Critique my first BIAB NEIPA recipe

[Apmarand]

Hi all. I’ve been lurking here for a while and am planning my first BIAB for a NEIPA. I am hoping for some feedback on a recipe (attached). My plan is to add a small bittering charge at 0 min boil and a whopping 15.5 oz after that. I want to make sure I’m not being wasteful with the hop additions, particularly at whirlpool. From what I’ve read, the major dry hop addition (double dry hopped) should come at the tail end of fermentation to avoid too much aromatic loss from CO2. Water chemistry was estimated from my local water report with the help of brewers friend. I am a little unsure of the grain bill as well. Thoughts, suggestions, and criticisms are welcome. Cheers!

 

[VirginiaHops1]

It looks fine. I personally might shift a few ounces of hops from whirlpool to dry hop and probably wouldn't even do the bittering charge, but that's just me. For the grain bill some people(and pro breweries) keep it simple on their hazy beers with just 2 row and wheat and/or oats. Some people will mix in a little crystal or honey malt or something else for a bit more malt flavor. Personal preference. The most important thing with this style is having a really tight process that limits O2. You can scrutinize your recipe all day but if that's not buttoned up it won't matter.

 

[Apmarand]

Any recommendations on avoiding stuck transfers? I’ve been trying closed transfers but they always seem to get stuck half way thru from all the hop material. Last time out I added 2psi on the fermenter (anvil 7.5 gallon) and still had issues. For example, I was getting 6-12 oz of transfer a second that slowed down to 1 oz ever 4-5 seconds after about 30lbs of beer added to the keg. I’d rather not bag the hops, but it’s probably better than having to open the FV to unclog it. Thanks for the reply, I’m new to the site (first post) and brewing in general.

 

[Apmarand]

here’s an image of my transfer set up. I have an inline filter to remove particulates going into the keg, but the problems seem to be coming from the racking arm getting clogged. Just trying to button up all sources of oxygen ingress!

 

[VirginiaHops1]

here’s an image of my transfer set up. I have an inline filter to remove particulates going into the keg, but the problems seem to be coming from the racking arm getting clogged. Just trying to button up all sources of oxygen ingress!
View attachment 721501

You're using a metric **** ton of hops and the surface area of that filter is probably too small for all the hop matter coming through and is getting completely clogged. You probably need to add some other type of filtering method inside the fermenter. I'm not familiar with the Anvil and the best options for that(I ferment in kegs). Some people use floating dip tubes(doesn't look like an option for that vessel) and others will keep the regular dip tube and add a filter around it, which is what I do. I use one of those stainless steel hop canisters and I also wrap it in a mesh bag. I've had issues with just using the hop canister but double wrapped I tend to have no issues. I agree bagging is not preferable but if you can't figure any other way to filter the hop matter inside the fermenter it may be your only option.

 

[Apmarand]

You're using a metric **** ton of hops and the surface area of that filter is probably too small for all the hop matter coming through and is getting completely clogged. You probably need to add some other type of filtering method inside the fermenter. I'm not familiar with the Anvil and the best options for that(I ferment in kegs). Some people use floating dip tubes(doesn't look like an option for that vessel) and others will keep the regular dip tube and add a filter around it, which is what I do. I use one of those stainless steel hop canisters and I also wrap it in a mesh bag. I've had issues with just using the hop canister but double wrapped I tend to have no issues. I agree bagging is not preferable but if you can't figure any other way to filter the hop matter inside the fermenter it may be your only option.

This is exactly the type of advice I've been looking for. Would adding a filter preclude the ability to sample yeast? I typically split a 5L starter into two jars for saving and pitching, but sometimes I wash yeast after racking. The reason I ask is I read that the yeast cake is much healthier/viable if collected early on. Its not a big deal, but I guess its something that can be addressed with a future FV (like an SS brewtech chronical while I'm dreaming). Assuming I stick to my current procedure and avoid yeast collection, I presume I'll need custom filtering solution that won't interfere with the rotating function of the racking arm. Product recommendations would be welcome.

Fermenting is kegs is certainly attractive given the ease of transfers, the option to ferment under pressure and overall control over oxygen exposure. I guess most people cut the dip tube or add a floater to circumvent trub build-up. Is it worth the hit in batch size? Apologies for all the questions! Happy to move to a new thread, revive an older one, or let ya go. Cheers!

BTW: I lived in VA for 21 years. I especially miss the mountains, although the AT in North GA is only about an hours drive.

 

[deuc224]

I did 2 row, wheat, oats and honey malt in my last one and that will be the final recipe for this NEIPA, absolute perfect beer for me. But I also dont dry hop or bitter hop or whirlpool hop.

 

[VirginiaHops1]

This is exactly the type of advice I've been looking for. Would adding a filter preclude the ability to sample yeast? I typically split a 5L starter into two jars for saving and pitching, but sometimes I wash yeast after racking. The reason I ask is I read that the yeast cake is much healthier/viable if collected early on. Its not a big deal, but I guess its something that can be addressed with a future FV (like an SS brewtech chronical while I'm dreaming). Assuming I stick to my current procedure and avoid yeast collection, I presume I'll need custom filtering solution that won't interfere with the rotating function of the racking arm. Product recommendations would be welcome.

Fermenting is kegs is certainly attractive given the ease of transfers, the option to ferment under pressure and overall control over oxygen exposure. I guess most people cut the dip tube or add a floater to circumvent trub build-up. Is it worth the hit in batch size? Apologies for all the questions! Happy to move to a new thread, revive an older one, or let ya go. Cheers!

BTW: I lived in VA for 21 years. I especially miss the mountains, although the AT in North GA is only about an hours drive.

You could always ferment in your Anvil and then transfer to a keg to dry hop, if you're trying to harvest yeast. I harvest yeast into mason jars alot to get my moneys worth on a pouch of liquid yeast. I dry hop in a 2nd keg typically, not my fermenting keg.

Depending on the type of beer and how much I lose to hops/trub I can get 3-4 gallons of finished beer into my serving kegs. It's fine for me, but may be a dealbreaker for some people. Wife and friends help but I'm the primary drinkers so smaller batches keeps me from drinking way too much, and also lets me brew more often which I enjoy.

I've lived in VA my whole life and the mountains are pretty. We were out there a few times over the holidays. This winter was a little less mild than usual though so I'm dying for spring to get here. I've heard great things about GA too!

 

[Apmarand]

I did 2 row, wheat, oats and honey malt in my last one and that will be the final recipe for this NEIPA, absolute perfect beer for me. But I also dont dry hop or bitter hop or whirlpool hop.

Can I interpret this as only the FO hops?! From what I've read, seems that the dry hop charges during active fermentation is what makes this style unique. Correct me if I am wrong, but I think dry-hopping at 2-5oz/gal has become pretty standard for NEIPAs at commercial breweries.

 

[Apmarand]

You could always ferment in your Anvil and then transfer to a keg to dry hop, if you're trying to harvest yeast. I harvest yeast into mason jars alot to get my moneys worth on a pouch of liquid yeast. I dry hop in a 2nd keg typically, not my fermenting keg.

Depending on the type of beer and how much I lose to hops/trub I can get 3-4 gallons of finished beer into my serving kegs. It's fine for me, but may be a dealbreaker for some people. Wife and friends help but I'm the primary drinkers so smaller batches keeps me from drinking way too much, and also lets me brew more often which I enjoy.

I've lived in VA my whole life and the mountains are pretty. We were out there a few times over the holidays. This winter was a little less mild than usual though so I'm dying for spring to get here. I've heard great things about GA too!

I haven't dry-hopped in the keg yet as I've been worried about opening after liquid purging. Do you just purge the keg with CO2 after cleaning/santizing or is pushing sanitizer out of the keg with CO2 still necessary (when dry-hopping in the serving vessel)? I've gotten pretty strong hop burn by dry-hopping in the FV, which I imagine would be even more prevalent when done in the keg. I do like the idea of trapping all the hop oils. As much as I love the olfactory sensations of opening my ferm chamber after dry-hopping, its a reminder of how much aroma is being lost to CO2..

GA is beautiful in its own right, but nothing beats the balanced seasons of the Mid-Atlantic. We traded the 6 months of winter in Madison, WI winters for the 6 months of existential sweat in GA. Not sure which is better, but I know that lagers will never be on my to do list here...

 

[VirginiaHops1]

I haven't dry-hopped in the keg yet as I've been worried about opening after liquid purging. Do you just purge the keg with CO2 after cleaning/santizing or is pushing sanitizer out of the keg with CO2 still necessary (when dry-hopping in the serving vessel)? I've gotten pretty strong hop burn by dry-hopping in the FV, which I imagine would be even more prevalent when done in the keg. I do like the idea of trapping all the hop oils. As much as I love the olfactory sensations of opening my ferm chamber after dry-hopping, its a reminder of how much aroma is being lost to CO2..

GA is beautiful in its own right, but nothing beats the balanced seasons of the Mid-Atlantic. We traded the 6 months of winter in Madison, WI winters for the 6 months of existential sweat in GA. Not sure which is better, but I know that lagers will never be on my to do list here...

What I've been mostly doing is hooking the dry hop keg(with hops inside) up to the fermenting keg, and letting the CO2 from fermentation purge it. This is optimal from the limiting O2 perspective although I don't like the hops sitting there at ferm temps for too long. I'll try to disconnect it after a couple days and put it in the fridge sometimes. Occasionally I will dry hop in the fermenting keg, which required cracking the seal and opening it.

At the end of the day there are so many different systems people brew on, I guess we just have to find the way to get the best quality beer out of whatever we're using. I still tweak stuff in my system from time to time so it's definitely a work in progress, although I haven't made any major changes in awhile.

 

[apache_brew]

My opinion would be to lose the 60 minute charge and just toss it in at whirlpool. Also, without purged dry hopping equipment, I'd stick to not dry hopping after 1.020 SG. I've had good experiences fermenting with a floating dip tube and just cold crashing at 10 oz/5gal for hazy beer.

 

[Apmarand]

What I've been mostly doing is hooking the dry hop keg(with hops inside) up to the fermenting keg, and letting the CO2 from fermentation purge it. This is optimal from the limiting O2 perspective although I don't like the hops sitting there at ferm temps for too long. I'll try to disconnect it after a couple days and put it in the fridge sometimes. Occasionally I will dry hop in the fermenting keg, which required cracking the seal and opening it.

At the end of the day there are so many different systems people brew on, I guess we just have to find the way to get the best quality beer out of whatever we're using. I still tweak stuff in my system from time to time so it's definitely a work in progress, although I haven't made any major changes in awhile.

That makes total sense, and seems to be a smart way to save on CO2. I like my set up but the transfer clogging has been a real source of frustration. You've definitely given me a lot to consider, all of it great advice. Thanks again for taking the time to steer me in the right direction!

 

[Apmarand]

My opinion would be to lose the 60 minute charge and just toss it in at whirlpool. Also, without purged dry hopping equipment, I'd stick to not dry hopping after 1.020 SG. I've had good experiences fermenting with a floating dip tube and just cold crashing at 10 oz/5gal for hazy beer.

I don't have a means to add the dry-hops in a purged environment (like a hop-drop), so I was planning to dry-hop 2 and 7 days after pitching. I usually still have airlock activity after 7-8 days with WLP095 (SG has been 1.070-1.075 recently), but I realize its not a great approximation for fermentation activity. I saw that some people do the second addition with around 70% of expected attenuation complete. Maybe my timing is off and should bump the second addition up by a couple days? I suppose the best way to find out is by taking a sample. Thanks for the reply! Cheers

 

[VirginiaHops1]

That makes total sense, and seems to be a smart way to save on CO2. I like my set up but the transfer clogging has been a real source of frustration. You've definitely given me a lot to consider, all of it great advice. Thanks again for taking the time to steer me in the right direction!

No worries man. Looking forward to seeing more posts from you including some finished products and how it turned out. This website is just packed with an immense amount of useful info from lots of people way smarter than me, but at the end of the day what I find what works best is just trying different things out. The more batches you brew, the more you'll figure out what works best for you and your setup.

 

[Apmarand]

No worries man. Looking forward to seeing more posts from you including some finished products and how it turned out. This website is just packed with an immense amount of useful info from lots of people way smarter than me, but at the end of the day what I find what works best is just trying different things out. The more batches you brew, the more you'll figure out what works best for you and your setup.

I will certainly post an update after brew day. I just kegged my last batch on Friday (pictured above, Heady Topper clone). My draft tower has only a single faucet, so it'll be a couple weeks. Although, I do have spare kegs, another CO2 tank/regulator and my chest freezer if I get ansy! Currently propagating yeast through stepped starters to build up my reserves in anticipation. Ive been brewing since November and considering the financial input, I think I'm pretty well committed to the hobby (obsession...) at this point .

I hope to stick around, life permitting (11 month old likes to challenge my planned free time). Its so refreshing to experience a community that is selflessly dedicated to helping one another.

 

[Jag75]

If you have kegs you have co2. I use bags when dry hopping. I push co2 into my fv as I open the top to drop the hops in. Never have issues with clogged equipment or oxidation. Imo dry hopping 3-5 days before packaging gives me the best hop characters.

 

[Apmarand]

If you have kegs you have co2. I use bags when dry hopping. I push co2 into my fv as I open the top to drop the hops in. Never have issues with clogged equipment or oxidation. Imo dry hopping 3-5 days before packaging gives me the best hop characters.

I hadn’t thought of pushing CO2 from the top while dry-hopping, clever! My experience has been similar with bags are far as success with packaging, but I never seem to get the same level of perceived hops. It’s totally anecdotal, but enough for me to throw them in raw dog. I should mention that I had only tried muslin bags up to this point. Perhaps mesh bags allow more contact? For future racking, I’m going to try attaching a DYI SS mesh filter around the racking arm with a worm clamp. We’ll see how that goes. Otherwise, could be back to bags... Thanks for the reply and great suggestions!

 

[deuc224]

Can I interpret this as only the FO hops?! From what I've read, seems that the dry hop charges during active fermentation is what makes this style unique. Correct me if I am wrong, but I think dry-hopping at 2-5oz/gal has become pretty standard for NEIPAs at commercial breweries.

I have no idea what FO hops are, but I make a hop tea with all the flavoring hops and hops that are bitter to tame the sweetness. Only because I hate hops floating all over the place lol.

 

[Apmarand]

I have no idea what FO hops are, but I make a hop tea with all the flavoring hops and hops that are bitter to tame the sweetness. Only because I hate hops floating all over the place lol.

FO = flame out. I think some people call these additions hop stand. Edit* hop stand and flame out are not the same. Apparently flame out are hop additions as the flame is cut, while hop stand, similar to whirlpool, is a specific temperature/duration post boil (20 min at 170F).

I hadn’t heard of doing a hop tea. Is this literally adding hops to hot water and adding to the beer at some point?

 

[BadMedicine]

Did you brew this yet? If so how did it turn out?

 

[Apmarand]

Did you brew this yet? If so how did it turn out?

Its on the docket for this Saturday. I’ll post an update ASAP.

 

[deuc224]

FO = flame out. I think some people call these additions hop stand. Edit* hop stand and flame out are not the same. Apparently flame out are hop additions as the flame is cut, while hop stand, similar to whirlpool, is a specific temperature/duration post boil (20 min at 170F).

I hadn’t heard of doing a hop tea. Is this literally adding hops to hot water and adding to the beer at some point?

Yes, I add it at kegging.

 

[Apmarand]

So I brewed this beer 11 days ago. It’s an absolute home run, exceeding my wildest expectations. I made a few modifications to the recipe above:

1. Added 4 oz of honey malt to the grain bill
2. Cut the second dry hop charge in half with the intention of adding to the serving keg (I’ve had success doing this with previous batches). Ended up scratching the keg dry hop.

The aroma is intense, unbelievably fruity with some mild dankness. I got a little more attenuation than I intended (OG was spot on, 1.068, FG stable after 5 days at 1.010). But the water additions worked amazingly, a full mouth feel. Mash dropped 2 degrees (F) over the hour, finishing at 150. I should mention that the infusion volume was too high for my system by a full gallon. I ended up boiling for an extra hour to get to my target post boil volume. A total of 6 gallons made it into the FV. The gravity samples tasted dry, but that disappeared after two days of diacyl rest. I’m blown away by this beer. Could be brewer bias, but I have no qualms stating that this is the best beer I’ve ever tasted. I got a full 5 gallons into the keg (closed transfer), and did a two day cold crash using a mylar balloon full of CO2 to avoid oxygen ingress. I’m brewing it again this weekend, I (dangerously) can’t get enough of it. The wife and progeny are out of town for the week, the temptation to go all out on this beer is strong!

Definitely recommend. Thanks again for all of your suggestions. I could not be more pleased. I was impatient and only got 16 hours of burst carbonation in before I took a photo.

 

[deuc224]

I didnt think the honey malt was gonna make a difference when i did min but it really does give it another level of complexity. Nice beer man.