Decoction vs Infusion for step mash in cooler?

[fimpster]

I want to brew up a Witbeir that calls for a step at 122° and another at 154° (recipe HERE). I have a cooler for MLT. I've never done a step mash before, always just a single infusion, batch sparge (I built my rig to be able to fly sparge, although I haven't done that yet either).

I've used various calculators in BS and online to calculate volumes for doing infusion and have enough volume to go either way. What are the benefits and/or drawbacks of doing a decoction vs infusion? What effect will it have on the end result?

Thanks.

(btw steam isn't an option yet)

 

[Bensiff]

IMO you want an infusion for that style. A decoction will produce increased Maillard reactions resulting in a darker more malty beer which is exactly what a wit is not. I'm not saying it will produce a dark beer or malt bomb, just possible to add some character I would not be looking for in a wit.

 

[fimpster]

Ok, thank @Bensiff that makes sense. Especially for this recipe.

So are there styles that would benefit with a decoction over an infusion step mash? Perhaps porters, browns, Scotch etc? But then most of those styles use well modified malts anyhow, and wouldn't see much improvement with a protein rest. Am I understanding this correctly?

 

[Helloworld]

I think a lot of bock and lager recipes have decoction mashes. It was suggested on an episode of Brew Strong that the malts homebrewers get now are of greater quality and a decoction might not be necessary.

 

[fimpster]

I think a lot of bock and lager recipes have decoction mashes. It was suggested on an episode of Brew Strong that the malts homebrewers get now are of greater quality and a decoction might not be necessary.

I believe I heard that episode of Brew Strong, and if I recall correctly, they suggested ( and many on HBT also suggest) that well modified malts don't need to be step mashed (as I mentioned in my previous post). My question is when you are doing a step mash, how does decoction vs infusion help or hinder the resulting beer? Are there styles that benefit from a decoction to raise the mash temp? And are other styles better off with an infusion to raise the mash temp?

 

[BlkWater_brewer]

Decoction was the default standard method for brewing beer a generation or 3 ago. As was stated, modern malting techniques pretty much made the practice obsolete. Some still use it in some form or another but there is little to be gained and it does add to the overall process. But it's a personal preference so go ahead.

 

[Bensiff]

Ok, thank @Bensiff that makes sense. Especially for this recipe.

So are there styles that would benefit with a decoction over an infusion step mash? Perhaps porters, browns, Scotch etc? But then most of those styles use well modified malts anyhow, and wouldn't see much improvement with a protein rest. Am I understanding this correctly?

That there question is a bucket of worms with many different camps. AFAIK the German's are the only ones who use decoction commercially so I would say German styles would be where you would want to do it, if you do. As many have said, modern malts are well modified so they don't need multiple temp rests to get a good conversion. But, people claim a decoction creates a wort that cannot be replicated in single infusion mash. Some people say they cannot tell the difference when all things being equal, the only thing that separates two beers is decoction or single infusion mash. I don't have an opinion on that matter as I have not tried such a side by side experiment. I do know that I have only tasted one American made German style beer that I feel truly holds its own against their German counterparts, and that is Gordon Biersch, who brews beer as training at Weihenstephaner taught them, meaning decoction.

 

[billingsbrew]

If anyone thinks that a decoction mash is simply for conversion purposes you should try one and see what you do to your grain. There is no way you can boil the mash and not have any change on the outcome of the flavor. It would be like steaming onions instead of caramelizing onions in a pan.

 

[mbobhat]

2c here, A good time to try a decoction may be if you accidentally mash too low. Or you could try it on a beer where a grain bill has a lb or so of carmel malts, and maybe cut the crystal in half and try it. The idea is you are getting those same kind of maltiness than if you used carmel malts. I tried it once on a beer and couldn't with certainty tell you what it actually did, but it was good beer, and I mashed on the low side of where I wanted. Another time to try may be if you want to try a beer that is all base malt and want to see if you can get it maltier/darker.

To attempt to answer fimster question, I would say it depends on the recipe and how many darker and carmel malts are in a beer. Decoction is one way to get there.


EDIT: AHH I love answering questions that are 6 months old hahahaha

 

[fimpster]

haha thanks though @mbobhat . I have done a lot more research on decoction mashing since I posted that. I still haven't tried one yet, but it's on my must try list.

 

[didinho]

If anyone thinks that a decoction mash is simply for conversion purposes you should try one and see what you do to your grain. There is no way you can boil the mash and not have any change on the outcome of the flavor. It would be like steaming onions instead of caramelizing onions in a pan.

I'm a big decoction fan, because I found an increased malty taste in the finished beer: for this reason I use it also in english styles, IPA as the caramel notes are increased. then the efficiency increases a bit too as the mash is longer

 

[wobdee]

I'm on the fence as far as the decoction debate goes. I keep going back and forth trying both decoction and direct heat step mashing and both methods are making great beers for me. Maybe the darker beers are a little better with my decoction schedule but I don't think its by much.

 

[hottpeper13]

I just made an Octoberfest...............oh wait thaat isn't a style anymore, so with mostly 80% Vienna malt, well modified, I did a decoction to get to mashout temps,we'll have to wait a couple months to see if it was worth it.