Destroyer Of Faces IIIPA Question...

[JoeBronco]

OK - So typically i stick to regular recipes that are tried and true and do little additions to my liking. I got the idea from a friend (He and i are both SERIOUS hop heads) To make a beer that nearly destroys your face when you drink it. I was shooting to use a full pound of hops!!!


Here is my idea so far... Any opinions??? To hoppy/bitter?

The Destroyer of Faces
14-C India Pale Ale, Imperial IPA
IBU - 316
ABV - 11.2%

Grain/Extract/Sugar
14.75 lbs American 2 Row
1 lbs Victory malt
0.75 lbs Dextrose
0.5 lbs Crystal L40
0.75 lbs Turbinado Sugar

Hops
1.50 oz Simcoe Mash Hop

2.25 oz CTZ 90
2.25 oz Simcoe 90
1.00 oz Simcoe 60
1.50 oz Centinnial 60
0.75 oz Simcoe 45
0.50 oz Simcoe 30
0.50 oz Cascade 15
0.50 oz Cascade 10
0.50 oz Cascade 5

0.50 oz Simcoe Flame Off
0.50 oz Cascade Flame Off

1.00 oz CTZ DryHop
1.00 oz Simcoe DryHop
1.00 oz Cascade DryHop

0.25 oz CTZ 2nd Dry Hop
0.25 oz Simcoe 2nd Dry Hop
0.25 oz Cascade 2nd Dry Hop

Yeast
DCL Yeast US-05 Safeale American Ale Yeast

 

[peachwein]

I dont know much of anything in this category, however i have read multiple times that as far as taste comes, anything over 80 IBU's is unnecessary, something about that being the threshold you can taste... I'm sure somebody with more knowledge will chime in.

 

[Nateo]

It's not physically possible to exceed 120 IBU, and the human taste threshold is around 100 IBU. Anything more is wasted, basically. Bitterness algorithms don't take that into account, and thus will give you much higher numbers than is physically possible.

If you want use a whole bunch of hops, I like to use only late addition hops, like at -30min or less. That way you'll get maximal bittering without losing all the hop flavor to boiling.

 

[JoeBronco]

It's not physically possible to exceed 120 IBU, and the human taste threshold is around 100 IBU. Anything more is wasted, basically. Bitterness algorithms don't take that into account, and thus will give you much higher numbers than is physically possible.

If you want use a whole bunch of hops, I like to use only late addition hops, like at -30min or less. That way you'll get maximal bittering without losing all the hop flavor to boiling.

Alright... Makes sense.
More like this then.
With only 5.5 of the 16oz's of hops before 30 minutes.

Hops
1.50 oz Simcoe Mash Hop

2.25 oz CTZ 90
2.25 oz Simcoe 90
1.00 oz Simcoe 60
1.50 oz Centinnial 30
0.75 oz Simcoe 30
0.50 oz Simcoe 15
0.50 oz Cascade 15
0.50 oz Cascade 10
0.50 oz Cascade 5

0.50 oz Simcoe Flame Off
0.50 oz Cascade Flame Off

1.00 oz CTZ DryHop
1.00 oz Simcoe DryHop
1.00 oz Cascade DryHop

0.25 oz CTZ 2nd Dry Hop
0.25 oz Simcoe 2nd Dry Hop
0.25 oz Cascade 2nd Dry Hop

 

[JoeBronco]

At $71 to make this beer, im trying to iron it out so that it wont be an expensive lesson... LOL.

 

[Nateo]

Hopsdirect dude! You can buy a pound of hops for like $15

 

[JoeBronco]

Hopsdirect dude! You can buy a pound of hops for like $15

Really? I have to check them out...


EDIT: dosent look like they sell Simcoe OR CTZ =(

 

[pulptastic]

Really? I have to check them out...

EDIT: dosent look like they sell Simcoe OR CTZ =(

I bought some columbus cones from them, 17.9 AA!

Simcoe is relatively new and patented, only licensed to a limited number of growers.

 

[JoeBronco]

I bought some columbus cones from them, 17.9 AA!

Simcoe is relatively new and patented, only licensed to a limited number of growers.

Thanks but columbus really doesn't help out... Although i have been wanting to make another Columbus IPA.

I know that hops direct USED to sell simcoe and it has been around for about 3-4 years now.

 

[Nateo]

They don't have every variety, but the stuff they do have is usually under $10/pound.

 

[jbrookeiv]

Thanks but columbus really doesn't help out... Although i have been wanting to make another Columbus IPA.

I know that hops direct USED to sell simcoe and it has been around for about 3-4 years now.

Just to let you know, CTZ stands for Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus, so I think a pound of Columbus would help you out.

 

[JoeBronco]

Just to let you know, CTZ stands for Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus, so I think a pound of Columbus would help you out.

Tomahawk and Columbus are the same hops with Zeus having a higher alpha. But Tomahawk is grown in a different region. CTZ is typically a higher Alpha.

Columbus NORMALLY has around 12% AA
Tomahawk is a trade name for Columbus
Zeus has NORMALLY around 15% AA and is VERY similar to Columbus.

If im not mistaken (and i may be) CTZ is a breed of the two and CTZ has on Average - 16.5% AA





I guess they are all close enough...

 

[jbrookeiv]

Tomahawk and Columbus are the same hops with Zeus having a higher alpha. But Tomahawk is grown in a different region. CTZ is typically a higher Alpha.

Columbus NORMALLY has around 12% AA
Tomahawk is a trade name for Columbus
Zeus has NORMALLY around 15% AA and is VERY similar to Columbus.

If im not mistaken (and i may be) CTZ is a breed of the two and CTZ has on Average - 16.5% AA



I guess they are all close enough...

I'm pretty sure you're mistaken. They are all essentially the same, just different names.

http://www.rebelbrewer.com/shoppingcart/products/Columbus-Hops-(US)-%2d-1oz.-Pellets.html

 

[weirdboy]

Tomahawk and Columbus are the same hops with Zeus having a higher alpha. But Tomahawk is grown in a different region. CTZ is typically a higher Alpha.

Columbus NORMALLY has around 12% AA
Tomahawk is a trade name for Columbus
Zeus has NORMALLY around 15% AA and is VERY similar to Columbus.

If im not mistaken (and i may be) CTZ is a breed of the two and CTZ has on Average - 16.5% AA





I guess they are all close enough...

Last pound of Columbus I got from HopsDirect was 14% AA.

I have never heard of "CTZ" hops it is an acronym for any of the three.

 

[Hophazard]

I have never heard of "CTZ" hops it is an acronym for any of the three.

That's always been my understanding. The commercial brewers use them interchangibly...

 

[BreckBastion]

that's always been my understanding. The commercial brewers use them interchangibly...

yep

 

[JoeBronco]

yep

OK - well i guess i was wrong.

 

[rustbucket]

at that price your better off making Pliny the elder clone... and know what your getting yourself into

 

[JoeBronco]

The pliny clone cost me 56.50 (with taxes) at my LHBS. I have made it a few times. I wanted something with a bit more... umph.

 

[Photopilot]

The pliny clone cost me 56.50 (with taxes) at my LHBS. I have made it a few times. I wanted something with a bit more... umph.

Farmhouse Brewing supply sales in bulk in smaller portions 4 oz packages in prices similar to Hops direct without having to fill your freezer with only one or two types of hops. Not that my freezer is not filled with hops but I have many to choose from. He is a vendor here and I have been very happy with all my orders.

Pliney pack $13
http://www.farmhousebrewingsupply.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=79

 

[primer]

Subscribing and cheering you on as a fellow hop head that can't get enough bitterness!

Sent from my iPhone using HB Talk

 

[berebrando]

I've been working on a iiipa recipe too. My plan is to use two row, flaked barley, Munich and c10l to get up around 1.090 and add sugar to about 1.100 gravity. Then I'll be hopping it up with 1oz nugget@60, 2oz nugget@15, 3oz. Simcoe@15, 1 oz nugget@5, 2 oz centennial@5. That should put me close to 100ibu and about 1:1 bu:gu while getting a strong dose of flavor and aroma from the hops...

My thought on using a pound of hops is that it sounds really cool but if you theoretically can't taste anything beyond 100 ibu, what's the point? I look forward to reading about your results.

 

[weirdboy]

Here's the thing. I don't think you can taste the IBUs past a certain point, but I still think there is a tangible benefit when you pile on the flavor/aroma/dry hops.

 

[JoeBronco]

Farmhouse Brewing supply sales in bulk in smaller portions 4 oz packages in prices similar to Hops direct without having to fill your freezer with only one or two types of hops. Not that my freezer is not filled with hops but I have many to choose from. He is a vendor here and I have been very happy with all my orders.

Pliney pack $13
http://www.farmhousebrewingsupply.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=79

I used that hop kit on my "Pliny the Mexican" that i brewed since my LHBS was out of Simcoe last month. I will DEFINETLY be ordering more from them. That beer is now known (in my house) as the SHMBO slayer :rockin:

Pliny just doesn't have enough "hop" to it anymore... But maybe im becoming immune.

 

[JoeBronco]

Here's the thing. I don't think you can taste the IBUs past a certain point, but I still think there is a tangible benefit when you pile on the flavor/aroma/dry hops.

I agree. Im not really worried about what the IBU is rated. I want more of a kick from the hops. That's why im dry hoping twice. That's also why im using mostly Cascade, CTZ and Simcoe.

I want you to almost feel like your drinking a high ABV hop extract

 

[Stratotankard]

Sounds a bit like my Liquid Novacaine. The general consensus is that theoretically you can't get much over 100 IBUs and if you could you'd have a hard time tasting the difference in bitterness. That said, the extra hops will still add flavour and aromas and some mouthfeel. When I brewed mine it certainly didn't taste way more bitter than other IPAs I've had.

I like the look of your recipe.

 

[JoeBronco]

Sounds a bit like my Liquid Novacaine. The general consensus is that theoretically you can't get much over 100 IBUs and if you could you'd have a hard time tasting the difference in bitterness. That said, the extra hops will still add flavour and aromas and some mouthfeel. When I brewed mine it certainly didn't taste way more bitter than other IPAs I've had.

I like the look of your recipe.

Thanks! I hope it turns out. Brew day is when my draft tower gets delivered to me. That way i can put my Porter on tap and have this in the cone. :cross:

How is your brew coming along?

 

[Stratotankard]

Just got done feeding it another 2 pounds of DME and a pound of corn sugar. The brewday was a fiasco and my efficiency was terrible or I wouldn't have needed to feed it. Otherwise it's coming along nicely. The flavour is heavily bitter, but with a bit of malt backbone and a dry finish.