing, time spent rebuilding equipment and time spent viewing these forums, I'm many batches away from "breaking even" in compared to just buying a six-pack. When I talk to guys at work about all the effort that goes into brewing a good beer, many respond with "yeah, I just stop at the store on the way home".

Myself, I figure all the fiddling around keeps my brain active.

 

[AnOldUR]

Should I punt before I get more involved than I am?

I had no idea this was such a sensitive subject. I apologize if I touched a nerve.

It’s not really a sensitive subject and no nerve is touched pertaining to the subject. It’s just that you came to the DIY forum asking if using aluminum rollers was a good idea and worth the effort. Solid reasons why it is not have been put out there, but you choose to listen to the arm chair cheerleaders. You’ll put this thing together and it will crush grain. You’ll come back here pronouncing success and give the notion that this is a good idea. It clearly is not. Heck, you could use wooden rollers and it would work, but if you plan to be in this hobby for any length of time why would you be so short sighted. You’ll prove that grain can be crushed with aluminum. We know that. You could make a steak knife out of aluminum for your next project. How about aluminum drill bits? I'll bet you could put a hole in wood with one.

Why would you ask a question and then ignore the answer?

Maybe make friends with a powdercoater and have them powdercoated or ceramic coated. . .

And you’ll still end up with an underlying soft metal. Your odds of finding someone with a lathe to befriend are way better and you’ll end up with a more durable product.

 

[babalu87]

It’s not really a sensitive subject and no nerve is touched pertaining to the subject. It’s just that you came to the DIY forum asking if using aluminum rollers was a good idea and worth the effort. Solid reasons why it is not have been put out there, but you choose to listen to the arm chair cheerleaders. You’ll put this thing together and it will crush grain. You’ll come back here pronouncing success and give the notion that this is a good idea. It clearly is not. Heck, you could use wooden rollers and it would work, but if you plan to be in this hobby for any length of time why would you be so short sighted. You’ll prove that grain can be crushed with aluminum. We know that. You could make a steak knife out of aluminum for your next project. How about aluminum drill bits? I'll bet you could put a hole in wood with one.

THIS
I am in agreeance with.

To the OP
Building a mill is a great idea if you have the resources and is to be commended. I would just say that bicycle kickstands made of aluminum arent the best raw material.

Find something similar in steel and you are in business.
A machine shop can knurle a shaft easy peazy, find one that likes beer.

There is pom-pom waving and then there is constructive criticism and helpful advice.

Good luck, oh and remember some of us have actually built and or modified grain mills.

 

[Suicided1954]

Why would you ask a question and then ignore the answer?

I haven't ignored any of the advice I have gotten. But I haven't heard one person say that they used these specific rollers and they wore heavily in a short amount of time. I got alot of assumptions.

Why would I not want to "waste grain" if I was not heeding the warnings?

I have a big oak tree out in the front yard maybe I'll test the rollers' viability on some acorns...

I am continue forth past my original question because I realized I have no recovery for my investment. I may as well put it to rest and get something out of it. Who knows, they may be an inexpensive option for someone who only brews occasionally.

As far as the not wanting to use test grain in my beer... I need to work out some bugs in my system anyway. I'll just buy a cheap bag of grain and practice mashing as well. Just not add hops and boil.

Thanks
Darryl

 

[paddyfunk]

I would look into Brew In a Bag for small test batches. It'll save you grain, make it easier to find any problems with your mill design, and allow you to brew a wider range of beers. Since I was doing 2 gallon batches, I was able to use a converted pasta machine for a while, it died tough. Best of luck.

 

[Brewmoor]

THREAD SPLIT.

All of the aluminum vs stainless debate posts got their own thread. Please post there if you'd like to continue the aluminum health debate.

Let's keep this thread about the mechanical aspects of the potential build.

Thanks yuri, we were starting to get a little out of hand.

OP: Where do you live? Do have a feed store near by? If you are worried about wasting grain testing, you could go get a bucket full of horse feed. We pay about $13 for a 50 pound bag of grain. I would donate some if I lived near by. I bet you could get just a few pounds from the feed store though for real cheap.

 

[klecroy]

What I would suggest is get it going, but mock it up knowing the dimensions of a steel roller system as well. If the aluminum works, good move. If it doesn't, no biggie. You'll just have to wait on a new steel set and eat the cost of the aluminum rollers.

Also, using a little sacrificial grain isn't too bad. Feed Store is a good idea, or if you are close with your local brew shop, they may be willing to donate to your Zymurgical Engineering. Never hurts to ask.

 

[Laughing_Gnome_Invisible]

Do have a feed store near by? If you are worried about wasting grain testing, you could go get a bucket full of horse feed..

Good idea! TSC are everywhere, they have a ton of stuff in smaller bags that would be good for a test run.

 

[MrShake]

It’s not really a sensitive subject and no nerve is touched pertaining to the subject. It’s just that you came to the DIY forum asking if using aluminum rollers was a good idea and worth the effort. Solid reasons why it is not have been put out there, but you choose to listen to the arm chair cheerleaders. You’ll put this thing together and it will crush grain. You’ll come back here pronouncing success and give the notion that this is a good idea. It clearly is not.

Incorrect Statement. Clearly you believe it is not a good idea. However, you have zero experience crushing grain with the harbor freight motorcycle chock rollers right? Clearly, you have nothing but conjecture to base your opinion on. The OP is putting this to the test, actually doing the work instead of posting on forums about why other people are stupid.

Heck, you could use wooden rollers and it would work, but if you plan to be in this hobby for any length of time why would you be so short sighted.

Odly enough, someone on this DIY forum has successfully created a wooden roller mill, and has been quite successful with it if I remember correctly. And why does length of time in the hobby equate only using what you perceive is the proper equipment?

You’ll prove that grain can be crushed with aluminum. We know that. You could make a steak knife out of aluminum for your next project. How about aluminum drill bits? I'll bet you could put a hole in wood with one.

Why would you ask a question and then ignore the answer?

I believe, the OP has acknowledged, over and over, the concerns of the aluminum nay-sayers, but taken the attitude of "I have the supplies, I have the time, I might as well try" No harm in trying anything of this sort.... you never know, he might just LEARN something, or even be successful!

And you’ll still end up with an underlying soft metal. Your odds of finding someone with a lathe to befriend are way better and you’ll end up with a more durable product.

My point is the same as Remmy's..... you seem to be nothing but a naysayer, a negative influence on the OPs ideas. He is out nothing but time and wood at this point if it doesn't work.... if it does, fantastic.

But your insistence that no one try anything new, or anything that YOU believe won't work is ludicrous. I'd ask you, politely, to abandon this thread. You have stated your point ad nauesum and the OP has chosen to give this a try. Your negative comments are no longer necessary or wanted.

 

[AnOldUR]

Clearly, you have nothing but conjecture to base your opinion on.

You’re right. I only have conjecture (based on over 35 years experience in metalworking.)

Your negative comments are no longer necessary or wanted.

I was wondering when we would appoint someone to speak for all of HBT. Now I know that no one on this forum has any interest in hearing my opinion. I apologize and will comment no more.

 

[Brewmoor]

Alright. Enough guys. We all get the point. Some us like aluminum others don't. Some of us have expertise in areas others don't. No reason to get butt hurt over all this. Lets try and stay on topic.

If we have something helpful to say about this project......by all means post. If not lets take this debate over to the thread yuri created for this. We are not helping anybody by bickering.

 

[Mirage]

IMO, when people ask for ideas or suggestions, they are simply trying to gather as much information about a topic as they can and then make their final decision (at least that is what I do). Calling his opinions unwanted is simply unwarranted. That is their opinion and clearly they wouldn't create the mill because of what they know. If the OP doesn't think that he has enough evidence to tell him to not make it, that is great and we will all see what he ends up with and how it performs. It seems like this is getting quite personal when it shouldn't be. After reading the whole thread, I don't think anyone came across as someone who is simply saying it won't work for the sake of saying it. Again, it should be a collection of everyone's opinions and the OP can take those and do as he likes. My .02

 

[mmb]

We can all agree that aluminum is not as "strong" as steel, right? That it will wear down faster that steel, correct?

I'm sure that the aluminum will crush grain. I don't think anyone is disputing that. I also think that the rollers will need to be re-knurled much quicker than steel rollers if used to crush an equal amount of grain.

If you feel comfortable having to replace your rollers after an undetermined amount of time, have at it. If the OP only does a few batches a year, then the rollers might last for a while.

I don't think anyone is really telling the OP to not do it, it's stupid but rather, if you do it these will be the most likely results. *shrug*

 

[Hugh_Jass]

If the OP decides to go forward with this project, I'd be interested in the results over time. The aluminum may not stand up to continuous usage. Maybe take a micrometer reading after each 50-100 pounds of grain is crushed to check for loss of diameter and post the results.

 

[Homercidal]

When looking for material for my own homemade crusher, I asked some of the guys at my shop (machine shop) what to use and ALL of them said aluminum would wear out quickly. Grain is abrasive and will wear the aluminum. Now obviously we have all kinds of material here, and aluminum would be the MUCH easier material to turn and cut and knurl.

They ALL recommended steel rollers. Anodizing would probably improve the aluminum roller, but I don't know if it would completely prevent them from wearing. You can anodize the rollers yourself if you have a battery charger. Google for instructions.

 

[Brewmoor]

You can anodize the rollers yourself if you have a battery charger. Google for instructions.

I hate you!! I just did a search and found out how easy this is to do. Now I just need to find a place to find sulfuric acid. I just don't have time for all these cool projects I want to do. This one though is too cool to pass up.

 

[Homercidal]

I hate you!! I just did a search and found out how easy this is to do. Now I just need to find a place to find sulfuric acid. I just don't have time for all these cool projects I want to do. This one though is too cool to pass up.

Glad I could pass it along!

I've been wanting to try this for a few years, but never had a good reason. Maybe when I get my crusher motorized I'll anodize the frame a cool color.

OT : Molasses can remove rust. I have a website with the info on it.

http://www.homercidal.com/molasses

There should be a link to how to remove rust using a battery charger too. Similar to anodizing, but with washing soda instead of acid.

 

[Bobby_M]

Since when is every idea a good idea? If an idea can't stand up without cheerleaders... nevermind.

PS: Herm, let me know the next time you're up my way and the beer is on me.

 

[Synovia]

This thread reminds me of the day I asked on a woodworking forum what I should buy for a mitre saw. Everyone insisted I buy the $750 Bosch 12" Compound Sliding Miter Saw, saying that I'd regret anything else. I ended up buying an $89 reconditioned hitachi 12" Compound Miter Saw.


Is it as nice of a tool? No. But it cuts through 4x4s like butter.


We know that steel will hold up longer than aluminum, but we don't know that aluminum won't hold up. Sure, it won't work in a commercial setting, but if the difference is 5,000lbs of milled grain vs 100,000lbs before needing to be reknurled, who gives a crap? At the legal limit, 5000lbs is a lifetime of brewing.

Every time someone on these forums tries to do something different, the old guard comes out and insists it can't be done. We've seen it with no chill. We've seen it with no sparge. We've seen it with the corona mills. We've seen it with malt toasting.


The worst that can come out of this is his mill eats itself, and we have a test case.

 

[masonsjax]

I feel so conflicted here. I'm a DIY type, but at the same time, I bought a Barley Crusher because I was too lazy to build my own mill. I think that as my age increases, my desire to do things myself decreases, and my willingness to pay others to do it for me takes over. Personally, I think lazy people tend to do things right the first time, to avoid duplicating work. Despite my own apathy, I encourage everyone to follow through with new ideas. Even if they don't pan out as expected, they could lead to other great ideas, inspire others, or just serve as a good learning experience.

 

[HSM]

You’re right. I only have conjecture (based on over 35 years experience in metalworking.)


I was wondering when we would appoint someone to speak for all of HBT. Now I know that no one on this forum has any interest in hearing my opinion. I apologize and will comment no more.

Crap, now along with the almighty rebby we have mr shake telling everyone to ingnore good advice and try anything with no other knowledge than "you haven't done it yourself".

Usually when I see a Rebby pontificating post I quickly move on to save myself the frustration. Wish I had done so here.

 

[Homercidal]

Well, frankly, I'm curious to see how it turns out. I happen to have ample supply of good steel and that is what I used. Let's see how the aluminum holds up!

 

[crawford]

Good luck on the mill, man. your a little more ambitious than i would be, I bought my own.

 

[BA_from_GA]

WOW, what a pissing contest.

to the OP... i recently built a grain mill with some scrap i had around the shop i work in. (thread here ). I was assured in that thread that the rollers i have wouldn't work, that i needed industrial conveyor rollers.... by someone who hadn't ever seen anything more than the pictures of the rollers i'd posted. He didn't know their intended use, or construction... just knew that i wouldn't be successful.

He was wrong. My grain mill works fine. Took some tinkering, some adjusting, etc, etc, but it works I milled grain and got just over 70% efficiency on my first brew using it. Personally, i value ingenuity... be it my own or someone else's. Life would suck if everyone's creativity was restrained by their critics.

Good luck, let us know how well your grain mill does work, because it will.

 

[MarsColonist]

Now I just need to find a place to find sulfuric acid.

Automotive store for battery refresh kit, at least that is what I used.

 

[Brewmoor]

Automotive store for battery refresh kit, at least that is what I used.

Thank you, I am going to stop by napa tomorrow and see what I can find.

 

[GreenMonti]

You could age-harden the rollers in your oven. 375 for about 8 hours should work.

 

[BenS]

I want to revive this thread. I saw these rollers the other day at harbor freight and the only reason I thought they might not work was because the knurls on them were huge. Heck, the "motorcycle stand" they sell it as could even be modified so that the rollers weren't even taken out of the stand. I think I've just convinced myself to go to harbor freight tomorrow.

To the OP, whats the update?